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Air Corps Availability

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,220 ✭✭✭cameramonkey


    roadmaster wrote: »
    i was listening to the former head of EU customs on the radio this morning and he was saving that for commercial vehicles you would have designated routes for them to cross the border . You are not going to be able to man all crossings and ensure trucks are not going through the unmanned ones.

    Aerial observation would come in handy to help enforce this so could we see finner camps runway reopened and cessnas based there for border patrols. But are the Cessnas even flying anymore and would there be enough crews to carry out patrols. It would be a while before the 3 PC12's are in place and i would imagine the cessnas would be a lot cheaper to run for this type of work


    saw a 172 flying out of Casement Wednesday.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    roadmaster wrote: »
    i was listening to the former head of EU customs on the radio this morning and he was saving that for commercial vehicles you would have designated routes for them to cross the border . You are not going to be able to man all crossings and ensure trucks are not going through the unmanned ones.

    Aerial observation would come in handy to help enforce this so could we see finner camps runway reopened and cessnas based there for border patrols. But are the Cessnas even flying anymore and would there be enough crews to carry out patrols. It would be a while before the 3 PC12's are in place and i would imagine the cessnas would be a lot cheaper to run for this type of work

    The majority have been stripped, I heard ROMEO203 the other day, I would guess maybe 1 or 2 at max of the Rocket fleet is still flying.

    One PC12 is scheduled for delivery this year I believe.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    roadmaster wrote: »
    is that aircraft just for patient transfer or is it available for anything as so directed by the government

    Im not 100% but they did have a 139 on 24/7 standby at Bal for Inter-Hospital transfers.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    Check this out, seems only ROMEO203/205/208 are left?

    http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=82957


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Psychlops wrote: »
    Check this out, seems only ROMEO203/205/208 are left?

    http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=82957


    Wonder have the others been used for parts to keep those in the air?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    Dont forget the Garda Defender is active for surveillance work, just because the PC 12 s are not available yet.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Stovepipe wrote: »
    Dont forget the Garda Defender is active for surveillance work, just because the PC 12 s are not available yet.

    Is it not parked up as well?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭Negative_G


    Stovepipe wrote: »
    Dont forget the Garda Defender is active for surveillance work, just because the PC 12 s are not available yet.

    Are the Dept of justice purchasing a PC-12? Perhaps you could enlighten us more?

    For the record, your post seems to suggest that the Defender is only still in service due to the lack of PC-12s. The PC-12 contract is completely separate from any potential Garda FW replacement aircraft.

    While there was an option of a fourth "green aircraft" for the DoJ in the tender, this has not been publicly accepted. So perhaps you have other information, otherwise I struggle to see what your point is.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Negative_G wrote: »
    Are the Dept of justice purchasing a PC-12? Perhaps you could enlighten us more?
    I think as part of the tender, there's an option that the DoJ could buy a fourth one, but I don't think there's been any sign of that yet? But given that we've a few more years for the last of the AC ones there might still be time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭Negative_G


    sparky42 wrote: »
    I think as part of the tender, there's an option that the DoJ could buy a fourth one, but I don't think there's been any sign of that yet? But given that we've a few more years for the last of the AC ones there might still be time.

    Correct.

    I am just struggling to see the relevance of Stovepipes post to be honest.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    I see on on air corps Facebook page 112 had 9 missions in 7 days. The 139 fleet must be starting to clock up big hours due to ems alone


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    roadmaster wrote: »
    Is it not parked up as well?

    No. Flew right over my house a day ago......it's the only AC aircraft with a surveillance kit fitted and will stay that way until the PC-12s arrive. I have no idea if one of them will be given over to Garda use, but, as the Defender has had a very poor serviceability record, it may well be the case that a PC-12 will take over from it. I have heard from users that it is not liked and it would happily be shunted aside. The Cessnas are essentially on borrowed time, too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭Negative_G


    Stovepipe wrote: »
    No. Flew right over my house a day ago......it's the only AC aircraft with a surveillance kit fitted and will stay that way until the PC-12s arrive. I have no idea if one of them will be given over to Garda use, but, as the Defender has had a very poor serviceability record, it may well be the case that a PC-12 will take over from it. I have heard from users that it is not liked and it would happily be shunted aside. The Cessnas are essentially on borrowed time, too.

    Unless the Gardai purchase their own aircraft, a PC-12 won't be "given over" to the ASU. If they want to request its use ad-hoc then they can do that in line with ATCP agreements.

    The tender allows for the Gardai to piggyback on the PC-12 order which makes complete sense for a multitude of reasons. As of yet there has been no public decision about it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    They could well order a Garda PC-12, provided the DoJ was prepared to cough up to buy it and maintain it. Right now, availability of personnel is more critical than airframes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    As per the article below the air corps are pulling back on some off the 112 service, Will we see the government farm this service out to someone like CHC?

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/air-ambulance-service-scaled-back-due-to-pilot-shortage-1.4084496?mode=amp0


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    roadmaster wrote: »
    As per the article below the air corps are pulling back on some off the 112 service, Will we see the government farm this service out to someone like CHC?

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/air-ambulance-service-scaled-back-due-to-pilot-shortage-1.4084496?mode=amp0


    ICRR & IRCG are now filling the days that the EAS is not available.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Psychlops wrote: »
    ICRR & IRCG are now filling the days that the EAS is not available.

    I mean long term. It would be easyier for the government to sign a cheque to a private company rather then have a state service


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,691 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    I never heard anything as pathetic as Paul Kehoe's snivelling diatribe on Radio1 at lunchtime. Its simply risible that an defence force air component cannot provide ONE serviceable aircraft on station at all times.

    But anyway, as we are here, it is past time to remove the Air Corps role in the civilian medical response function. The airborne rescue and medical airlift capability on land and in the maritime area of responsibility should be provided fully by civilian services and contractors. They should all be 24/7 capable aircraft and crews with a top drawer service level agreement put in place by the health and transport and marine authorities, subject to rigorous performance standards and contract review.

    Let the Air Corps focus solely on being the air transport, patrol and interception arm of the military.

    While I think of it, the Ministerial Air Transport Service, fixed wing and rotary, should be a separate civilian contract also.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    I never heard anything as pathetic as Paul Kehoe's snivelling diatribe on Radio1 at lunchtime. Its simply risible that an defence force air component cannot provide ONE serviceable aircraft on station at all times.

    But anyway, as we are here, it is past time to remove the Air Corps role in the civilian medical response function. The airborne rescue and medical airlift capability on land and in the maritime area of responsibility should be provided fully by civilian services and contractors. They should all be 24/7 capable aircraft and crews with a top drawer service level agreement put in place by the health and transport and marine authorities, subject to rigorous performance standards and contract review.

    Let the Air Corps focus solely on being the air transport, patrol and interception arm of the military.

    While I think of it, the Ministerial Air Transport Service, fixed wing and rotary, should be a separate civilian contract also.

    That was one bad interview, he comes a across as the most incompetent clown that knows nothing. You would wonder how he kept getting re-elected in Wexford he must be some man for filling potholes and getting grants


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    This happened with the SAR role. now we fork out 50m a year to rent 5 helis and have a private company fly the job for the Irish Coast Guard. with some ex aircorps personnel working there too.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    Morpheus wrote: »
    This happened with the SAR role. now we fork out 50m a year to rent 5 helis and have a private company fly the job for the Irish Coast Guard. with some ex aircorps personnel working there too.


    And a fine job they are doing also.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,271 ✭✭✭Elemonator


    Coming from a family with a few military members, it honestly breaks my heart to hear the conditions that Irish Defence Forces staff work under today. The way the forces are treated by the Government is nothing short of negligent. These are the people who willingly put their lives on the line should be ever be called to do so, and receive such a dismissive attitude in return.

    In terms of equipment availability, that is risible as a previous poster said. There are countries out there with far less money than Ireland who have so much more equipment capability. I'll ask yous, do you think there will ever be change?


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,905 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Not as long as this inept shower of individuals are allowed to run the country the same way.
    Just think what the 1.8+m that has been wasted on a printer that doesn't yet function could have done for a charity like the ICRR.

    They are just about keeping their head above water while providing lifesaving medical work.
    Its galling how poorly the DF have been treated, not just one branch but all of them, its really shameful tbh.
    Look at New Zealand a country with a similar size population and compare the DF here to NZ, when major events like the Earthquake happened who was on hand to provide emergency medical assistance, Evac and humanitarian work?
    The Navy and Air force stepped in along with other countries like Canada and the US.
    We had major flooding in Donegal and there wasn't a hint of a response from the DF I am not blaming them but the ineptitude of the government in being able to manage major situations like roads being washed away or similar.

    The purpose of the DF is to assist civilian power in the event of a major problem, we don't have anyone in power that can even conceive of such a function for the DF and its worrying because the longer this state of affairs goes on the more of a brain drain there will be, we have already IMHO passed that point in the Naval service.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,490 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    My impression is that there are very few votes to be gained from politicians taking any interest in defence.


    The minister is no longer a senior cabinet role, the number of personnel and particularly barracks have declined greatly so many constituencies do not have any military connections and health is blowing through its budgets annually, we are also going to have huge problem supporting an ageing population in the next 30/50 years.

    Currently the government is taking in large amounts of revenue ahead of their targets, the fun will really begin when this starts to decline.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,490 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    Psychlops wrote: »
    ICRR & IRCG are now filling the days that the EAS is not available.

    ICRR is about to need a bucket of cash itself.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/harris-tells-hse-to-save-air-ambulance-after-funds-run-out-974596.html

    Are we about to put cash into a new service whilst cutting the heli service that we already had?

    How the hell did we end up here then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    I see the community air ambulance is grounded now due to funding. They where covering 112 on the last Friday of the month from Roscommon , Has 112 got back to full strength or is there now a gap?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    roadmaster wrote: »
    I see the community air ambulance is grounded now due to funding. They where covering 112 on the last Friday of the month from Roscommon , Has 112 got back to full strength or is there now a gap?




    AC112 was active over the weekends and ive heard them on ATC every day so far.


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