Ever think you'll own your own place?

eviltwin · 03-04-2017 10:27am

LirW wrote: »

I fully agree, can't wrap my head around though why it's used as a synonym for "Omg all those blokes in D13 are on the dole anyway, who in their right mind would buy there?" Don't wanna dismiss that there are problematic parts in town but there is definitely some snobbery going on.

Also, heard on the radio yesterday that Celtic Tiger prices are expected to be back in 3 years from now. :pac:

Completely agree. I've friends who say they can't afford to buy a house when to be more accurate they can't afford the type of house they want. Another friend recently was forced, in his words, to buy a house in a rural area. He could have afforded Dublin but wanted a four bed detached with a massive garden. Definitely couldn't have bought similar in Dublin but a more modest house wasn't what he wanted. Now he's commuting and hardly ever gets to enjoy the home he bought. Property snobbery still exists.

jester77 · 03-04-2017 10:29am

BlinkingLights wrote: »

I think I'll probably just emigrate to the continent as soon as I can find a decent job there (I'm actively looking at the moment). The cost of housing here and the quality of what you get are just dire compared to a lot of Northern Europe.

I can rent in quite a few countries on an on-going basis more like a commercial lease - it's a viable prospect for the rest of my days, whereas in Ireland if I can't buy I'm basically condemned to dealing with crumby landlords, bad furniture, bad decor, poor quality, no stability of lease and being able to be turfed out.

Renting here was always seen as some kind of temporary situation for those who were just not buying yet. It's become a permanent thing for many of us now and the structures (legal framework, supply of quality homes, inspection regime, etc etc) are not in place to make it work.

I don't really want to live in the middle of nowhere (where I could afford a house) and I don't want to live in a hovel or share in my 30s in Dublin, Cork etc. So, my options are looking more like Germany now.

I think you will be in for a shock. Any of the big cities in Germany will be more expensive over all in terms of housing than Dublin when you take everything into account. You won't find a suitable family house in Hamburg for under 400k, anything you would find will require a lot of work. You are realistically looking at 500k, plus over here you pay property tax and water, and most of the bills and insurances associated with a house are higher than Ireland.

Gunslinger92 · 03-04-2017 10:29am

PARlance wrote: »

Nobody is forcing you to leave Dublin. Just don't expect a house of your own there until you move up the salary scale and settle down with a (good salaried) partner.

At 25, I would say just enjoy Dublin life. You've plenty of time and options. It can kinda bug people when they hear people wanting it all when it's not really realistic.

Ah yeah, I know

not stressing about it at all, I'm way too young to be thinking about mortgages and such adult-y things

Jodotman · 03-04-2017 10:31am

Yep on 35k(5k less than dublin) and recently bought a house for 110k. Moved out of Dublin for a 5k pat decrease but should be back up to in a year or two. Good bonuses as well.

Why I moved out of dublin.

Hour to get to work with buses and luas as work had no parking. Now an 8 min drive to work where I can actually park.

Cost of renting. Paying 500 for a room, kindly f off.

Expensive, pints food and everything is was more expensive.

If I ever want to go to something in the 3 arena a viva I'm only an hour and 15 mins away

LirW · 03-04-2017 10:33am

If you feel forced to move out, you're not going to enjoy this lifestyle. If you're not aware of what that means you're going to be miserable. Moving out has to be an option that needs to be carefully considered if you can be happy with it. No point in buying a mansion if you're not happy with the surroundings in general. Some people like that, some people don't. Alternatively, there is a good variety of relatively well priced houses in D15 if you like the area. (I don't, I looked into D15 for a while and realised it's unfortunately not for me because I have estate phobia.)

andekwarhola · 03-04-2017 10:34am

It's all very well saying move out of Dublin but there's employment to consider. Not much fun relocating your family, losing your job and having to find work again with most of the jobs in Dublin.

There's still a fair bit of property in and around Dublin for 300k. A lot of people need to understand that they're not the only ones that feel they're entitled to live in XY location which means higher prices there and to recalibrate their expectations in line with their income if they wish to stay in Dublin.

Seanachai · 03-04-2017 10:37am

LirW wrote: »

Good that you brought that up because I genuinely want to know how working class is defined nowadays? I know a lot of people would avoid the postcodes you mentioned. Personally I do not understand that because for example in D11 there are so many parts that are perfectly fine.

We were looking into buying in D11, prices unfortunately overtook what we're willing to spend so we decided to look outside. And believe me, convincing a Dub who grew up in the wonderful entitled parts of D9 to move outside... tough bit of work here.

Have to say though, we're not the classic couple with the routine of education, work, wedding, mortgage, family so getting a mortgage in the first place is a good bit of work.

Working class isn't necessarily linked to income, you could be a cash-rich trades-person and still be working class. The difference between working class and middle class is more about education level, financial and social mobility and family connections etc. In relation to people harking for certain areas, I can understand this to a degree. You want the place where you're going to live to be aesthetically pleasing and some people have more of vision of what that entails, whereas others (usually fellas) are a lot more laid back in that regard.

Laois_Man · 03-04-2017 10:41am

**Rant Alert**

I watched with a mixture of amusement and frustration over the weekend, the news reports about the daft.ie report saying average house prices have risen 4.3% in the first quarter of 2017.

There's a similar report from MyHome.ie today

They're liars. They're telling outright bare-faced lies. I have been watching the property market like a hawk for the last 9 years. Not in Dublin, but close to Dublin (Meath), where I would like to sell a house I own. And they're telling bare faced lies. Daft.ie and MyHome.ie should not be the bodies that publish these reports. They have a vested interest in driving prices up and getting sellers like me, who are biding their time waiting for these increases, out onto the market. You might suspect that their stats presented as a nationwide average are heavily scewed by the disproportionate increase of prices in Dublin - but no - when you go into their full report and look at the county-by-county breakdown and see their report stating that prices in Meath have increased 61% since the lowest point of the crash, they're absolutely lying!

These reports need to be compiled by a body without this vested interest and who analyse actual sale price data (available on the property prices register), not asking prices data which is all that Daft.ie and Myhome.ie have access to. There's a big difference and they're not even reporting increases in asking prices honestly for that matter.

Seanachai · 03-04-2017 10:41am

LirW wrote: »

If you feel forced to move out, you're not going to enjoy this lifestyle. If you're not aware of what that means you're going to be miserable. Moving out has to be an option that needs to be carefully considered if you can be happy with it. No point in buying a mansion if you're not happy with the surroundings in general. Some people like that, some people don't. Alternatively, there is a good variety of relatively well priced houses in D15 if you like the area. (I don't, I looked into D15 for a while and realised it's unfortunately not for me because I have estate phobia.)

'Estate phobia', I must have that too lol, maybe that explains the slightly posh/eccentric people you find in estates, they compromised and moved there, but have never made peace with it. Nothing against people that live in estates but I couldn't do it either, I'd sooner live in a shabby flat in an old terrace than an estate.

slovakchick · 03-04-2017 10:43am

Its 3.5

tomwaterford wrote: »

Not a hope....toyed with the idea/dream of building a house.....but would never get a mortgage (well 2.5 times my income wouldn't build a house)

All this is based on the presumption I'll never win the lotto

Mars Bar · 03-04-2017 10:43am

Seanachai wrote: »

'Estate phobia', I must have that too lol, maybe that explains the slightly posh/eccentric people you find in estates, they compromised and moved there, but have never made peace with it. Nothing against people that live in estates but I couldn't do it either, I'd sooner live in a shabby flat in an old terrace than an estate.

It's the pokey excuse for a garden in those new estates that kill me

Ardennes1944 · 03-04-2017 10:44am

Here in Switzerland a decent somewhat modern house will cost more than 1 million, more if you want to be very close to Basel, Zurich etc.

Average wage here is about 90k, but even so, mortgages are passed on throughout generations as they're so huge.

I'm looking to save as much as I can here and then move somewhere cheaper in Europe to buy a house

LirW · 03-04-2017 10:47am

Seanachai wrote: »

'Estate phobia', I must have that too lol, maybe that explains the slightly posh/eccentric people you find in estates, they compromised and moved there, but have never made peace with it. Nothing against people that live in estates but I couldn't do it either, I'd sooner live in a shabby flat in an old terrace than an estate.

I come from the continent and in my country estates don't exist. I mean we have newbuilds but the first time I was confronted with estates was when I moved here to Ireland. I personally find them a bit depressing and very american (was the first thing that came to my mind).
Also since I worked in a very similar trade, the building quality of some of them would be topped by Lego.
Just not my cup of tea, wouldn't sleep in the car for 4 nights to put a deposit down. :pac:

Seanachai · 03-04-2017 10:49am

Mars Bar wrote: »

It's the pokey excuse for a garden in those new estates that kill me

Needs must, you're talking about pretty condensed living where space is at a premium, I like the older estates in Crumlin and Kimmage though. If you want a decent sized garden it's either find a way to buy a premium level property or move out to the sticks. I'd say the gardens in the new batch of houses being built will be pretty 'compact' too.

jcd5971 · 03-04-2017 10:58am

Akrasia wrote:

Bought a 3 bed semi in a nice part of Ennis with a nice big south facing garden for 84k last year.

This is common sense, ennis is a lovely town as well, nicer than alot of cities out there( mention this not to insult other places but to highlight it's not cheap because it's located in some hole.)

Having moved around alot of the country in the last 15odd years working, I have to say that alot of people in Dublin are blinded to living away from it, the fact of the matter is that public transport, social scene, leisure and restraunts etc, are common in most big towns in the rest of the country.

People have it in their heads that there are only 2 options live in Dublin or live in some boreen with no roads or civilisation in the rural mountains of kerry or leitrim (overstating a stereotype they are both lovely counties) and this idea is what's driving prices so high.

pilly · 03-04-2017 11:01am

The people I feel for most at the moment are single people who may intend to stay single for a while yet.

Very few options apart from houseshares

Seanachai · 03-04-2017 11:05am

LirW wrote: »

I come from the continent and in my country estates don't exist. I mean we have newbuilds but the first time I was confronted with estates was when I moved here to Ireland. I personally find them a bit depressing and very american (was the first thing that came to my mind).
Also since I worked in a very similar trade, the building quality of some of them would be topped by Lego.
Just not my cup of tea, wouldn't sleep in the car for 4 nights to put a deposit down. :pac:

There are certain urban areas in Ireland that do look like suburban America, more so when the sun is shining

. Even some rural clusters of housing have an American look, as a lot of the builders in the 70's & 80's took the designs straight out of books like 'bungalow bliss'. The laws in relation to to planning are a lot stricter in the UK and on the continent, rural dwellers tend to live in villages with a historic look. You could drive down a leafy lane here and think you're in Seattle.

Seanachai · 03-04-2017 11:09am

pilly wrote: »

The people I feel for most at the moment are single people who may intend to stay single for a while yet.

Very few options apart from houseshares

At least we have our 'crying chairs'

languagenerd · 03-04-2017 11:11am

Mid-20s, not great wages atm, working in a v Dublin-centric career area... So unless I accidentally meet a partner who turns out to be on a high salary, I can't imagine ever getting a mortgage.

jcd5971 wrote: »

People have it in their heads that there are only 2 options live in Dublin or live in some boreen with no roads or civilisation in the rural mountains of kerry or leitrim (overstating a stereotype they are both lovely counties) and this idea is what's driving prices so high.

But there are many sectors where the vast majority of the jobs are in Dublin. Not much point moving to another town or city just to be unemployed...

Glenster · 03-04-2017 11:12am

Grayson wrote: »

I'm not sure where you think someone on 35k could save 35k in 3 years.

35K and 25K = 60K

net income of approx. 4300.

rent here http://www.daft.ie/dublin/apartments-for-rent/swords/holywell-way-swords-dublin-1726932/

2000 discretionary for the month, save a grand a month. 1K*36=36K

or don't do that and rent forever.....

BlinkingLights · 03-04-2017 11:13am

Seanachai wrote: »

There are certain urban areas in Ireland that do look like suburban America, more so when the sun is shining . Even some rural clusters of housing have an American look, as a lot of the builders in the 70's & 80's took the designs straight out of books like 'bungalow bliss'. The laws in relation to to planning are a lot stricter in the UK and on the continent, rural dwellers tend to live in villages with a historic look. You could drive down a leafy lane here and think you're in Seattle.

That could also be down to the fact that the anglophone countries tend to share a similar architectural heritage that stems from them all having been interconnected historically, linguistically and culturally - there's a hell of a lot of crossover between Ireland and the US, Canada, Australia and even NZ.

Irish suburbs don't look totally unlike Canada, parts of Australia (except the weather and the deadly insects), and can be really like New Zealand.
Also, there are similarities between US, IRL, UK, NZ, CA and aspects of certain nordic suburban settings too. I didn't find a whole load of difference between scattered one-off low density suburban homes in Cork and Reykjavik for example. and even parts of Norway.

France is more village orientated in rural areas, so's Germany and Spain's all high rise apartments and can sometimes look more like Miami or San Diego than a lot of Europe.

A lot of new-build one off stuff in Ireland definitely has more of a scandi-look than a US look though. There's a lot of use of glass and metal and stuff on some of the more architect-style stuff here.
It's the bungalow-blitz stuff and some of the McMansions that have that US vibe to them.

It makes absolute sense though when you think of it. Why would Irish homes follow a continental European pattern when we have had relatively much more contact with North America ?

03-04-2017 11:14am

Elessar wrote: »

...............There's obviously a significant number of people who can. But if you haven't bought yet, particularly if you're in Dublin, do you reckon you will be able to?

Can't understand how folks can buy in Dublin for the mostpart.
you'd need €150k household income or serious present from Mom and Dawdy to buy a Dublin house in many areas.

biko · 03-04-2017 11:16am

Don't get me started on London prices. You guys in the colonies have it good compared.

slovakchick · 03-04-2017 11:16am

Interesting-hey bank manger guy my children will pay my mortgage i promise ðŸ˜‰

Ardennes1944 wrote: »

Here in Switzerland a decent somewhat modern house will cost more than 1 million, more if you want to be very close to Basel, Zurich etc.

Average wage here is about 90k, but even so, mortgages are passed on throughout generations as they're so huge.

I'm looking to save as much as I can here and then move somewhere cheaper in Europe to buy a house

BlinkingLights · 03-04-2017 11:17am

biko wrote: »

Don't get me started on London prices. You guys in the colonies have it good compared.

The Tories will solve that though by destroying the UK economy.
Give it a few years and you'll be able to buy a London property at a much more reasonable price.

messy tessy · 03-04-2017 11:20am

pilly wrote: »

The people I feel for most at the moment are single people who may intend to stay single for a while yet.

Very few options apart from houseshares

Sure we can always move in with the parents...

No need to feel sorry for me, I am minted!

03-04-2017 11:22am

pilly wrote: »

The people I feel for most at the moment are single people who may intend to stay single for a while yet.

Very few options apart from houseshares

Plenty apartments in various parts of Kildare....... train to work etc.
You still need a semi decent salary though............ white van man / hairdresser / barperson who is single probably can't buy anywhere.

03-04-2017 11:22am

Pac1Man wrote: »

'Tis 3.5 times.

Did I just make this dream come true?!

More like 4.5 times your income in the unspoken reality after the banks have done their "exceptions". The mortgage market in 2017 is the wild west, compliments of the deliberate policy of this bubble-pushing Fianna Fáil-sponsored Fine Gael government.

It will take the print media, with their conflicts of interest in the form of their lucrative property supplements, some time to highlight what's really happening.

03-04-2017 11:26am

Glenster wrote: »

...........

if you're willing to live on the north side you can get a decent 3 bed for 350.

you could swing that on salaries of 35 and 25k, assuming you don't have massive debts.

the deposit is a matter of saving for two/three years.

A 300k mortgage over 30 years is probably about €1500/month .......... that aside I don't think a €60k income can borrow €300k, not to mind a €60k combined income.

How much deposit are you reckoning they'd need to make this €350k house a fit to the "you could swing that on salaries of 35 and 25k" comment?

Zulu · 03-04-2017 11:28am

I have to say, I do wonder where the money is coming from for these houses over 600K.

Ever think you'll own your own place?

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