The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

thomond2006 · 16-09-2019 9:47am

Miami now go to Dallas and host the Chargers before a Week 5 bye.

Difficult to see them winning either. The Dallas trip could be a 40-50 pointer.

Their run-in is where they could pick up one or two wins:

@ NYJ
@ NYG
Vs CIN
@ NE (Week 17 - NE might play the U16s in that one!)

Christy42 · 16-09-2019 10:01am

thomond2006 wrote: »

Miami now go to Dallas and host the Chargers before a Week 5 bye.

Difficult to see them winning either. The Dallas trip could be a 40-50 pointer.

Their run-in is where they could pick up one or two wins:

@ NYJ
@ NYG
Vs CIN
@ NE (Week 17 - NE might play the U16s in that one!)

I struggle to see them picking up wins even there. Even vs the NE U16s, especially in New England. I really think they are several levels below anything the NFL has seen in a while.

Any game with <30 points against should be considered a win for them.

Look at players for both sides. The likes of Barklay, Engram, Adams, Bell, Green, Mixon whichever starting Pat's needs some gametime.

Dolphins have Xavier Howard. End of list.

raze_them_all_ · 16-09-2019 1:29pm

Dolphins are diving so deep they should be called whales

Adamcp898 · 16-09-2019 2:18pm

Surely there’s some kind of by-law to penalise them for failing to field a competitive side? There is in most sports.

jack presley · 16-09-2019 3:01pm

Adamcp898 wrote: »

Surely there’s some kind of by-law to penalise them for failing to field a competitive side? There is in most sports.

You should check out MLB if you think fielding an uncompetitive side is an issue for the NFL. It’s an issue too in the NBA I think although I don’t follow that league too closely.

But it’s a real tactic in baseball and in Chicago Cubs and Houston Astros, it has been rewarded with Championships.

Christy42 · 16-09-2019 3:49pm

jack presley wrote: »

You should check out MLB if you think fielding an uncompetitive side is an issue for the NFL. It’s an issue too in the NBA I think although I don’t follow that league too closely.

But it’s a real tactic in baseball and in Chicago Cubs and Houston Astros, it has been rewarded with Championships.

Should it be a real issue? I mean it can't happen in a lot of sports because the team would just get relegated and simply forgotten about.

However the Dolphins losing by 30+ for the season can't be great for the NFL.

Doogs27 · 16-09-2019 4:10pm

Christy42 wrote: »

Should it be a real issue? I mean it can't happen in a lot of sports because the team would just get relegated and simply forgotten about.

However the Dolphins losing by 30+ for the season can't be great for the NFL.

I can understand tanking for a generational talent in basketball like LeBron, maybe Zion - remains to be seen.

But take this dolphins tank, are they going for Tua? Is he generational? will someone emerge like Barkley during the college season etc? KC didn't tank and still ended up with someone who will change the face of their franchise if he remains healthy.

If we look at the Giants, Barkley is already top tier RB in the league but he could go ten years without ever having a good team built around him. Tanking properly in the NFL probably takes multiple years and leaves scars for fan bases in the process. And what are the guarantees that you'll be good after tanking....who knows, not really ... .. I guess we'll know a little more after tonight's game.

Christy42 · 16-09-2019 4:39pm

Doogs27 wrote: »

I can understand tanking for a generational talent in basketball like LeBron, maybe Zion - remains to be seen.

But take this dolphins tank, are they going for Tua? Is he generational? will someone emerge like Barkley during the college season etc? KC didn't tank and still ended up with someone who will change the face of their franchise if he remains healthy.

If we look at the Giants, Barkley is already top tier RB in the league but he could go ten years without ever having a good team built around him. Tanking properly in the NFL probably takes multiple years and leaves scars for fan bases in the process. And what are the guarantees that you'll be good after tanking....who knows, not really ... .. I guess we'll know a little more after tonight's game.

I mean if you can convince the Dolphins of that then fine. However they are going for it whether or not it will help. This just makes for dumb matches in the NFL.

Indeed from their point of view what was the alternative? More years of mediocrity?

I mean how much of the Mahomes pick was luck and how much was skill (drafting and coaching- something which is far too undervalued in the NFL). I haven't seen anything that had Mahomes as the best in that draft class before the draft. The Chiefs obviously rated him higher given most had him 3/4th QB off the board and they took him as the 2nd. Would they have taken him over Mitch?

2smiggy · 16-09-2019 4:45pm

jack presley wrote: »

You should check out MLB if you think fielding an uncompetitive side is an issue for the NFL. It’s an issue too in the NBA I think although I don’t follow that league too closely.

But it’s a real tactic in baseball and in Chicago Cubs and Houston Astros, it has been rewarded with Championships.

rife in basketball too. the 76'ers blatantly did it for 4/5 years , and are now one of the favourites for the upcoming NBA season after tanking for years. FFS even their own player were saying trust 'the process'

details here

OOnegative · 16-09-2019 4:51pm

Big Ben out for season for Steelers.

Itssoeasy · 16-09-2019 5:46pm

So drew Brees won’t play for at least six weeks. Big Ben is done for the year, and Eli Manning May have one foot out of the starting QB in New York.

Itssoeasy · 16-09-2019 5:52pm

Also any word on James Connor for the Steelers ?

el Fenomeno · 16-09-2019 6:04pm

Wonder if that's the last we see of Roethlisberger?

The_Honeybadger · 16-09-2019 6:13pm

el Fenomeno wrote: »

Wonder if that's the last we see of Roethlisberger?

Would not surprise me at all if he doesn’t make it back.

gstack166 · 16-09-2019 6:19pm

2smiggy wrote: »

rife in basketball too. the 76'ers blatantly did it for 4/5 years , and are now one of the favourites for the upcoming NBA season after tanking for years. FFS even their own player were saying trust 'the process'

details here

That was the final straw. They’ve changed the draft system since. New York Knicks had the worst NBA record by far this year & only got the 3rd puck due to the lottery system. New Orleans had the 5/6th worst record or there abouts and received the 1st overall pick.

2smiggy · 17-09-2019 2:51am

Stayed up and watched the first half of MNF, possibly the worst NFL game I have seen. The Jets are down to their 3rd choice QB after a nasty looking injury to Simien. Browns don't look much better. Bed is a better option I think!!

cosatron · 17-09-2019 10:21am

two weeks in and 4 qb's down, 2 done for the season. I say the saints are sick to the teeth of the rams at this stage.

Jolly Red Giant · 17-09-2019 12:46pm

Hococop wrote: »

I'd love to take Minkah Fitzpatrick off them, would really help our secondary (eagles)

Gone to Steelers for a first rounder

The_Honeybadger · 17-09-2019 12:49pm

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Also any word on James Connor for the Steelers ?

Bruising only and will play Sunday.

Foxtrol · 17-09-2019 1:42pm

Even though I'm a big fan of Fitzpatrick, I feel that the trade by the Steelers could come back to hurt them down the line. I would hope they are extremely confident that Rudolph is the guy to take over from Ben, otherwise they've likely given up a top 10 or even top 5 draft pick in a year that will likely have a number of very promising QBs. With Connor looking like he is made of glass, if Rudolph doesn't perform their season could continue to go down hill very quickly.

The_Honeybadger · 17-09-2019 2:01pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

Even though I'm a big fan of Fitzpatrick, I feel that the trade by the Steelers could come back to hurt them down the line. I would hope they are extremely confident that Rudolph is the guy to take over from Ben, otherwise they've likely given up a top 10 or even top 5 draft pick in a year that will likely have a number of very promising QBs. With Connor looking like he is made of glass, if Rudolph doesn't perform their season could continue to go down hill very quickly.

I’d agree. It’s exceptionally risky. If Rudolph bombs they may have given up the golden ticket, they must strongly believe he is going to be good.

They really need the D to step up and get some stops now. The DC Keith Butler has been under fire for years but he can’t have any excuses any more with all the resources gone in there.

All you can ask of Rudolph for this season is to be a game manager in a more balanced offence. Ben wanted to throw on every single down and it was becoming predictable and leading to turnovers. They need Conner healthy like you say, he can’t seem to finish a game let alone stay healthy for a stretch.

Shedite27 · 17-09-2019 2:02pm

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

Gone to Steelers for a first rounder

I understand trading the old players for 1st round draft choices (any not on rookie contracts), but he's only a second year player, and a good one at that. Surely you need to keep players like that around. They now need to pick a Safety next year, and will be lucky to get one as good as him.

Foxtrol · 17-09-2019 2:22pm

Shedite27 wrote: »

I understand trading the old players for 1st round draft choices (any not on rookie contracts), but he's only a second year player, and a good one at that. Surely you need to keep players like that around. They now need to pick a Safety next year, and will be lucky to get one as good as him.

It depends how tanking you want to go. If they're planning for 2 years of being absolutely terrible and another of being middle of the road then if they choose to keep him they'd be looking at the end of his contract at that point. After 1 game in he was complaining about what he was asked to do so it is unlikely he would stay quiet for 3 years on a terrible roster and end up sitting out or demanding a trade, which would likely mean the Dolphins might not get the same return for him. Similarly, on a terrible team, he'll likely get beating badly on a regular basis, so again his value is never going to be as high as right now.

It isn't like they're giving him away for nothing, this is trending towards being a prime pick. With the number of good QBs likely available in the next, the Dolphins may have 2 picks in the top 5/10 which they could turn into even more picks. It's a gamble from their side but that is what aggressive tanking is

Lionbacker · 17-09-2019 7:56pm

Meanwhile, back in Miami:

https://twitter.com/Iamxavienhoward/status/1173783845403078656

Itssoeasy · 17-09-2019 8:00pm

So just so I'm up to date. Since Sunday the following has happened:

-Big Ben is done for the season
-drew brees is out for up to two months
- Eli manning is benched for the rookie QB
- Trevor simien is now out for the year after starting last night because Sam Darnold was quarantined in his own house
- And cam newtons status is up in the air over the foot injury he being reacrivated.

It's been a mad couple of days in NFL land hasn't it ?

jack presley · 17-09-2019 9:07pm

Itssoeasy wrote: »

So just so I'm up to date. Since Sunday the following has happened:

-Big Ben is done for the season
-drew brees is out for up to two months
- Eli manning is benched for the rookie QB
- Trevor simien is now out for the year after starting last night because Sam Darnold was quarantined in his own house
- And cam newtons status is up in the air over the foot injury he being reacrivated.

It's been a mad couple of days in NFL land hasn't it ?

...and Tom Brady marches on

Christy42 · 17-09-2019 10:44pm

Itssoeasy wrote: »

So just so I'm up to date. Since Sunday the following has happened:

-Big Ben is done for the season
-drew brees is out for up to two months
- Eli manning is benched for the rookie QB
- Trevor simien is now out for the year after starting last night because Sam Darnold was quarantined in his own house
- And cam newtons status is up in the air over the foot injury he being reacrivated.

It's been a mad couple of days in NFL land hasn't it ?

Nick Foles is down for the season as well.

Edit: Sorry, missed that your post said since Sunday! Foles is less relevant.

I reckon they flat out lied about the foot injury. That was always bothering him this season. There is no way they don't use him to run more otherwise.

Jolly Red Giant · 18-09-2019 6:02pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

It depends how tanking you want to go. If they're planning for 2 years of being absolutely terrible and another of being middle of the road then if they choose to keep him they'd be looking at the end of his contract at that point. After 1 game in he was complaining about what he was asked to do so it is unlikely he would stay quiet for 3 years on a terrible roster and end up sitting out or demanding a trade, which would likely mean the Dolphins might not get the same return for him. Similarly, on a terrible team, he'll likely get beating badly on a regular basis, so again his value is never going to be as high as right now.

It isn't like they're giving him away for nothing, this is trending towards being a prime pick. With the number of good QBs likely available in the next, the Dolphins may have 2 picks in the top 5/10 which they could turn into even more picks. It's a gamble from their side but that is what aggressive tanking is

Fitzpatrick wanted out of Miami - he wanted to play his preferred position - the Dolphins wanted to play him across all secondary positions and ILB - they made him learn six positions and he had enough.

Foxtrol · 18-09-2019 7:19pm

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

Fitzpatrick wanted out of Miami - he wanted to play his preferred position - the Dolphins wanted to play him across all secondary positions and ILB - they made him learn six positions and he had enough.

Many players train in multiple positions and don't ask for a trade, some have claimed it helps their overall game by doing it when they're young. I'm sure it is easier to do so you're on a winning team, rather than one that is likely to be a dumpster fire for the foreseeable future. Same as Ramsey, who is currently complaining about playing too much zone but will be fine if he gets traded to a winning team and gets paid.

One of the criticisms about Fitzpatrick coming out was that though he was a great player that could play multiple positions, there was questions about him being elite in any single one of them. Dolphins might have been trying to find his best position, but it will probably help him now to likely just focus on one with the Steelers (hoping they chose the right one).

nerd69 · 18-09-2019 8:37pm

He has also said he likes to model himself after Malcom Jenkins who plays saftey/slot and linebacker. I think he just wanted out if Miami to be honest

The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

Comments