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16-09-2019, 10:23   #61
Dr Bill V1.5
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Looks like the beginning of the end in the US with NY banning flavours and many more states will follow suit no doubt. I can see it happening in Ireland in the near future as well. There's no way it wouldn't get passed in the Dáil, just like the US the argument that it's "for the kids" trumps all other reasoning.
You could be right but I'd hope that we align ourselves more closely to the UK,at least they take onboard the scientific tests before making sweeping decisions.
As far as I'm aware although I'm open to correction on this, DIY isn't affected by this ban in the US, because the ingredients are so closely entwined with the food industry a ban would cause chaos, imagine a flavourless cheese cake yuuuuuck Like eating cardboard.
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16-09-2019, 12:37   #62
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clairebyrnelive@rte.ie would like your input, feel a hatchet job coming.
The way ithis is being promoted on twitter it looks like a hatchet job but thats the nature of promotion, make it as eye catching as posible.
I will be in the audience for this and may put my hand up.
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16-09-2019, 17:18   #63
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Mister-E-Liquid's CEO Hammers the Vaping Ban

Mister-E-Liquid's CEO Hammers the Vaping Ban

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16-09-2019, 17:29   #64
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I'm in Naples at the moment, I'm not seeing much vaping but plenty of smoking, however I was shocked to see the whole wall of one of the metro stations covered with adverts for several different brands of vaping units including one that's being endorsed by an Italian celebrity. Back at home I've seen teens who may have never smoked using them on the way to school in the morning obviously for the same image reasons as smoking.
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16-09-2019, 17:38   #65
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Looks like the beginning of the end in the US with NY banning flavours and many more states will follow suit no doubt.
It's the perfect plan. Ban flavours and drive them underground. E-liquid is then sold by unregulated street vendors. In that scenario, anything can be said to have been caused by vaping. They are already using this line when these issues caused by 'vaping' is not vaping as we know and understand it. It was dodgy street made CBD/ THC capsules with oil in them. That's not vaping.

Most e-liquid can be shown to have been lab tested and to have passed regulatory requirements and safety testing (particularly in EU).

This is a big win for big tobacco. US in the grip of Big Tobacco, the NRA etc. and their money/ lobbyists. Trump's US is equally as good at propoganda as Russia or anywhere else. All the major networks fell for this hook line and sinker.

What's a shame is all the doctors and scientists - whose policy should be eveidence based - are all jumping at this in a really pathetic, reactionary manner. Shame on them.
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16-09-2019, 17:41   #66
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Originally Posted by Seamai View Post
I'm in Naples at the moment, I'm not seeing much vaping but plenty of smoking, however I was shocked to see the whole wall of one of the metro stations covered with adverts for several different brands of vaping units including one that's being endorsed by an Italian celebrity. Back at home I've seen teens who may have never smoked using them on the way to school in the morning obviously for the same image reasons as smoking.

Better to be cool and vape then be cool and smoke?


I started smoking at 13 and smoked for 20 years.
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16-09-2019, 23:20   #67
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Being discussed on Claire Byrne Live now.

There's a strong element of "Wont someone think of the children"
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16-09-2019, 23:29   #68
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Totally glossed over US issues and no mention of THC etc.

Claire holding a PockeX!
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17-09-2019, 00:26   #69
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Being discussed on Claire Byrne Live now.

There's a strong element of "Wont someone think of the children"
It was an infuriating debate. The discussions around vaping need to centre around current science and have actual specialists speaking about it. The guy making the point that the local corner shop are complicit in a man's death by selling cigarettes to him was a particular lowlight in an already lowbrow debate. That logic applied broadly would see us ban every mildly unhealthy thing we can scaremonger about. And the less said about the appalling use of "we didnt know how bad cigarettes were for centuries" argument the better
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17-09-2019, 10:57   #70
Dr Bill V1.5
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Just in case anyone has any doubts as to why all this is happening in the US.....

https://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/04/b...?smid=fb-share
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17-09-2019, 11:36   #71
Shinobollo
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Originally Posted by Dr Bill V1.5 View Post
Just in case anyone has any doubts as to why all this is happening in the US.....

https://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/04/b...?smid=fb-share
There's a surprise.
Fcuk health and show me the money
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17-09-2019, 14:04   #72
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Originally Posted by Dr Bill V1.5 View Post
Just in case anyone has any doubts as to why all this is happening in the US.....

https://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/04/b...?smid=fb-share
Can't read it , 0 articles remaining this month

But I'm wondering is it something to do with what I have been reading this morning about the MSA that states signed up to in 1998 ? and the selling of bonds on the strength of it ? .

From wiki :

Securitization

In the ten years following the settlement, many state and local governments have opted to sell so-called tobacco bonds. They are a form of securitization. In many cases the bonds permit state and local governments to transfer the risk of declines in future master settlement agreement payments to bondholders. In some cases, however, the bonds are backed by secondary pledges of state or local revenues, which creates what some see as a perverse incentive to support the tobacco industry, on whom they are now dependent for future payments against this debt.[55]

Tobacco revenue has fallen more quickly than projected when the securities were created, leading to technical defaults in some states. Some analysts predict that many of the bonds will default entirely. Many of the longer-term bonds have been downgraded to junk ratings.[56] More recently, financial analysts began raising concerns that the rapid growth of the electronic cigarette market is accelerating the decline of $97 billion outstanding in tobacco bonds.[57][58][59] States with large populations, such as New York and California, are affected to a greater degree than others.[59] Lawmakers in several states proposed measures to tax e-cigarettes like traditional tobacco products to offset the decline in TMSA revenue. They anticipate that taxing or banning e-cigarettes would be beneficial to the sale of combustible cigarettes.[58]
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17-09-2019, 15:10   #73
corkie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bill V1.5 View Post
Just in case anyone has any doubts as to why all this is happening in the US.....

www(dot)nytimes(dot)com/2012/05/04/business/state-bonds-backed-by-tobacco-payments-in-jeopardy-of-default.html
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Originally Posted by jonski View Post
Can't read it , 0 articles remaining this month
2014 www(dot)propublica(dot)org/article/how-wall-street-tobacco-deals-left-states-with-billions-in-toxic-debt


^^^ Is it even relevant to the issues today? ~~~ Vape Ban !?

May 2019: - Are vapers like you paying for lost tobacco revenue?
www(dot)ecigarettedirect(dot)co(dot)uk/ashtray-blog/2019/05/vaping-lost-tobacco-revenue.html

Quote:
My answer is that vaping is a disruptive industry which threatens more than US$700 billion in tobacco revenues and US$250 billion in tax revenues. It’s inevitable there’s going to be opposition to vaping.

But I’m always uneasy this may be interpreted as a conspiracy theory. So to illustrate the scale of the problem, we decided to put some data behind the assertion.

The results are astonishing. Not only is vaping costing billions in tax revenue, it could force some of the very states that have lead the charge against vaping into effective bankruptcy.

....

While states in the US may be suffering from poor decisions around tobacco bonds, some of them are spending money on a campaign against vaping.

For example, while California is cash strapped, it did manage to find 75 million dollars to fund an award winning anti-vaping campaign with videos such as this one on teen vaping:



## I'm not affiliated with any store or review sites. ##

Last edited by corkie; 17-09-2019 at 15:27.
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17-09-2019, 18:56   #74
Dr Bill V1.5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonski View Post
Can't read it , 0 articles remaining this month

But I'm wondering is it something to do with what I have been reading this morning about the MSA that states signed up to in 1998 ? and the selling of bonds on the strength of it ? .

From wiki :

Securitization

In the ten years following the settlement, many state and local governments have opted to sell so-called tobacco bonds. They are a form of securitization. In many cases the bonds permit state and local governments to transfer the risk of declines in future master settlement agreement payments to bondholders. In some cases, however, the bonds are backed by secondary pledges of state or local revenues, which creates what some see as a perverse incentive to support the tobacco industry, on whom they are now dependent for future payments against this debt.[55]

Tobacco revenue has fallen more quickly than projected when the securities were created, leading to technical defaults in some states. Some analysts predict that many of the bonds will default entirely. Many of the longer-term bonds have been downgraded to junk ratings.[56] More recently, financial analysts began raising concerns that the rapid growth of the electronic cigarette market is accelerating the decline of $97 billion outstanding in tobacco bonds.[57][58][59] States with large populations, such as New York and California, are affected to a greater degree than others.[59] Lawmakers in several states proposed measures to tax e-cigarettes like traditional tobacco products to offset the decline in TMSA revenue. They anticipate that taxing or banning e-cigarettes would be beneficial to the sale of combustible cigarettes.[58]

Exactly
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18-09-2019, 00:14   #75
corkie
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Andrew Cuomo, the current Governor of New York. Quote: -

Andrew Cuomo, the current Governor of New York. Quote: -

Quote:
Vaping is better than smoking!

......


Technically Yes!


.......

But So What!!!
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