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Eircode puzzle

  • 06-11-2018 6:41pm
    #1
    kig
    Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭


    I have just complained to An Post about a undelivered package which didn't have our house number, but had everything else correctly addressed including the eircode. Their reply was that they do not use eircode for deliveries.
    What is the point of eircode if our postal system doesn't use eircode?


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Comments

  • #2
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    kig wrote: »
    I have just complained to An Post about a undelivered package which didn't have our house number, but had everything else correctly addressed including the eircode. Their reply was that they do not use eircode for deliveries.
    What is the point of eircode if our postal system doesn't use eircode?

    It was a government led program. An Post said from the start that their systems didn’t recognise it.


  • #3
    EdgeCase
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭EdgeCase


    They do use it, but not in every aspect of their systems and they didn't develop it and actually dragged their feet on the rollout of postal codes here for decades. We were supposed to be introducing postal codes in the mid 1970s!

    I've been told they do use it for automatic sorting, but that delivery staff i.e. postmen and women may not be able to look it up locally so, without the top line of your address, they still won't be able to find your house.

    The Eircode might have gone through the automatic sorting system and delivered the item to that particular route, but unless the postman / woman keys it into something to look up the address, they're not going to have a clue where you are.

    It's still useful, and it's very handy for couriers and so on, but it'll just take An Post 40 years or so to get with the times. There's nothing new there really.

    Basically, for An Post staff to be able to use Eircode at local level, they would need to have something like a mobile phone with an app to look it up. You can be sure that this level of 'advanced technology' wouldn't be something that they'd have yet.


  • #4
    kig
    Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭kig


    Why are we worried about broadband coverage if we can't even get a postcode system to work. An Post needs their a***s kicked!


  • #5
    EdgeCase
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭EdgeCase


    Basically the history of Eircode was that An Post did not want to rollout any kind of postal code and were quite happy to just let the system work on totally illogical addressing that could only be deciphered by them.

    In the end Eircode was driven by the Government as a totally separate project to facilitate better addressing so people could find things, couriers could find addresses and so on without driving around in circles.

    Eircode is not a post code in the traditional sense, it's national geolocation code that looks up any address.

    It's up to individual couriers and mapping companies to adopt it if they want. Google Maps use it, as do several of the courier companies at this stage and An Post seem to use it for internal sorting now too.

    It'll just start to get picked up as more companies and individuals start to find it useful.


  • #6
    daithi7
    Registered Users Posts: 1,292 ✭✭✭daithi7


    It's a pile of crap is what it is, and an expensive one at that!!


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  • #7
    Fann Linn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,770 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    daithi7 wrote: »
    It's a pile of crap is what it is, and an expensive one at that!!

    On the contrary I think its great. No need asking for directions. Just input 7 digits into google drive and 'bingo'.


  • #8
    daithi7
    Registered Users Posts: 1,292 ✭✭✭daithi7


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    On the contrary I think its great. No need asking for directions. Just input 7 digits into google drive and 'bingo'.

    Fair enough, I just don't like our coding system e.g. the abandonment of County letters in the code, and other anomalies with it. It looks half baked imho.


  • #9
    Lantus
    Registered Users Posts: 3,027 ✭✭✭Lantus


    What3words has the location solution nailed for virtually all situations.


  • #10
    selous
    Registered Users Posts: 1,373 ✭✭✭selous


    kig wrote: »
    Why are we worried about broadband coverage if we can't even get a postcode system to work. An Post needs their a***s kicked!

    As does the person who didn't put your full address.

    Amazon seem to have a habit now of slicing off the left hand side of address' on their label, only for my phone number is attached to the barcode the post person rings to ask for my full address, to deliver it, no ass kicking needed.


  • #11
    Ursus Horribilis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,168 ✭✭✭Ursus Horribilis


    Lantus wrote: »
    What3words has the location solution nailed for virtually all situations.

    They're all whistling in the wind now the eircode is here


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  • #12
    mdebets
    Registered Users Posts: 1,747 ✭✭✭mdebets


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    On the contrary I think its great. No need asking for directions. Just input 7 digits into google drive and 'bingo'.
    It's ok for courier companies, who might have one delivery in a certain street every few days and varying routes every day over a large area, but crap for a postman who goes the same route every day and delivers several letters to several houses in a certain street every day.
    What they need, is the relative location of addresses, eg. 21 High Street is next or one down from 23 High Street. Eircode doesn't give you this. D07 R532 and D07 T466 could be two houses next to each other, but there is no way of knowing this, without typing them into a computer. To use it, the postman would have to look up each address, which is not feasible. It could have worked, if they used a logical (rather than a random) system and the house next to D07 R532 would be D07 R533. Then it could work for the postman.


  • #13
    Fann Linn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,770 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    Ursus Horribilis wrote: »
    They're all whistling in the wind now the eircode is here


    Well if the house I'm looking for knew and could use their what3word tag I'd use that.

    For now I'll stick with eircode.


  • #14
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    mdebets wrote: »
    It's ok for courier companies, who might have one delivery in a certain street every few days and varying routes every day over a large area, but crap for a postman who goes the same route every day and delivers several letters to several houses in a certain street every day.
    What they need, is the relative location of addresses, eg. 21 High Street is next or one down from 23 High Street. Eircode doesn't give you this. D07 R532 and D07 T466 could be two houses next to each other, but there is no way of knowing this, without typing them into a computer. To use it, the postman would have to look up each address, which is not feasible. It could have worked, if they used a logical (rather than a random) system and the house next to D07 R532 would be D07 R533. Then it could work for the postman.

    It was decided not to use a logical system for privacy reasons.


  • #15
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,252 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    They don't use it yet when they put my letter with perfect address in to a neighbour, the response was, well if it had an eircode, it would be sure of going to the correct house.


  • #16
    Ursus Horribilis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,168 ✭✭✭Ursus Horribilis


    Sounds like they're suiting themselves. Looking up an eircode isn't rocket science if you have a smartphone.


  • #17
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    A postman doing his round wants all the letters in address order as he meets them. He does not want to get a bag of mail, then get out a smartphone and look up every address and then sort the mail into order and bring it around. He would have to write the addresses on the envelope unless he wants to look them up again when he arrives at the first house.
    Many householders do not display the number of their property outside. It is often impossible to know which house is which. There might be a number on one house and none on several adjacent. It happens all over many urban areas.


  • #18
    eddhorse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,780 ✭✭✭eddhorse


    4ensic15 wrote: »
    It was decided not to use a logical system for privacy reasons.

    This is the funniest thing about it all.
    You can find anyone's eircode or address from eircode website or Google maps.

    Loc8 also had a brilliant system done before Eircode came along, there was money to be spent so they did it badly.
    Plus the closure of post offices will lead to An Post never giving their staff devices to use in the field.


  • #19
    EdgeCase
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭EdgeCase


    I've had mail out though my door that wasn't even for the right county!!


  • #20
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,520 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    mdebets wrote: »
    It could have worked, if they used a logical (rather than a random) system and the house next to D07 R532 would be D07 R533. Then it could work for the postman.

    This falls to pieces when the owner of D07 R533 decides to replace his detached house with 4 townhouses, and D07 R534 replaces hers with 12 apartments. These now end up out of sequence.

    Any system that works sequentially collapses in to incoherence after a few years and you need to glue it back together with a database very like what Eircode has anyway, except assumptions keep being made that are plainly wrong.

    Loc8 was not a "brilliant system", it was a concatenated coordinate which means it could not be used for any proper delivery planning purposes.


  • #21
    wench
    Registered Users Posts: 1,628 ✭✭✭wench


    mdebets wrote: »
    It could have worked, if they used a logical (rather than a random) system and the house next to D07 R532 would be D07 R533. Then it could work for the postman.
    That's lovely and neat until someone adds an infill house, or demolishes a house to replace it with an apartment block.

    Then what happens to your sequential numbers?


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  • #22
    daithi7
    Registered Users Posts: 1,292 ✭✭✭daithi7


    4ensic15 wrote: »
    It was decided not to use a logical system for privacy reasons.

    Which is a really lame excuse, since you're normally putting your full a address alongside your post code so you've effectively given away all privacy in relation to your address already.... Lame excuse for a lame system that is proving unloved by the general public.


  • #23
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    daithi7 wrote: »
    Which is a really lame excuse, since you're normally putting your full a address alongside your post code so you've effectively given away all privacy in relation to your address already.... Lame excuse for a lame system that is proving unloved by the general public.

    It was to prevent marketing by not allowing companies to send junk mail to every house by simply writing to all codes in a given location.


  • #24
    EdgeCase
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭EdgeCase


    Most post codes tell you very little anyway. They all need the top line of the address.

    A lot of continental systems and the standard US ZIP are really just a numerical version of the nearest town / or location of a sorting office (many of which no longer exist) that was designed to automate or semi automate sorting in the 1950 and 60s.

    The UK system is more accurate in London and the bigger cities but it's got very poor granularity somewhere like Northern Ireland or rural Scotland. The entirety of NI is limited to BTX XXX

    Overall Eircode works and should eventually be able to be used as

    1 Main Street (for the postman)
    X99 1A2B (for the sorting automation)


  • #25
    mdebets
    Registered Users Posts: 1,747 ✭✭✭mdebets


    L1011 wrote: »
    This falls to pieces when the owner of D07 R533 decides to replace his detached house with 4 townhouses, and D07 R534 replaces hers with 12 apartments. These now end up out of sequence.

    Any system that works sequentially collapses in to incoherence after a few years and you need to glue it back together with a database very like what Eircode has anyway, except assumptions keep being made that are plainly wrong.

    Loc8 was not a "brilliant system", it was a concatenated coordinate which means it could not be used for any proper delivery planning purposes.
    The future proofing (and keeping it sequential) of the system would have been very easy. You could have added 3 or for additional digits at the end. 000 at the start, then change this if an existing Eircode is subdivided for new houses or apartents. In addition, the system could have been done so that one Eircode per house is used, so not every apartment has its own Eircode, but just the whole building.


  • #26
    wench
    Registered Users Posts: 1,628 ✭✭✭wench


    mdebets wrote: »
    The future proofing (and keeping it sequential) of the system would have been very easy. You could have added 3 or for additional digits at the end. 000 at the start, then change this if an existing Eircode is subdivided for new houses or apartents. In addition, the system could have been done so that one Eircode per house is used, so not every apartment has its own Eircode, but just the whole building.
    So now you want all users to have knowledge of which buildings existed at time of original eircode generation, and which have been added since.


  • #27
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    mdebets wrote: »
    The future proofing (and keeping it sequential) of the system would have been very easy. You could have added 3 or for additional digits at the end. 000 at the start, then change this if an existing Eircode is subdivided for new houses or apartents. In addition, the system could have been done so that one Eircode per house is used, so not every apartment has its own Eircode, but just the whole building.


    That'd be as retarded as a loc8 code

    If you are up around Athlone, KV56 is the sewerage plant

    Much better than N37KV560001 being the shop next door like.

    For everything else, there is What3words :




  • #28
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    For example : sobbed.survivor.cobble

    will bring you to something floating in the River Shannon


    https://w3w.co/sobbed.survivor.cobble


  • #29
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,520 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    mdebets wrote: »
    The future proofing (and keeping it sequential) of the system would have been very easy. You could have added 3 or for additional digits at the end. 000 at the start, then change this if an existing Eircode is subdivided for new houses or apartents. In addition, the system could have been done so that one Eircode per house is used, so not every apartment has its own Eircode, but just the whole building.

    And now you've a ten digit code and/or one that can't be used to identify individual apartments.

    Both useless.


  • #30
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,655 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    kceire wrote: »
    It was a government led program. An Post said from the start that their systems didn’t recognise it.

    A postcode system that aids delivery is not in the interests of a monopoly or near-monopoly postal operator. An Post are not unique in their approach.


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  • #31
    selous
    Registered Users Posts: 1,373 ✭✭✭selous


    mickdw wrote: »
    They don't use it yet when they put my letter with perfect address in to a neighbour, the response was, well if it had an eircode, it would be sure of going to the correct house.

    Someone I know got the same daft reply from customer care, when letters she was waiting on never came, she was livid, and shouted (she said) at him,
    If he cant read a house name on a letter what F*****g use would an Eircode be. (never got the letters)


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