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25-02-2011, 15:56   #1
RoyalMarine
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temp layoff, no notice, no reason. any help?

Hi guys, im posting this on behalf of a family member.

He has worked for a company for 3 years running.
he's 25 now.

Today, he got a phone call from a manager at the company, informing him that he is now on temporary lay off effective immideatly.

He was due to work tomorrow night, sunday night, tuesday day, wednesday day, and then has 1 week holiday's booked.

1 other person has been told the same.

they gave no time frame on how long it will last.
they gave no clear details on why it happened.
they gave him 30 hours notice. (due to work tomorrow night at 7pm)

A few weeks ago, he requested his hourly rate increase, as per his contract, and was granted this.
it was due to begin this week.

what should we do? He was in the middle of applying for a mortgage, and obviously has to abandon that idea now.

any advice would be grateful.
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25-02-2011, 17:12   #2
clevtrev
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Temporary layoffs - employers are not obliged by law to give notice of temporary layoffs although most employers do where possible especially in unionised situations. They must however provide an RP9 form which states that the layoff is temporary and that there is an expectation of work resumption in the near future. If after 4 weeks the employer has not brought the employee back to work then the employee can apply for redundancy although the employer can refuse assuming they have work to bring you back. Selection for temporary layoff should be fair so you could look at asking for details of the selection criteria used. Or if the place is unionised then get them on it.
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25-02-2011, 17:47   #3
RoyalMarine
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Temporary layoffs - employers are not obliged by law to give notice of temporary layoffs although most employers do where possible especially in unionised situations.
Thats a very unfair rule. If someone is to be laid off, then they should get some notice of this. He got a phone call, at 1:30pm, informing him not to come to work tomorrow.
However, if he was to be laid off full time, they would be obliged to give him his 2 weeks notice since he is there 2-5 years.
Very big flaw there.

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They must however provide an RP9 form which states that the layoff is temporary and that there is an expectation of work resumption in the near future.
Is there a time frame on when this should be givin to him?

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If after 4 weeks the employer has not brought the employee back to work then the employee can apply for redundancy although the employer can refuse assuming they have work to bring you back.
So after 4 weeks he can apply for redundancy, but they can refuse saying there will be work?
How long can they do this? Is there a time frame on when they either give him a full time position back or give him redundancy?

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Originally Posted by clevtrev View Post
Selection for temporary layoff should be fair so you could look at asking for details of the selection criteria used. Or if the place is unionised then get them on it.
He is there longer than 4 other staff members, all of which do the same duty. We beleive its since he sought his hourly increase that he is selected for lay off.
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26-02-2011, 12:06   #4
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unfortunately some employers use the temporary layoff to offload workers more cheaply. If the employer makes you redundant then they must pay notice pay whereas if you're on temp layoff they can leave you sitting there until you come looking for redundancy and then you are not entitled to notice pay. Its a powerful tool for the employer who is not under much pressure to take employees back off layoff and the employee is obviously going to come under financial pressure sooner or later.

The layoff may be genuine but this smells bad and it looks like the employer is abusing his position. I think I would start to gather ammunition for the LRC by submitting letters to the company requesting :-

1. the issuance of an RP9 and querying why one was not issued to date, (this should be issued on the day of layoff as you need it for dole application) The form is here http://www.deti.ie/forms/rp9.pdf

2. clarification on the selection criteria used for the layoff. Looks like unfair selection and in the event of job loss a case is there for unfair dismissal / constructive dismissal

3. Details of when they hope to have work available again. the company must respond within 7 days to a submission from an employee looking for redundancy using the RP9 and must guarantee 13 weeks work

the only downside of this approach may be that it will harden positions and will reduce the likelihood of getting back into work. But if he feels they are not playing ball then he may be left with little option. I assume he is not a member of a union ?
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26-02-2011, 14:37   #5
RoyalMarine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clevtrev View Post
unfortunately some employers use the temporary layoff to offload workers more cheaply. If the employer makes you redundant then they must pay notice pay whereas if you're on temp layoff they can leave you sitting there until you come looking for redundancy and then you are not entitled to notice pay. Its a powerful tool for the employer who is not under much pressure to take employees back off layoff and the employee is obviously going to come under financial pressure sooner or later.

The layoff may be genuine but this smells bad and it looks like the employer is abusing his position. I think I would start to gather ammunition for the LRC by submitting letters to the company requesting :-

1. the issuance of an RP9 and querying why one was not issued to date, (this should be issued on the day of layoff as you need it for dole application) The form is here http://www.deti.ie/forms/rp9.pdf

2. clarification on the selection criteria used for the layoff. Looks like unfair selection and in the event of job loss a case is there for unfair dismissal / constructive dismissal

3. Details of when they hope to have work available again. the company must respond within 7 days to a submission from an employee looking for redundancy using the RP9 and must guarantee 13 weeks work

the only downside of this approach may be that it will harden positions and will reduce the likelihood of getting back into work. But if he feels they are not playing ball then he may be left with little option. I assume he is not a member of a union ?
He is a member of siptu. however, the shop stewards in the company are useless muppets.

Ive passed the info you provided onto him, and we cant thank you enough.

In the end, all he wants is his job back, as he was trying to secure a mortgage, but he realises this wont happen, and he just wants to move on and find something else.
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03-03-2011, 14:09   #6
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He is a member of siptu. however, the shop stewards in the company are useless muppets.
Go over their heads, and contact SIPTU directly.

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In the end, all he wants is his job back, as he was trying to secure a mortgage, but he realises this wont happen, and he just wants to move on and find something else.
Best to go looking now, to see if he can get another job. Does he know anyone there that he could use as a reference?
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