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30-04-2008, 00:18   #16
Belfast
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Originally Posted by brianthebard View Post
In most republics the president is much more powerful than ours, the two houses of state are more balanced powerwise, there is no state religion or "special mention" given to one religion in constitutions, and the people of the state may have a stronger say in how the country is run, through the use of popular referenda. So apart from names and a semblence of a republic an political framework, what makes Ireland a republic? And is that framework enough, or are there still important aspects missing from our republic?
Yes, we are a Republic as we have a written Constitution that limits the power of goverment and can only be changed direct by the people not by Parliament. Not a very good Republic.
One of the big problems with our republic is the elector register in out of date and has many dead people on it and the same people registered in many places at the same time. it can also be updated by political partys. This may help to explain why so many independents and small political partys got wiped out at the last election, but the fainna fail gene pool independents survived.
The question may be not are we a republic, but did we have a legal election or fair election last time.
In a republic the people are sovereign. In a Democracy the Parliament is sovereign.
The reason the president is not powerful is the treaty that end the war of independance stated that we had to have a prime minister. When the new Constitution came in in 1937 the role of the king war replaced be the president.

Fifth Amendment (5 January 1973): Removed reference to "special position" of the Roman Catholic Church and to certain other named denominations.

The special position of the catholic church gave in no formal power. It was a sop to the church in 1937. The church wanted Catholic church to be made the state religion and dev having been excommunicated twice did not want this.
The Church did not have power, but it did have influence.
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30-04-2008, 00:54   #17
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God in the CONSTITUTION

CONSTITUTION OF IRELAND
In the Name of the Most Holy Trinity, from Whom is all authority and to Whom, as our final end, all actions both of men and States must be referred,
We, the people of Éire,
Humbly acknowledging all our obligations to our Divine Lord, Jesus Christ, Who sustained our fathers through centuries of trial,
Gratefully remembering their heroic and unremitting struggle to regain the rightful independence of our Nation,
And seeking to promote the common good, with due observance of Prudence, Justice and Charity, so that the dignity and freedom of the individual may be assured, true social order attained, the unity of our country restored, and concord established with other nations,
Do hereby adopt, enact, and give to ourselves this Constitution.

It is christian not Roman Catholic. No bad Idea to change it.

possibly this
CONSTITUTION OF IRELAND
In the Name of the sovereign people of ireland, from Whom is all authority, as our final end, all actions the State must be referred,
Gratefully remembering their heroic and unremitting struggle to regain the rightful independence of our Nation,
And seeking to promote the common good, with due observance of Prudence, Justice and Charity, so that the dignity and freedom of the individual may be assured, true social order attained, the unity of our country restored, and concord established with other nations,
Do hereby adopt, enact, and give to ourselves this Constitution.
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30-04-2008, 20:32   #18
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Powerful President

if Ireland had a Powerful President like American Fianna Fáil would almost always control the post of President.
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18-05-2008, 23:12   #19
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It should also be noted that the constitution predates the declaration of a republic and that the declaration of a Republic was done as much to piss off the main author of the constitution as anything else.

So pointing to passages in devs constitution as proof that we are not a Republic is pretty pointless as the constitution does not claim to be a constitution of a Republic.
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20-05-2008, 15:07   #20
 
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But that just enforces the fact that we aren't a republic-all that bull in secondary school about being "a republic in all but name" is a farce since the constitution dev created wasn't one for a Republic.
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20-05-2008, 20:31   #21
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. If the county councils were given more powers then we might see a reduction in Jackie healy rae types.
I disagree, most of the really bad corruption and local clientilism came from the local planning process, we'll end up with more of the tossers. (Not that I think Jackie is corrupt, just a local cute hoor)

The problem in Ireland is that we forgive these effers everything. In any normal country Conor Lenihan would be gone after the kebabs remark (not made Minister for Integration ffs).

Cooper-Flynn screws RTE (i.e. us) for over one million and walks away scot free. Her da? A Flynn first and always. You're paid to work for us you scumbag.

Lowry would be gone.

Bertie? Bryan Dobson eyes me ar*e.

Enda Kenny. Useless.

The problem is not with the Irish system, the problem is with the Irish electorate who think, sure he may be a crook, but he's our crook! Vote the f***er back in.

Last edited by dresden8; 20-05-2008 at 20:37. Reason: Lack of clarity.
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22-05-2008, 10:00   #22
 
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well I agree that if we kept the same system and gave local councillors more power we would probably end up with more corruption, but it pretty much goes without saying at this stage that there is a lot of cleaning up to do at local and national level.
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22-05-2008, 12:36   #23
 
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I'm not sure I see the point of the original question. The problem is there is no agreed universal definition of a republic. Wikipedia sets the bar pretty low:
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A republic is a state or country that is not led by a hereditary monarch, where the people of that state or country (or at least a part of that people) have impact on its government
Is an Islamic Republic a "real" republic? Wikipedia would say yes, it could be. But it is vastly different from any concept of a republic most non-muslims would recognise. With such huge capacity for disagreement on definition, the question is asking something that is not capable of a meaningful answer. It might be more useful to ask whether our system of Government is good, fair, just, moral, efficient, effective or sensible.
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23-05-2008, 12:36   #24
 
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Well this is a fine secular republic we live in when this happens
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/bre...breaking33.htm
the head of this "Republic" and armed forces heading off on a jolly with 500 Defence forces staff that should be doing something more important than a trip to Lourdes! I mean the head of the mission to Chad is going to this rather than being in Chad?
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23-05-2008, 13:57   #25
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If you actually take a look at who was sent to Chad, It was mostly Irish Army Rangers, Something tells me Mary McAleese wouldn't be much use at the business end of a machete or AK47, So Lourdes is probably the best place for her, out of harms way, she can say a few oul prayers for the unforunates that did get sent.
So the entourage of 500 is composed of
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members of the Defence Forces, Civil Defence, Organisation of Ex-Servicemen and Women, the Irish United National Veterans Association and their families.
I'm not sure what use you think the IUNVA and their families are going to be in Chad either.

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This year marks the 50th anniversary celebration of the International Military Pilgrimage which was initiated in 1958 as a post World War Two healing process by the French and German authorities. The event has involved the Irish Defence Forces since its inception.
As such this event would represent an important event in their calender and while the attendance of the Head of the UN mission might seem a little unnecessary, you must bear in mind that there will be military brass from all over the world at this and it may be an important occasion for him to meet other army leaders who may be able to assist later on in the Chad mission with staff or resources. The alternative is to isolate the Chad mission and leave them out of sight and out of mind, which leads to the fate of Romeo DAllaire in Rwanda. It is obvious that the UN can never arrange the resources for missions of this source without some work behind the scenes and outside of their direct involvement, so events like this can be very important for current and future affairs as well as the respect they are paying to those who fought and died in the past.
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23-05-2008, 14:55   #26
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Can I gently remind people to have a look at the name of this forum before posting? Ta.
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27-06-2008, 04:23   #27
 
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Well that all depends on your definition of a republic! Republicanism is a very broad church. Republicanism is an ideology that recognises the core rights of individuals and the collective rights of people! Republicanism is a very broad church and it is about how power and authority is delegated its how society is democratically put together and so you can have a conservative republic like the USA, you can have small farmers, small swindlers, dodgy envelope republic which is what we have in the south or you can have a smuggled cigarette and smuggled disle republic which is what I think we are heading for in here in the North.
If your going to quote someone, at least attribute it to the author, in this case Bernadette McAliskey.
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27-06-2008, 05:08   #28
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Personally I'd like to see the Seanad completely overhauled to actually be more of an equal to the Dáil, much stronger oversight of the public sector (specifically, accountability for corruption and mindless waste), and possibly more direct referenda like Switzerland. Sadly, we might need to dump our current multi-seat PR-STV electoral system because it just seems to encourage local clientelism, gombeenism and nepotism and a Dáil full of messenger boys and cute hoors rather than national statesmen/women but I'm not sure what to replace it with.

Or maybe overhauling local government, properly decentralising power to that level might be the answer to that one. That our national parliamentarians spend 90% of their time on potholes, street lights, and "fixing" planning applications is ridiculous.
If someone said that at my door and I thought they actually meant it I would actually bother to go and vote.
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10-08-2008, 14:16   #29
 
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An overhaul of the Seanad is badly needed. Either it should be made democratic with Senators elected by the people or else abolished entirely-the latter woulod have no practical effect on the vast majority of people as it may as well be non-existent for the little work it does.
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06-09-2008, 10:45   #30
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We do need a revamp of the senate and post of President

We need that all the senate is democraticaly elected

We need that the Senate can and will activily ensure skuldugury that exists with the Dail can be reduced and not use the Senate as a rubber stamp

We need that the President be much more vocal about blatant lack of care and services bordering on neo nazi campain to slowly stave the poor to death rather than find the funds to help them and ask for Nurimberg trial to commence to find who ordered what in our 1940 to 1990 policy to drive poor unemployed out to other countries with one way tickets isued in social welfarre offices

We need the President to more activily block crap laws and crap law making especially where it is detrimental to the poor
The last dail where FF and PD's headed by Bertie and PD,s minister for Justice whats his name always in your face on telly guy steam rolled through bad laws against any reasonable advise from the opposition with the majority is the only right attitude

Worse the previous Dail has allowed the with several stupid guick machine gun fire law making to mean if the whacko SF ever get into power they can just copy the mold of quick machine gun fire law making mold and overturn all the Irish laws protecting individuals right overnight and then you can all become political refugees in some other country

There now is no safety circuit breakers in the Irish Sytem worth a toss and if a 100% government gets in they can run riot and rob and steal with impunity


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