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Comments

  • #62
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    AK_47 wrote: »
    But why would landlords prefer to use AirB&B and pay 52% of tax and constantly deal with brand new short term guests rather than have one stable tenant who pays the bills and rent? If they are scared of the Part 4 tenants who after 6 months get more rights, then offer your place for 5 months only or secure yourself with 1 year lease.

    The tax rate is the same on Airbnb and long term rental but you can charge a lot more for Airbnb with none of the risks. It’s also not that much work you just have cleaners etc to do the upkeep up and bookings etc are all through Airbnb.


  • #63
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    The Student wrote: »
    If we stop people coming to Dublin (which is where most would be located due to the location of the employment and the desire for access to facilities) where do they go.

    You do realise we are a small open economy who needs FDI. These would be high earning individuals paying income tax and spending in the economy. This self same tax that would be used to fund house building (be it social or affordable etc).

    Who do you expect to pay for the social and affordable housing ? is it the working middle income who are above assistance for state support but below what they need to get a mortgage?

    I am curious as to who you see funding this?

    Who was paying for it before, when it was built by the local authorities?

    TBH I don't really care. We are just copying London and Berlin and duplicating all the mistakes along the way.

    At some point it will become unsustainable either for the companies or the workers. Until that happens though nothing will change. Don't this to be fixed by the Govt.


  • #64
    The Student
    Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭The Student


    beauf wrote: »
    Who was paying for it before, when it was built by the local authorities?

    TBH I don't really care. We are just copying London and Berlin and duplicating all the mistakes along the way.

    At some point it will become unsustainable either for the companies or the workers. Until that happens though nothing will change. Don't this to be fixed by the Govt.

    Okay so you don't really care who pays, we have the youngest population in Europe where other countries are also having the same issues with housing.

    Everybody wants to live in or around Dublin or within a reasonable commutable distance but nobody wants high rise apartment blocks nor does anybody want social housing estates next to them.

    So what do you suggest, no matter what you do you are not going to satisfy everybody, so how do you decide who you satisfy?

    We have this mindset that we have to satisfy everybody when in reality we satisfy nobody.


  • #65
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Stop worrying about other people and do what works for oneself.


  • #66
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    I would prefer AirB&B over long term leasing. The risks of leasing your own property are much higher


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  • #67
    The Student
    Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭The Student


    beauf wrote: »
    Stop worrying about other people and do what works for oneself.

    So do you have an answer to my question. Who is going to pay for all the new social and affordable properties?


  • #68
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Do you have answer for mine? Who paid for it when it was built by the local authorities?


  • #69
    Assetbacked
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,969 ✭✭✭Assetbacked


    The Student wrote: »
    If we stop people coming to Dublin (which is where most would be located due to the location of the employment and the desire for access to facilities) where do they go.

    You do realise we are a small open economy who needs FDI. These would be high earning individuals paying income tax and spending in the economy. This self same tax that would be used to fund house building (be it social or affordable etc).

    Who do you expect to pay for the social and affordable housing ? is it the working middle income who are above assistance for state support but below what they need to get a mortgage?

    I am curious as to who you see funding this?

    The economy is booming and expected to continue to grow significantly. This money should be used to get fibre broadband around the country, greatly enhance transport links between major cities and encourage apartment building outside of Dublin. With these measures being implemented, then promote the rest of the country for companies to consider.

    We are a small country with other major cities not being far from Dublin. It takes two to three hours to drive to Galway, Limerick and Cork from Dublin. With a high speed train network that could almost be commutable. At worst, it would be an easy trip to do for a weekend or even a day trip, so people wouldn't feel they're missing out on all the fun in Dublin.

    The main promotion would be lower rent for employees which also means employers can pay them less. Also, being able to live closer to work gives more time to employees from not having to commute.


  • #70
    Field east
    Registered Users Posts: 2,426 ✭✭✭Field east


    beauf wrote: »
    Do you have answer for mine? Who paid for it when it was built by the local authorities?

    You are comparing apples to oranges. For example, what other demands were on the public finances then compared to now. The health area comes to mind . There was much less on a demand on infrastructure compared to now . There was little on no money put into water supply infrastructure compared to now - and we are now ‘paying ‘for it, etc, etc


  • #71
    Turquoise Hexagon Sun
    Registered Users Posts: 532 ✭✭✭Turquoise Hexagon Sun


    DubCount wrote: »
    IMHO, its relating to the following issues:

    1) Everyone wants somewhere to live, so changes in price does not decrease demand very much.

    2) Government policy is reducing the supply of rental property. Rent controls and increasing regulation means the number of landlords and the number of rental properties is falling, even though rents are increasing.

    3) Government policy refuses to address the difficulties in evicting non-paying, overholding or anti-social tenants. This increases the financial risk of being a landlord and that makes the prices charged more expensive.

    4) Supply of property is not the same thing as supply of rental property. Much of the additional supply is going towards buy-to-own buyers. Not everyone can (or even wants to) buy-to-own. While the price of property to buy is stable, property to rent is still undersupplied relative to demand because of 2 and 3.

    5) There are more votes in keeping the cost of buy-to-own property down, than addressing problems in the rental market. There is no political will to help, because making landlording attractive will mean more competition for buy-to-own buyers from landlord investors.

    If I may add to this list of reasons:
    Figures show that around 13,500 first residence permits were issued to students entering higher education in Ireland from non-European Economic Area (EEA) countries in 2017 – a 45% increase on the same figure from 2013.

    That's just non EEA countries, never mind anyone else that comes to work. Now, I'm not against peopl coming to Irleland at all, my OH is actually from a non EEA country - it's the volume. However, Ireland or more specifically Dublin is not equipment for such an increase of people. We are competting with that extra 7 or 8 thousand students for rental accommodation. That's insane.

    Nobody really wants to talk about that though. Why can't Ireland restrict the amount of student Visas so it frees up some rental properties otherwise taken up by English-learning students?

    Source of my quote:
    Number of non-EEA students in Ireland reaches record level: here's where they're coming from


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  • #72
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Turquoise Hexagon Sun wrote: »
    I

    Nobody really wants to talk about that though. Why can't Ireland restrict the amount of student Visas so it frees up some rental properties otherwise taken up by English-learning students?

    Non EU students pay massive fees, Universities massively benefit from then (and that knocks on to benefitting the country in general) so turning away their money would not be wise.


  • #73
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    Sussy wrote: »
    I think is greed. Also short term contracts and unfurnished properties on the rise on daft. Is absolutely out of control.

    Unfurnished property is the norm outside of ireland. Greed is always thrown around about landlords. What does it mean ? Is it greed that revenue get most of the rent, is it greed the repair man charges higher rates in Dublin , is it greed to expect the rent to be paid. It's just one of those words that means nothing but is thrown out about landlords because it's easy, emotive and generally a public pleasing word.


  • #74
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    handlemaster wrote: »
    Unfurnished property is the norm outside of ireland. Greed is always thrown around about landlords. What does it mean ? Is it greed that revenue get most of the rent, is it greed the repair man charges higher rates in Dublin , is it greed to expect the rent to be paid. It's just one of those words that means nothing but is thrown out about landlords because it's easy, emotive and general a public pleasing word.


    Perfectly said


  • #75
    vriesmays
    Registered Users Posts: 1,570 ✭✭✭vriesmays


    How many of the dopes who were protesting for immigration a few years back are still renting in Dublin.


  • #76
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    vriesmays wrote: »
    How many of the dopes who were protesting for immigration a few years back are still renting in Dublin.

    A little light here. What's your take ?


  • #77
    Turquoise Hexagon Sun
    Registered Users Posts: 532 ✭✭✭Turquoise Hexagon Sun


    Aranza Massive Scapula wrote: »
    Non EU students pay massive fees, Universities massively benefit from then (and that knocks on to benefitting the country in general) so turning away their money would not be wise.

    Why not? It's old but the all the damage these schools caused when they take the students money and then just close. Remember in 2015, 16 English language schools closed in one year? These schools were popping up to make a quick uck on the flood of students coming in.
    https://www.thejournal.ie/english-language-college-closures-ireland-2085691-May2015/
    Look, the economy was on the up. So, Fine Gael opened up the floodgates to these students to get cheap labour. Employment rate is high, so they said they'll open up visas to these students because these students are going to be our Au Pair's, they're going to clean toilets, wait tables, ride Tuk Tuks for pissed accountants at 3:00AM

    Make no mistake, these Visas were dished out to bring in a cheap and very temporary labour force. Government will hit them with €300 per year to renew their Visas for 3 years on a stamp 2 visa. They must have €5000 in their account when applying for Visas the first time. A lot of South Americans sell all their belongings to come here on a Stamp 2. The cost of living here and the fact that they are students means they wont be sending money home. The little they get will be spent in the Irish economy.

    The goverment probably expect most Irish people to buy houses but that's not the case. Irish people are being shafted with rental properties because of the high demand for rental properties - we're competing with thousands of students that just weren't here 7 years ago.

    We live in the EU though. Why not rely on labour to come in from central and eastern Europe like it did in the early 00's? Oh... that's right, we wont get a cut of that sweet visa money. And, then when the economy goes tits-up again we can't garuntee these EU migrants will leave. At least with the rent a cheap labour-force visas, we can send them home after 3 years. It's genius, really.

    It's clever and it keeps the country ticking over with labour and people paying taxes and stimulating the economy but it also contributes greatly to the homeless crisis and effects people like me that has a degree but can barely find a place to rent in the city I was born. I'm done with it.

    If you want to pull that stunt, make sure there is enough rental accommadation. You give out 13,500 non EU visa (45% increase from 2013), make sure there's enough places for people to live otherwise rent goes up in insane levels. Was there a 45% increase in rental properties to go with that figure? I think not. That's not even accounting for EU migrants that just want to come and study Engluh or just move here for a job.

    Just overstaturate the rental market, create a little homeless problem, but it's OK, we're making that visa dough.

    Also, look how inequipped we are to get visa-renewal appointments? It's caused protests, because people cant book appointments to renew visas and not there are guys that made bots to auto-book slots and are selling the appointments online. IT's a joke and a scandal.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/visa-renewals-the-process-is-tedious-and-frustrating-1.4118468

    Just know that the government wanted cheap labour and wasn't prepared to faciltate the influx of people. They wanted a quick buck and they let Irish people to suffer and students to suffer because of greed.

    This is why our rents are high. Not because the landlords are all greedy (although, not discounting some of them because, not only are those politicians making dough off the visas but also the rental properties they own. This problem they created, profits them, very legally). It's supply and demand. The demand has far-exeeded the supply so the price goes up. Simple economics.


  • #78
    Saudades
    Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭Saudades


    Turquoise Hexagon Sun wrote: »
    people are being shafted with rental properties because of the high demand for rental properties - we're competing with thousands of students that just weren't here 7 years ago.

    At least with the rent a cheap labour-force visas, we can send them home after 3 years. It's genius, really.

    I suspect therein lies the issue; when a non EU student's visa expires, how many are actually returning home?
    Let's say a student visa expires, the state expects them to leave and they suddenly drop off of the official system, but they don't leave, so they don't free up their rental space, and a new student arrives here, and so the rental system is exasperated more than the state has officially documented for.
    And this is ongoing for the last several years.


  • #79
    Assetbacked
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,969 ✭✭✭Assetbacked


    Saudades wrote: »
    I suspect therein lies the issue; when a non EU student's visa expires, how many are actually returning home?
    Let's say a student visa expires, the state expects them to leave and they suddenly drop off of the official system, but they don't leave, so they don't free up their rental space, and a new student arrives here, and so the rental system is exasperated more than the state has officially documented for.
    And this is ongoing for the last several years.

    Go on Facebook and look at the rental groups for ads from those from poor countries in South America, Asia etc and you will see multiple beds crammed into a room. I would guess these are the people looking to avoid detection and living off the radar. A decent enough apartment for a couple, at a rent of €1400 in the city centre of Dublin could be split between four adults due to 2 sets of bunk beds in the place. It's sick.


  • #80
    Turquoise Hexagon Sun
    Registered Users Posts: 532 ✭✭✭Turquoise Hexagon Sun


    Assetbacked wrote: »
    Go on Facebook and look at the rental groups for ads from those from poor countries in South America, Asia etc and you will see multiple beds crammed into a room. I would guess these are the people looking to avoid detection and living off the radar. A decent enough apartment for a couple, at a rent of €1400 in the city centre of Dublin could be split between four adults due to 2 sets of bunk beds in the place. It's sick.

    Yes, and some landlords and some tenants are abusing this. Tenants are subletting properties to others, where there are 4 adults in a room. They pay around €400 per bed per month. If the landlord isn't in on it, it screws them over - fire hazards and all that. If the landlord is in on it, why would he want to rent out a 1 bed apartment to a couple for 1200 when he can rent it out to Jose and friends for 1600?

    By the way, I don't want to create any tension or ill will towards our South American friends. They didn't create this mess. Most of them come here to learn, work and contribute. It's our government that created the platform for these issues.

    And as for the figures of people staying on after their visa expires? I don't have any estimates or figures for that. If I was to speculate, I would imagine it's a neglible amount. What I mean by that is, the figures/data we actually know that contribute to this overcrowing, speaks for itself. Those figures alone is enough to be outraged by.

    And then thow in Project 2040... looks bleak.


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