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Death of 25-year-old Peggy McCarthy of Listowel, 1946

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Comments

  • #32
    Atoms for Peace
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,888 ✭✭✭Atoms for Peace


    Did they ever hear about a Jewish lad who preached forgiveness and died for our sins? What a bunch of absolute *****.


  • #33
    KevRossi
    Registered Users Posts: 4,369 ✭✭✭KevRossi


    There's still a hell of a lot of people in this country who quite openly support the idea that a child who is baptised has a right to a school place above one who is not. So yeah, the church holds sway amongst some people when its convenient for them.


  • #34
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    KevRossi wrote: »
    There's still a hell of a lot of people in this country who quite openly support the idea that a child who is baptised has a right to a school place above one who is not. So yeah, the church holds sway amongst some people when its convenient for them.
    Yup. Even now, the church still owns most schools, and thus still teach their lies to the youth of today.


  • #35
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Oh, and is history still optional, but religion mandatory?


  • #36
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,942 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Marley and Marley wrote: »
    People blame the Catholic Church for everything that was wrong in Ireland back in those days but the truth is without the borderline cruelty of a lot of Irish citizens in the way they treated people the catholic church wouldn't have been able to do anything.

    People seem to forget the church were not armed and if people actually just stood up to them and not tolerated their inhumane bull**** they wouldn't have had any power.People allowed the church to have the power they had because they just didn't stand up to them when it wouldn't have been that difficult a thing to do.

    The church only had power and influence in ireland because irish people allowed them to have power and influence but the church is a really convenient whipping boy for all of the country's problems for so long because people just don't want to accept that their parents grandparents etc were complicit in allowing the church to have the negative influence on society that they had.

    By the way I'm not saying the church weren't to blame just that they weren't solely to blame.




    To speak against the Church was to invite the church to speak against yourself. Having been there and done that I can safely say that had I known how much damage that was going to do to me in terms of work opportunities in particular I would have kept my gob shut.


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  • #37
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Odhinn wrote: »
    To speak against the Church was to invite the church to speak against yourself. Having been there and done that I can safely say that had I known how much damage that was going to do to me in terms of work opportunities in particular I would have kept my gob shut.

    Very revealing post on many levels


  • #38
    sk8erboii
    Site Banned Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭sk8erboii


    Odhinn wrote: »
    To speak against the Church was to invite the church to speak against yourself. Having been there and done that I can safely say that had I known how much damage that was going to do to me in terms of work opportunities in particular I would have kept my gob shut.

    iTs NoT tHe ChUrChEs fAulT

    smh at apologists. They repressed irish society in such a malevolent and damaging way. Glad to see theyre dying out in this country


  • #39
    Marley and Marley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24 ✭Marley and Marley


    Odhinn wrote: »
    To speak against the Church was to invite the church to speak against yourself. Having been there and done that I can safely say that had I known how much damage that was going to do to me in terms of work opportunities in particular I would have kept my gob shut.

    And yet the people in Listowel stood up against this priest and got the woman a christian burial which tells you they weren't quite as all powerful as people like to think they were.

    If people in positions of influence stood up to the church they would have been powerless, people who could have done more to reduce their influence chose not to and decided to go along with what the church wanted.

    I understand it was a brave choice to go against the church back in the day but sadly far too many people in this country were far too cowardly for too long.


  • #40
    Marley and Marley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24 ✭Marley and Marley


    sk8erboii wrote: »
    iTs NoT tHe ChUrChEs fAulT

    smh at apologists. They repressed irish society in such a malevolent and damaging way. Glad to see theyre dying out in this country

    I don't think there are any apologists on this thread.

    The church were clearly wrong , however they only had power and influence because irish people let them.

    Sometimes more than one thing is true.


  • #41
    sk8erboii
    Site Banned Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭sk8erboii


    Marley and Marley wrote: »
    I don't think there are any apologists on this thread.

    The church were clearly wrong , however they only had power and influence because irish people let them.

    Sometimes more than one thing is true.

    Mate theres someone blaming the people who brought her to a catholic hospital and NOT the people who wouldnt let her in. On the first page


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  • #42
    Church on Tuesday
    Registered Users Posts: 3,858 ✭✭✭Church on Tuesday


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    One small observation. If Peggy McCarthy came from a family of 10, then Breda McCarthy must have had 9 aunts and uncles. Her remaining in an institution isn't entirely due to the church.

    Yeah all good little Catholics brainwashed by the church.

    Just because you share the same surname doesn't mean jot when you are pious trust me.


  • #43
    Fiery mutant
    Registered Users Posts: 1,553 ✭✭✭Fiery mutant


    The biggest shock, is that people still turn up at the doors of these institutions every Sunday.

    After all that religion has done to this country, this shocks me more than anything.

    We should defend our way of life to an extent that any attempt on it is crushed, so that any adversary will never make such an attempt in the future.



  • #44
    Edgware
    Registered Users Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Edgware


    Marley and Marley wrote: »
    And yet the people in Listowel stood up against this priest and got the woman a christian burial which tells you they weren't quite as all powerful as people like to think they were.

    If people in positions of influence stood up to the church they would have been powerless, people who could have done more to reduce their influence chose not to and decided to go along with what the church wanted.

    I understand it was a brave choice to go against the church back in the day but sadly far too many people in this country were far too cowardly for too long.
    Was it in Listowel that the neighbours queued up to shake hands will a local boyo convicted of a violent rape?


  • #45
    LirW
    Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    Fiery mutant wrote: »
    The biggest shock, is that people still turn up at the doors of these institutions every Sunday.

    After all that religion has done to this country, this shocks me more than anything.

    Even worse, they still baptise their children in order to get them in local schools and go mad over communion even though they never give a hoot about the church. It's also very important to get married in the church, but please make the mass as short as possible because they actually don't care about faith.


  • #46
    oceanman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,742 ✭✭✭oceanman


    what happened the girl was terrible but its a bit late being horrified about something that happened over 75 years ago!....


  • #47
    DS86DS
    Closed Accounts Posts: 691 ✭✭✭DS86DS


    This was by no means unique to Ireland. Actually, the Magdellen Laundries were founded and based on a similar system in operation in Victorian England.

    It was perhaps by no means an ideal arrangement, but just look at how degenerate our society, people and media have become without a strong moral force at play in society.

    The glorification of degeneracy and moral relativism has replaced the traditional system of morality in Ireland and other European societies.

    And are we all the better for it? Absolutely not, our degenerate and moral relativistic culture is heading the way of the Roman Empire - extinction.

    Remove a system of belief and sense of purpose and what you get is moral degeneracy and cultural and ethnic extinction through moral relativism and one world ideology where even religious leaders are afraid to state the path to salvation in case it might offend some of our newcomer friends.


  • #48
    rn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,056 ✭✭✭rn


    We need to be careful not to judge the past by the standards of the present.

    That said, the "good" old days were not as great as many believe.


  • #49
    goose2005
    Registered Users Posts: 4,798 ✭✭✭goose2005


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    The Irish Catholic bishops, clergy, nuns etc...who were they? they were irish people. Sons, daughters, brothers and sisters of ordinary irish families.

    There are horror stories about the RCC all over Europe but nowhere did the scale and cruelty match what happened here. It was an unholy alliance between church, state and citizenry that existed here and all three parts were made up of our forefathers. We need to own this.

    no, they were far worse in Spain


  • #50
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    No, she died because a useless lump of a lad knocked her up, and then fúcked off to England instead of marrying her.

    You shouldnt have to be married to get medical attention, is the point

    Crazy that there are lots of elderly people alive today who experienced an ireland that was like this


  • #51
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    DS86DS wrote: »
    This was by no means unique to Ireland. Actually, the Magdellen Laundries were founded and based on a similar system in operation in Victorian England.

    It was perhaps by no means an ideal arrangement, but just look at how degenerate our society, people and media have become without a strong moral force at play in society.

    The glorification of degeneracy and moral relativism has replaced the traditional system of morality in Ireland and other European societies.

    And are we all the better for it? Absolutely not, our degenerate and moral relativistic culture is heading the way of the Roman Empire - extinction.

    Remove a system of belief and sense of purpose and what you get is moral degeneracy and cultural and ethnic extinction through moral relativism and one world ideology where even religious leaders are afraid to state the path to salvation in case it might offend some of our newcomer friends.

    But they were hardly a 'moral' force


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  • #52
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,942 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    DS86DS wrote: »
    This was by no means unique to Ireland. Actually, the Magdellen Laundries were founded and based on a similar system in operation in Victorian England.

    It was perhaps by no means an ideal arrangement, but just look at how degenerate our society, people and media have become without a strong moral force at play in society.

    The glorification of degeneracy and moral relativism has replaced the traditional system of morality in Ireland and other European societies.

    And are we all the better for it? Absolutely not, our degenerate and moral relativistic culture is heading the way of the Roman Empire - extinction.

    Remove a system of belief and sense of purpose and what you get is moral degeneracy and cultural and ethnic extinction through moral relativism and one world ideology where even religious leaders are afraid to state the path to salvation in case it might offend some of our newcomer friends.


    This would be the child raping, lying, self aggrandising hypocritical irish catholic church you're referring to? I presume you're just being a bit of a WUM.


  • #53
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    the_syco wrote: »
    Oh, and is history still optional, but religion mandatory?


    Religion is optional. You really need to keep up with the facts and leave your "rage" behind.


  • #54
    Church on Tuesday
    Registered Users Posts: 3,858 ✭✭✭Church on Tuesday


    DS86DS wrote: »
    This was by no means unique to Ireland. Actually, the Magdellen Laundries were founded and based on a similar system in operation in Victorian England.

    It was perhaps by no means an ideal arrangement, but just look at how degenerate our society, people and media have become without a strong moral force at play in society.

    The glorification of degeneracy and moral relativism has replaced the traditional system of morality in Ireland and other European societies.

    And are we all the better for it? Absolutely not, our degenerate and moral relativistic culture is heading the way of the Roman Empire - extinction.

    Remove a system of belief and sense of purpose and what you get is moral degeneracy and cultural and ethnic extinction through moral relativism and one world ideology where even religious leaders are afraid to state the path to salvation in case it might offend some of our newcomer friends.


    There was plenty of degenerate activity in those oh so moral times too,rampant in fact, it was just kept hushed, hidden and away from public view.


    Well the Romans had embraced Christanity by the time of the fall of the Empire, if any thing it made them complacent and removed the fire in their belly.


  • #55
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,707 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Sad as it is, this is the RCC (and their brainwashed enablers) being a bunch of **** shocker.


  • #56
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    They had taxis in 1946?

    Learn something new everyday.


  • #57
    goose2005
    Registered Users Posts: 4,798 ✭✭✭goose2005


    Soyboy Outburst wrote: »
    Time to move on lads, the Church bashing gets old.

    unlike Peggy McCarthy


  • #58
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,707 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Soyboy Outburst wrote: »
    The self hate of Irish people is tragic and peculiar. You don't see too many jews and Muslims raging against their faiths.

    We are to feel proud about the church why exactly? Hasn't really covered itself in glory.


  • #59
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Everyone looks back
    First it was the English’s fault
    We got rid of them
    Then it was the church’s fault for everything
    Kind of got rid of them

    Problem is the whole place is still a disaster. we are screwing every single person over and over again, health system is a disaster but you have our leader posting about sending 100 million to other countries.....what do the Irish people do? Nothing

    Who will we blame in a few years?

    Blame the church all you want but every single Irish person knew exactly what was going on and allowed it...still do today


  • #60
    washman3
    Registered Users Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    Edgware wrote: »
    Was it in Listowel that the neighbours queued up to shake hands will a local boyo convicted of a violent rape?

    Let us not forget the Kerry babies case in 1984, where members of the infamous Garda Heavy Gang forced a confession out of Joanne Hayes and her family admitting to the murder of a newborn baby boy found washed up on a beach in Cahirciveen, some 80kms from their home in Abberdorney, which incidentally is not far from Listowel. Joanne had given birth to a stillborn baby whom she buried on the family farm. She readily admitted this to Gardaí but in their wisdom they still,rather than admit their wrong,proceeded to convince everyone that Joanne was the mother of both babies and murdered both. Modern DNA has vindicated the entire Hayes family. Yet,to this day one of the main players of the Heavy Gang still disputes this and sticks by his original outlandish theory.
    He is Gerry O'Carroll, a regular on the Joe Duffy show, giving his opinions on modern day criminality.!! I kid you not.
    He is from Listowel and would have grown up knowing all about the Peggy McCarthy story,yet proceeded to treat a young woman like this almost 40 years later.
    So it wasn't the RCC alone that abused their power. They were just another player in something that was rotten to the core.
    Incidentally, the 4 Heavy Gang leaders took a case against the publishers of a book on the Kerry Babies and were awarded around £30k each by their buddies in the judicial system,another rotten to the core organisation.
    The mind boggles.


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  • #61
    tretorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭tretorn


    What is the relevance of this sad story.

    It harks back to a time when times in rural Ireland were very poor and no one got an education. What happened then is what happens now in Muslim countries, in some of these countries you will be stoned to death for being seen with a man who isnt related, you might as well kill yourself quickly if you ever found yourself pregnant and unmarried, your own family would literally throw petrol on you and set you on fire. Bad and all as it was in Ireland the Priest never had as much control as the Imans and Irish people did eventually throw off the shackles when we joined the European Union and when free education was introduced.

    Why is the church being blamed for Peggys child ending up in an institution, she had nine Aunts and Uncles and maybe sixty first cousins, why didnt any of them give her a home. She would have gone to an institution because there was no where else to go once her Grandparents died.

    Lets move on and leave this stuff in the past. Lets leave the Tuam babies were they are too and not spend trillions of taxpayers money moving them. I know Zappone is beside herself thinking of all the photo oportunities digging up the bodies will provide her but lets face it none of the families cared about these babies either, thats why they ended up in Tuam too.


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