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Las Vegas Raiders Thread

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  • Registered Users Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Kev8360


    eire4 wrote: »
    That is putting it mildly. Think it will be back to 500 at 6-6 after another heavy defeat next week. Really disappointing given a win would really have put the Raiders in the hunt for a wild card spot but the reality is probably what I felt at the start of the season that yes there was clear improvement but still no where enough to actually challenge as a legit playoff team yet.


    Yes I was trying to keep it PG. I was over in New York this weekend and managed to get tickets to see that with a mate and it was embarrassing - the weather didn’t help much but stayed to the bitter end. My record for raiders games attended is not good (0-3) so will probably stay away for a while :)

    Before the season I had us down for a 7-9 season best case due to the schedule and the number of changes we made.

    We are still on for that and more if we can respond well to this game but agreed we will most likely be 6-6 after next week.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭golfball37


    Sunday was a step back alright but we’ve already won more games than I expected this year. I had us down at best 4-12.


  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    We got a dose of reality after the Bengals game. Its been a pleasant surprise of a season so far, we shouldnt forget that but we have serious deficiencies and whilst its nice to dream of the playoffs we probably wont make it this year. The Defense wont hold up in a playoff game and that puts too much pressure on the Offense. As golfball said, we've already won more games than I expected and I'm pleased to see that there is progress. And what a rookie class we have! The signs are mostly positive. The only thing that really bothers me is the way the media keep dragging up the "is Carr good enough" discussion. We are never more than 1 quarter away from that discussion every week with the media and certain elements of the fanbase.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Kev8360 wrote: »
    Yes I was trying to keep it PG. I was over in New York this weekend and managed to get tickets to see that with a mate and it was embarrassing - the weather didn’t help much but stayed to the bitter end. My record for raiders games attended is not good (0-3) so will probably stay away for a while :)

    Before the season I had us down for a 7-9 season best case due to the schedule and the number of changes we made.

    We are still on for that and more if we can respond well to this game but agreed we will most likely be 6-6 after next week.

    Ahh so there we have it now. Its all your fault because you went to the game last weekend.... seriously though I feel for you not often you get to actually go see the Raiders and then you show up and have to watch that fiasco. It was not a surprise to me the Raiders lost weekend given how bad the Raiders do on the east coast but that was a joke.
    Personally for me I felt it would be a 6-10 season at best maybe worse improvement but no where near a playoff team yet never mind an actual challenger. Again no question the team has improved but still a long ways to go but it would be a boost morale wise going forward if the Raiders could get to 8-8 for the season.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    We got a dose of reality after the Bengals game. Its been a pleasant surprise of a season so far, we shouldnt forget that but we have serious deficiencies and whilst its nice to dream of the playoffs we probably wont make it this year. The Defense wont hold up in a playoff game and that puts too much pressure on the Offense. As golfball said, we've already won more games than I expected and I'm pleased to see that there is progress. And what a rookie class we have! The signs are mostly positive. The only thing that really bothers me is the way the media keep dragging up the "is Carr good enough" discussion. We are never more than 1 quarter away from that discussion every week with the media and certain elements of the fanbase.

    Agreed on everything you say there. Especially the obsession about Carr. Again as I have said before sure he is not in the NFL class of elite QB's. But he is in that next tier and there are way more issues for the Raiders to fix on both sides of the ball then who is the QB. Getting Carr a legit top level WR to throw to as well as a legit pass rusher strike me as big needs certainly way ahead of QB.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Kev8360


    Well I wasn't expecting a win in KC but a lot of poor discipline on our side really made it easy for them to come away with the win. We are bare bones in the secondary at the moment with all the injuries and it really showed - we couldn't stop them on 3rd down all night.

    On the plus side it was great to see Josh Jacobs crack 1000 yards for the season - he is right up there in rookie of the year contention.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Kev8360 wrote: »
    Well I wasn't expecting a win in KC but a lot of poor discipline on our side really made it easy for them to come away with the win. We are bare bones in the secondary at the moment with all the injuries and it really showed - we couldn't stop them on 3rd down all night.

    On the plus side it was great to see Josh Jacobs crack 1000 yards for the season - he is right up there in rookie of the year contention.

    No doubt about it expected a loss in that one but the lack of discipline absolutely killed the Raiders chances. It certainly is still a massive area that Gruden needs to sort out as Sunday was not an aberration. It is quite clearly one of the teams biggest weak spots.


  • Registered Users Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Kev8360


    Well last night was about typical for how this season has gone. First half we were well in control and the defense kept the Jags quiet and the running game was purring - not converting any red-zones chances to TD's was a big red flag though. We must not do adjustments in the half time because nothing worked second half at all.

    I think Mike Mayock may be looking for some new WRs in the draft as well - our depth/quality there is so shallow every defense knows the ball isn't going more than 5yds down the field to a TE or RB.


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,334 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Kev8360 wrote:
    I think Mike Mayock may be looking for some new WRs in the draft as well - our depth/quality there is so shallow every defense knows the ball isn't going more than 5yds down the field to a TE or RB.
    I think hell be looking for offensive lineman first. No use getting a shiny new sports car if your QB hasn't enough time to throw the ball.


  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    Kev8360 wrote: »
    Well last night was about typical for how this season has gone. First half we were well in control and the defense kept the Jags quiet and the running game was purring - not converting any red-zones chances to TD's was a big red flag though. We must not do adjustments in the half time because nothing worked second half at all.

    I think Mike Mayock may be looking for some new WRs in the draft as well - our depth/quality there is so shallow every defense knows the ball isn't going more than 5yds down the field to a TE or RB.
    Agreed about the WR situation. Its awful. We need at least two to bring the standard up.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Agreed about the WR situation. Its awful. We need at least two to bring the standard up.

    Totally agreed. 2 are needed no question and really one needs to be at least at a higher level they Williams who is a decent player but never a number 1 WR. Help needed on the OL as well no question but without a doubt IMHO getting in 2 WR's and one at least a legit number 1 is a must on the offensive side of the ball.


  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    eire4 wrote: »
    Totally agreed. 2 are needed no question and really one needs to be at least at a higher level they Williams who is a decent player but never a number 1 WR. Help needed on the OL as well no question but without a doubt IMHO getting in 2 WR's and one at least a legit number 1 is a must on the offensive side of the ball.
    Whilst we have this need, its nice to see that we are set at TE and RB for a number of seasons, injury notwithstanding. QB too is not an area of concern (despite the media's obsession) and I think there are possibilities for getting at least one WR during Free Agency. I think the draft will have to be Defense orientated again as it has shown to be a paper tiger. The return of Abrams will help but it seems like years since we had a top class linebacker and we really need help in that area also.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Whilst we have this need, its nice to see that we are set at TE and RB for a number of seasons, injury notwithstanding. QB too is not an area of concern (despite the media's obsession) and I think there are possibilities for getting at least one WR during Free Agency. I think the draft will have to be Defense orientated again as it has shown to be a paper tiger. The return of Abrams will help but it seems like years since we had a top class linebacker and we really need help in that area also.

    In total agreement with you again. I really don't know what the deal with Carr is at all. Sure he is not Mahomes, Jackson, Rodgers or Brady but outside that elite tier he is in that next tier of above average QB's and clearly on the offensive side of things getting in 2 WR's is number 1 priority with the OL as number 2 and as you say in the draft a focus on the defensive side of the ball is still very much a priority with numerous needs there all over that side of the ball.

    At this point I have a mixed view on the last 2 games. On one hand it would be nice to win both and get to an 8-8 season which would be a very solid showing but then on the other side lose both games and that would guarantee the Raiders have a top 10 pick in the draft plus a second round 1 pick likely in the late teens from Chicago. Naturally I would rather win both games and finish a respectable 8-8 but if the Raiders lose Sunday then I think it would be best to just move on and lose again the following week to ensure a top 10 draft pick.


  • Registered Users Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Kev8360


    Welcome back Hunter Renfrow - oh how we have missed you!


  • Registered Users Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Kev8360


    Well the 99 million things that needed to happen for us to make the playoffs didn't quite fall our way but 7-9 is an improvement (considering we had one of the toughest strength of schedule coming in to the season and a brutal 5 game streak away from home).

    Some positives to take from the season:
    Josh Jacobs a legit RB1 - 1150yds rushing and 7 TDs despite missing 3 games
    Darren Waller - 1145yd TE(2nd in NFL behind Travis Kelce)
    Max Crosby - 10 sack season
    Hunter Renfrow - looked the part as a slot possesion receiver and made some big plays down the stretch after coming back from injury

    All Rookies or first year with the club . Good to see that Richie Incognito was resigned as he played well all year.

    Defense and some help at WR is still a major priority to build on. We have some injured players returning (Jonathon Abram, Karl Joseph) and suspension (Burfict - if the league lets him back in) but lots still to be done to make it competitive with the top tier teams. Need to hit on another Draft class and also with the new stadium maybe we can attract some quality free agents.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Kev8360 wrote: »
    Well the 99 million things that needed to happen for us to make the playoffs didn't quite fall our way but 7-9 is an improvement (considering we had one of the toughest strength of schedule coming in to the season and a brutal 5 game streak away from home).

    Some positives to take from the season:
    Josh Jacobs a legit RB1 - 1150yds rushing and 7 TDs despite missing 3 games
    Darren Waller - 1145yd TE(2nd in NFL behind Travis Kelce)
    Max Crosby - 10 sack season
    Hunter Renfrow - looked the part as a slot possesion receiver and made some big plays down the stretch after coming back from injury

    All Rookies or first year with the club . Good to see that Richie Incognito was resigned as he played well all year.

    Defense and some help at WR is still a major priority to build on. We have some injured players returning (Jonathon Abram, Karl Joseph) and suspension (Burfict - if the league lets him back in) but lots still to be done to make it competitive with the top tier teams. Need to hit on another Draft class and also with the new stadium maybe we can attract some quality free agents.

    Agreed overall based on what expectations were going into the season it was a positive going in the right direction season. Also agree with you the defense and a genuine number 1 WR remains the priority to improve for next season. Some help on the OL as well. Will be a very interesting off season for the Raiders.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,030 ✭✭✭heyjude


    There couldn't be a worse Super Bowl matchup for Raider fans, a choice between their bitter cross bay rivals who wouldn't share a stadium with them or allow them to play in SF(when that was being considered, while the new LV stadium was being built), coached by the son of long time Raider nemesis Mike Shanahan and their bitterest division rivals, the Kansas City Chiefs, who if they win tonight could be set for years of divisional domination.

    So who do you support ?

    One interesting stat suggests that Raider fans should become 49er fans for a few hours. In the 54 year history of the Super Bowl, only three quarterbacks have come back to win a Super Bowl after losing in their first Super Bowl appearance. The three successful quarterbacks were Len Dawson(Chiefs), who lost Super Bowl I and won Super Bowl IV, Bob Griese who lost Super Bowl VI, but won Super Bowl VII and VIII and John Elway, who lost three Super Bowls before winning two.

    In the Super Bowl era, Fran Tarkenton, Craig Morton and Jim Kelly are the only other QBs to even reach another Super Bowl after losing in their first one.

    So history suggests that if Patrick Mahomes loses tonight, then he maybe he might never win one. The Chiefs may be set up for success now, but things change quickly and Mahomes is still on a low cost rookie contract and when that expires it will be much harder to assemble a competitive team around him.

    Teams that lose a Super Bowl often struggle afterwards, so maybe thats the best we can hope for, as we build towards making a playoff run ourselves.


  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    Anyone else tired of the media constantly looking to have Carr traded? I mean I know this time of the season is quiet but its getting ridiculous, the amount of "Carr" related posts/Tweets/Articles that are constantly written.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭MrKingsley


    Anyone else tired of the media constantly looking to have Carr traded? I mean I know this time of the season is quiet but its getting ridiculous, the amount of "Carr" related posts/Tweets/Articles that are constantly written.

    I’m tuning out of the off season for once. Have said it before that Carr is not our biggest issue by a long stretch. What good is it signing a new QB if we just have to rely on an RB and TE again. Need a proper number 1 receiver at the least. And that’s not even looking at the OL or D.

    I know it’s a silly argument but if everyone on the roster played to Carr’s level we’d be in the playoffs more often than not


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    MrKingsley wrote: »
    I’m tuning out of the off season for once. Have said it before that Carr is not our biggest issue by a long stretch. What good is it signing a new QB if we just have to rely on an RB and TE again. Need a proper number 1 receiver at the least. And that’s not even looking at the OL or D.

    I know it’s a silly argument but if everyone on the roster played to Carr’s level we’d be in the playoffs more often than not

    Totally agree with you guys. QB is so far down the list of areas where the Raiders can upgrade it is insane why there is any talk about replacing Carr at all. A true number 1 WR is the biggest offensive issue by far IMHO while the issues on the defensive side of the ball are to say the least lengthy and all vastly bigger areas of need to upgrade then QB.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    The amount of muck spouted by some Raiders fans is almost embarrassing. The clamour for Brady or the likes of Bridgewater/Winston/Mariota is embarrassing. Brady is about to fall off the cliff of time ( Not even he can stop that happening), if he was so good surely the Patriots would just Franchise tag him? and as for the other 3 I just dont see them being an upgrade thats worth giving up cap space for. As you say, lads, WR and Defense is of paramount importance this offseason.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    The amount of muck spouted by some Raiders fans is almost embarrassing. The clamour for Brady or the likes of Bridgewater/Winston/Mariota is embarrassing. Brady is about to fall off the cliff of time ( Not even he can stop that happening), if he was so good surely the Patriots would just Franchise tag him? and as for the other 3 I just dont see them being an upgrade thats worth giving up cap space for. As you say, lads, WR and Defense is of paramount importance this offseason.

    Totally agree. Brady one of the all time greats in the game no question but his time is passed. Probably best for himself to ride into the sunset now. While the others well the most generous I can say is that maybe Winston on his best day is better then Carr but he is wildly inconsistent and one of Carr's strengths is he is consistently solid. Again zero question a true legit number 1 WR and defensive help is by a million miles the priority heading into next season.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,990 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    The Patriots don't have the option to franchise tag Brady, and though surely his fall off the cliff is going to come sooner rather than later at this stage it has been predicted for many a year at this stage. Also, the GOAT is more appropriate than ATG.

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,030 ✭✭✭heyjude


    Finally the draft has arrived, getting tired of all the click-bait stories about how the Raiders are trading one or both of their picks for miscontents on other teams or stories about how they would 'love' to draft player X or Y because they are the fastest player at their position(are they aware that Al Davis died years ago, so that type of drafting has long since passed too).

    I just hope that GM Mike Mayock doesn't have to use up too many picks on new toys for Gruden to play with. They already have Carr, Mariota and Peterman, so spending an early pick on another QB should be out of the question, and the same applies with Waller, Moreau, Witten, Butler et al being more than adequate at tight end, especially given the weakness of this years' TE draft class.

    Mayock would undoubtedly love to trade down to gain an extra pick or two in rounds 2 and/or 3, but with the supposed depth of talent this year, it seems more people want to trade down than trade up, so the compensation for dropping down might not be that great as teams compete for trade partners.

    A couple of players linked with the Raiders make me nervous, I haven't seen much of Ruggs, but one site in comparing him to a current NFL player compared him to Darius Herward Bey(yikes!!!), while the 2nd rated cornerback prospect DJ Henderson is supposed to be a weak tackler, so unless his coverage skills mirror Deion Sanders, that would be a problem.

    Whoever they choose, they need playmakers, especially on defence where Maxx Crosby was the only player to make things happen last year. Adams was injured for almost the entire season and may help, but they need far more than solid players on defence if they are going to slow Mahomes and co. They lack a number one WR too and in the later rounds they could do with finding a real speedster that can contribute on special teams and stretch the field on offence as well.

    I just hope they stay put and take the best non QB or offensive tackle at 12, and as I see it, an impact linebacker is more valuable than the 3rd or 4th choice corner at 19. If they do trade, then drop from 19 into the 20s and get a few extra picks that could be packaged with 1 or more of their 3 third round picks, to possibly move back up into the 2nd.

    I wonder would they even consider trading for picks next year, due to the uncertainty about whether the 2020 NFL and NCAA seasons will go ahead as planned ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    heyjude wrote: »
    Finally the draft has arrived, getting tired of all the click-bait stories about how the Raiders are trading one or both of their picks for miscontents on other teams or stories about how they would 'love' to draft player X or Y because they are the fastest player at their position(are they aware that Al Davis died years ago, so that type of drafting has long since passed too).

    I just hope that GM Mike Mayock doesn't have to use up too many picks on new toys for Gruden to play with. They already have Carr, Mariota and Peterman, so spending an early pick on another QB should be out of the question, and the same applies with Waller, Moreau, Witten, Butler et al being more than adequate at tight end, especially given the weakness of this years' TE draft class.

    Mayock would undoubtedly love to trade down to gain an extra pick or two in rounds 2 and/or 3, but with the supposed depth of talent this year, it seems more people want to trade down than trade up, so the compensation for dropping down might not be that great as teams compete for trade partners.

    A couple of players linked with the Raiders make me nervous, I haven't seen much of Ruggs, but one site in comparing him to a current NFL player compared him to Darius Herward Bey(yikes!!!), while the 2nd rated cornerback prospect DJ Henderson is supposed to be a weak tackler, so unless his coverage skills mirror Deion Sanders, that would be a problem.

    Whoever they choose, they need playmakers, especially on defence where Maxx Crosby was the only player to make things happen last year. Adams was injured for almost the entire season and may help, but they need far more than solid players on defence if they are going to slow Mahomes and co. They lack a number one WR too and in the later rounds they could do with finding a real speedster that can contribute on special teams and stretch the field on offence as well.

    I just hope they stay put and take the best non QB or offensive tackle at 12, and as I see it, an impact linebacker is more valuable than the 3rd or 4th choice corner at 19. If they do trade, then drop from 19 into the 20s and get a few extra picks that could be packaged with 1 or more of their 3 third round picks, to possibly move back up into the 2nd.

    I wonder would they even consider trading for picks next year, due to the uncertainty about whether the 2020 NFL and NCAA seasons will go ahead as planned ?


    IMHO the 12th pick should be spent on the best defensive player available at that point. There are so many needs on defense for the Raiders that I would simply take the best defensive player still on the board with that pick. The second first round pick I would go for a WR at that point as the Raiders really need to find a true number 1 WR. I would then largely focus on the defensive side of things in subsequent rounds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Kev8360


    Well the one thing I took from this draft is that Derek Carr’s position is safe this year - picks were made to bolster the offense and secondary. an edge rusher to help Max Crosby would have been good but let’s see what these guys can do.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Kev8360 wrote: »
    Well the one thing I took from this draft is that Derek Carr’s position is safe this year - picks were made to bolster the offense and secondary. an edge rusher to help Max Crosby would have been good but let’s see what these guys can do.

    You would think this us the year for Carr to have an impact year. He has the weapons now on offense. At least on paper he does. The big question though is on the defense that still looks weak and likely will be what does the Raiders in next season. Hard to say at this point but I would think the goal next season must be to at least have a winning season at 9-7 maybe 10-6 and maybe a wildcard spot.


  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    Well they are all in on this Receiving Corps, thats for sure. 3 picks on WR, that has definitely restocked that part of the roster but I'm still unsure about the state of the D going into camp. At least we know they are happy with QB now.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,594 ✭✭✭eire4


    Well they are all in on this Receiving Corps, thats for sure. 3 picks on WR, that has definitely restocked that part of the roster but I'm still unsure about the state of the D going into camp. At least we know they are happy with QB now.

    Agreed. On paper at least the offense should be pretty good. How far the Raiders go though next year will depend on the defense and to me that looks pretty iffy at best. The hope I guess would be that a significantly improved offense can at least get the Raiders from 7-9 to maybe 9-7 or 10-6 and a wildcard spot maybe which would be good progress especially if the last 15 years is the big picture your judging things from.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Prefab Sprouter


    eire4 wrote: »
    Agreed. On paper at least the offense should be pretty good. How far the Raiders go though next year will depend on the defense and to me that looks pretty iffy at best. The hope I guess would be that a significantly improved offense can at least get the Raiders from 7-9 to maybe 9-7 or 10-6 and a wildcard spot maybe which would be good progress especially if the last 15 years is the big picture your judging things from.
    After years of false dawnI have literally no expectations this season. As ever, I want us to be competitive and I would prefer to see us relevant at christmas. I do think the Defense has potential and our schedule doesnt look as hard as last years but this is the Raiders so....we'll win 1 or 2 matches that everyone wrote off as being lost causes, lose some that on paper we probably could have won and the rest will be either hard fought wins or blowouts for the opposition. But I still love my Raiders as much as ever!!!


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