Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Dublin Bus selling some of its VTs

1356789

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    There are occasions where if we open the rear doors people shoot on and make a run for the stairs.

    With only 4 checkers for over a 1000 buses this is just too much put on each driver.

    I don't know how many go ahead have but I'm really hoping it's more then 4 oh and 1 of those is in a car.....

    But I thought fare evasion wasn't something drivers were responsible and if people got on the middle doors without paying then there wouldn't be any repercussions on said driver.

    I yet to see GAI advertise for ticket inspectors. Maybe they'll do hire some when they have more routes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 759 ✭✭✭testarossa40


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    9 hybrids are to be trialled 3 of each type. Will be based Conyngham Road and will operate on the 25a/b
    Which types are being trialled? Presumably Wrights Gemini-based among them?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Which types are being trialled? Presumably Wrights Gemini-based among them?

    I didn't hear that myself. My guess would be 3 from Wrights, 3 from Alexander Dennis and another three from another bus builder perhaps MCV/Volvo.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    I do hope whatever they are that they are better then the sg


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,380 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    6 pages in and no one knows what price range these will fetch when sold ?


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    listermint wrote: »
    6 pages in and no one knows what price range these will fetch when sold ?

    Sealed bid tender,so it's entirely up to the market.

    The issue here is the lack of past "ball-park" figures to go on,with only a handful of tri-axles ever appearing here,and long ago at that.

    My guess is that they are already being factored in to some company's peak capacity express service,possibly reclassified in zero standee mode.

    Either way,there's plenty of revenue earning service left in them yet.


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,120 ✭✭✭shanec1928


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    9 hybrids are to be trialled 3 of each type. Will be based Conyngham Road and will operate on the 25a/b
    great to get some new buses on the 25a/b route no doubt they won’t run due to operational issues that seem to plague the route


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,284 ✭✭✭dublinman1990


    There's a Youtube video here of London's new tri-axle bus doing it's trials on the 12 route.



    I found few photographs here also on Flickr.

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/jashenl/45701391012/in/faves-81709772@N07/

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/jashenl/31880025578/in/faves-81709772@N07/


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Cool, looks like a decent bus. Though the stop button on the back of the seat is a little strange.

    One thing that strikes me is that you can hear the EV motor kick in accelerating out of the stops and for most of the video the Diesel engine doesn't sound like it is running, so mostly running EV between many of those stops. Shows the benefits of hybrid on a city bus, in particular in a city center location with lots of close stops and a big battery like this bus has, nice.

    In the pictures he mentions:
    The extra seats are a bonus, the bus is nippy and it doesn’t feel heavy, it can pull away quick too!

    A big heavy coach based tri-axle with an underpowered Euro 6 engine feels nippy! Again this shows the benefits of hybrids and EV's, their powerful torque is ideal for a city bus with lots of stop and starts. Hybrids go a long way to solving bus drivers complaints of modern Euro 6 engined buses feeling light and underpowered.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    One major issue I see right away is the front lights(dipped beam) are way too low and that will be an issue.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Alexander Dennis have now launched the new Enviro 400XLB tri axle for Lothian Buses in Edinburgh. Have to say it looks quite nice and I would personally prefer it to the one's which were bought for London. This bus is a bit larger than the VTs and can carry 131 with 100 seats. Although I'm not mad on the style of seats on these

    https://www.alexander-dennis.com/media/news/2018/november/100-seats-for-lothian-in-new-three-axle-adl-enviro400xlb-on-volvo-chassis/


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    If I had the money to buy them I would run a service from Wicklow to say sandyford if the n11 could have a bus lane and have it that there is a park and ride set up.
    Have it seated only and run as a trial.
    Something needs doing on that road and now not years down the road.

    So many cars going the same way mostly every day.


  • Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭haulier


    Maybe connect LUAS BRIDES GLEN to DART [ around SHANGANNAGH JUNCTION via the original route - forget about all the additions to Bray, etc for the present ] That would give an alternative route to CHERRYWOOD/ Sandyford I.E.[ & N. Wicklow ] from both sides.

    If people want to use their own transport, grand - but there would be an option.

    What distance is it ?? - maybe 2 miles - most of the route is still there.

    Of course, this leaves out the main problem on the N11 - it's [public transport ] a great idea for everyone else - if they used public transport, I could fly into town in half an hour !!!

    This doesn't only apply to the N11


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Alexander Dennis have now launched the new Enviro 400XLB tri axle for Lothian Buses in Edinburgh. Have to say it looks quite nice and I would personally prefer it to the one's which were bought for London. This bus is a bit larger than the VTs and can carry 131 with 100 seats. Although I'm not mad on the style of seats on these

    https://www.alexander-dennis.com/media/news/2018/november/100-seats-for-lothian-in-new-three-axle-adl-enviro400xlb-on-volvo-chassis/
    The Enviro400XLB shares its body structure with the market-leading two-axle Enviro400, which has been designed for the requirements of British and Irish bus operators

    Interesting tidbit their.

    Having said that, no mention of hybrid, just Euro 6, so a non starter here now.

    The London one seems much better is terms of environment.

    Even if you don't care about the Environment, the London hybrid one likely accelerates much faster given the electric motor, nice for drivers.

    Great though to see options appear on the market, leave hope that we could get some here.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    bk wrote: »
    Interesting tidbit their.

    Having said that, no mention of hybrid, just Euro 6, so a non starter here now.

    The London one seems much better is terms of environment.

    Even if you don't care about the Environment, the London hybrid one likely accelerates much faster given the electric motor, nice for drivers.

    Great though to see options appear on the market, leave hope that we could get some here.

    Considering the regular Enviro 400 is available as a hybrid model I would assume that the XLB could have a hybrid version built also if it was specified by the NTA.

    I am sceptical of the build quality and durability of the London tri axle tbh. Considering it's a coach body which has been modified with city bus parts while the Enviro 400XLB is built to be a city bus. Although the Enviro 400s aren't of very good build quality themselves the DB EV class proves that but this bus is the first generation of Enviro 400. However I believe the newer generation of Enviro 400 have better build quality and are probably on a par with the SGs in terms of build quality.

    I don't know but I'm not sure how good these London tri axles are considering they are built by a Chinese manufacturer who virtually unknown in this part of the world.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    First batch of VTs have already been withdrawn starting from today. They have been replaced by a number of SGs which have large TFI logos on them similar to Go-Ahead buses but they are still in DB livery other than that and not TFI livery for some reason. Have to say I was an 05 VT a few days ago on the 46a and it was still in very good nick.

    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1714545885317610&id=100374250068123


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    First batch of VTs have already been withdrawn starting from today. They have been replaced by a number of SGs which have large TFI logos on them similar to Go-Ahead buses but they are still in DB livery other than that and not TFI livery for some reason. Have to say I was an 05 VT a few days ago on the 46a and it was still in very good nick.

    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1714545885317610&id=100374250068123

    Will be missed honestly will.

    Much much more comfortable even then the 2007 ones and beats the SG any day.


  • Registered Users Posts: 407 ✭✭n!ghtmancometh


    Insanity not replacing them with similar capacity vehicles.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Will be missed honestly will.

    Much much more comfortable even then the 2007 ones and beats the SG any day.

    I was on one a few nights ago. Have to say the bus was still in very condition for one that's being withdrawn. As a driver though would they not be more awkward to manoveure fine on a straight run alone the N11 but a bit of a pain on the tighter streets around the city centre, DL, Bray and Phibsboro.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Insanity not replacing them with similar capacity vehicles.

    Yes but I should hope they'd be replaced by a larger quantity of regular sized vehicles rather than the same quantity. The N11 corridor which these operate on is due for a big increase in 2019 with the introduction of the new route 155.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    I was on one a few nights ago. Have to say the bus was still in very condition for one that's being withdrawn. As a driver though would they not be more awkward to manoveure fine on a straight run alone the N11 but a bit of a pain on the tighter streets around the city centre, DL, Bray and Phibsboro.

    Honestly I much prefer driving them over anything else.

    Great feedback on steering, loads of power and for a bus handled quite well.

    Of course in the wet or the snow they were tail happy or would like to kick out if you revved them out hard.

    Very comfortable even for the driver and just a pleasure to drive.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,284 ✭✭✭dublinman1990


    I was on VT15, probably for the last time, on the 46A last Wednesday night. I still not happy with Dublin Bus getting rid of them. If the NTA are looking for new tri-axles if they had the intention of replacing them; why not buy the new tri-axle buses that were purchased recently for Lothian in Edinburgh. 42 of them were purchased to run the city bus services for the LothianCity services in Edinburgh. These new buses have a total of 100 seats inside with a standing capacity of 130.

    http://transportdesigned.com/alexander-dennis-lothian-unveil-100-seat-monster-bus/

    enviro400xlb-2.jpg


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    I was on VT15, probably for the last time, on the 46A last Wednesday night. I still not happy with Dublin Bus getting rid of them. If the NTA are looking for new tri-axles if they had the intention of replacing them; why not buy the new tri-axle buses that were purchased recently for Lothian in Edinburgh. 42 of them were purchased to run the city bus services for the LothianCity services in Edinburgh. These new buses have a total of 100 seats inside with a standing capacity of 130.

    I see your point but if the NTA is willing to buy additional regular sized buses with enough drivers to drive them of course I think there wouldn't be too much issues getting rid of them. In the new year the new route 155 running along the N11 every 15 mins that should really add enough additional capacity to the corridors make up for the lose of some of the VTs whereas regular sized double deckers can be allocated to any route.

    The problem with the VTs was that they weren't very flexible as not all routes could handle them due to their length or even justify them capacity wise meaning that they are pretty much restricted to a handful of routes such the 39a, 46a and 145.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,201 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    How much would these buses be sold off at roughly?


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    mickdw wrote: »
    How much would these buses be sold off at roughly?

    The av type was around 25k.

    These should be more.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    I see your point but if the NTA is willing to buy additional regular sized buses with enough drivers to drive them of course I think there wouldn't be too much issues getting rid of them. In the new year the new route 155 running along the N11 every 15 mins that should really add enough additional capacity to the corridors make up for the lose of some of the VTs whereas regular sized double deckers can be allocated to any route.

    The problem with the VTs was that they weren't very flexible as not all routes could handle them due to their length or even justify them capacity wise meaning that they are pretty much restricted to a handful of routes such the 39a, 46a and 145.

    This is not the case.

    In fact,it is only a handful of routes which are unsuitable for VT operation.

    The NTA,appear to have been caught unprepared by their inability to keep up with developments in the High-Capacity Double Deck market.

    The insistance with persevering with the short-wheelbase B5 configuration,when operators such as Lothian went for the Longer Wheelbase configuration speaks volumes about the Authorities understanding of Operational Reality.

    Lothian have,very successfully,specified LWB vehicles,specifically for additional peak capacity,a sensible policy which continues today.

    Vlovo themselves,have also decided that this market sector is worth servicing once more..

    https://www.volvobuses.co.uk/en-gb/news/2018/oct/double-deck-bus-options-further-extended-with-introduction-of-new-volvo-b8l.html

    However,since NTA orders for B5's will continue to arrive well into Mid 2019,it's unlikely Dublin will see much in the way of such innovation before 2020.

    Instead,it appears that running TWO buses with TWO drivers to service a single departure,now represents the epitome of progress in NTA speak....

    https://www.goaheadireland.ie/timetable-changes-45a-45b-59-63-63a-75-75a-111-175
    The additional 0710 service from Citywest will no longer operate - Instead, the 0700 service from Citywest will be operated with two buses to cater for high levels of demand.

    Taken to it's extremes,this policy may not do much for Irelands CO2 emissions policy,nor indeed for route economics....:)


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    This is not the case.

    In fact,it is only a handful of routes which are unsuitable for VT operation.

    The NTA,appear to have been caught unprepared by their inability to keep up with developments in the High-Capacity Double Deck market.

    The insistance with persevering with the short-wheelbase B5 configuration,when operators such as Lothian went for the Longer Wheelbase configuration speaks volumes about the Authorities understanding of Operational Reality.

    Lothian have,very successfully,specified LWB vehicles,specifically for additional peak capacity,a sensible policy which continues today.

    Vlovo themselves,have also decided that this market sector is worth servicing once more..

    https://www.volvobuses.co.uk/en-gb/news/2018/oct/double-deck-bus-options-further-extended-with-introduction-of-new-volvo-b8l.html

    However,since NTA orders for B5's will continue to arrive well into Mid 2019,it's unlikely Dublin will see much in the way of such innovation before 2020.

    Instead,it appears that running TWO buses with TWO drivers to service a single departure,now represents the epitome of progress in NTA speak....

    https://www.goaheadireland.ie/timetable-changes-45a-45b-59-63-63a-75-75a-111-175

    Taken to it's extremes,this policy may not do much for Irelands CO2 emissions policy,nor indeed for route economics....:)

    When the VTs were first bought they were to be used exclusively at peak times M-F on the 46a which probably made sense at the time however this meant they were lying idle at weekends I think this was back when the DoT limited the size of the DB fleet. Yes they are good at peak times but the rest of the time which is most the time they are surplus to requirements as most departures could be easily worked by a smaller bus.

    Economics also tells us that when buying a box of corn flakes it's often better value for money to buy two regular sized boxes of cornflakes rather than a single family size box. I think it's better to have a larger quantity of regular sized buses than a smaller fleet wirh some larger buses. If they replace every VT with 1.5 regular sized buses that's still a considerable capacity increase. Dwell times are also awful on the VTs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    The av type was around 25k.

    These should be more.

    It would be nice to see one preserved.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    It would be nice to see one preserved.

    We should all contribute I would love to see one sent to the museum.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 1,383 ✭✭✭StreetLight


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    When the VTs were first bought they were to be used exclusively at peak times M-F on the 46a which probably made sense at the time however this meant they were lying idle at weekends.

    I don't know where you're getting that from. The VTs were first introduced to the 46A on a Sunday (18th of December 2005).


Advertisement