It's not April 1st is it?

thomasj · 12-02-2018 4:55pm #1

Satisfaction ratings provided by the NTA
https://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Infographic_NTA_customer_satisfaction.pdf

hots · 12-02-2018 5:04pm

Must be a spoof, the numbers are ludicrous and the last fact is duplicated within an inch of itself.

vectorvictor · 12-02-2018 5:07pm

thomasj wrote: »

Satisfaction ratings provided by the NTA
https://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Infographic_NTA_customer_satisfaction.pdf

Sample size is ridiculous. 2500 over six different transport methods.

So in summary they came to the conclusion that 98% of luas users are happy by asking 416 of the 37.6million passenger journeys in 2017

Billy86 · 12-02-2018 5:10pm

I'm going to go ahead and say it - even with the sample size negative feedback must have been deleted deliberately. Those numbers (Dublin Bus especially from the ones I use) simply cannot be accurate and I don't buy it for a second; doesn't help that the page reads like promotional material and not survey results.

magicbastarder · 12-02-2018 5:22pm

regardless of the sample size, an obvious question is how the users were selected.

Billy86 · 12-02-2018 5:43pm

And the wording of what they were asked.

Any friends I have had over from abroad wind up utterly shocked by our public transport - friendly service is typically commended (even if some bus drivers have a chip on their shoulder we're better than most there on average I find), but it's otherwise an absolute mess. In Sao Paulo, Brazil they had riots over their public transport (well overall corruption, but public transport was a central point of the protests), and I've had a few tell me Ireland's really is barely any better if at all.

testicles · 12-02-2018 6:14pm

This post has been deleted.

fritzelly · 12-02-2018 6:53pm

vectorvictor wrote: »

Sample size is ridiculous. 2500 over six different transport methods.

So in summary they came to the conclusion that 98% of luas users are happy by asking 416 of the 37.6million passenger journeys in 2017

You're assuming the numbers are divided equally
Of the 5 people getting off the Luas at 8pm that we asked...

vectorvictor · 12-02-2018 7:19pm

testicles wrote: »

There were 37.6 million unique passengers on the Luas in 2017 ? :cool:

I believe I said passenger journeys not passengers ☺

Jamie2k9 · 12-02-2018 7:30pm

Apart from Luas (clearly it was done before) system faults/delays have become a daily occurrence on both lines. Irish Rail not a major surprise however I expect N Commuter/Maynooth feelingis not reflected because its in with Intericity.

Better breakdown.
http://www.thejournal.ie/dart-passengers-commuters-survey-3848499-Feb2018/

Franz Von Peppercorn · 12-02-2018 7:32pm

Billy86 wrote: »

And the wording of what they were asked.

Any friends I have had over from abroad wind up utterly shocked by our public transport - friendly service is typically commended (even if some bus drivers have a chip on their shoulder we're better than most there on average I find), but it's otherwise an absolute mess. In Sao Paulo, Brazil they had riots over their public transport (well overall corruption, but public transport was a central point of the protests), and I've had a few tell me Ireland's really is barely any better if at all.

Very few tourists use Dublin bus so I don’t get that.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 12-02-2018 7:34pm

vectorvictor wrote: »

I believe I said passenger journeys not passengers ☺

But why would passenger journeys be relevant to the sample size?

Anyway 400 is an ok number for a sample, if random.

Billy86 · 12-02-2018 7:39pm

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Very few tourists use Dublin bus so I don’t get that.

The Brazilians lived over here, and with Dublin being so geographically small compared to other cities I've known people to book anywhere from Dundrum to Crumlin to near the airport, figuring that public transport would only have them about 20 mins from their door to the city centre. If only they knew! :pac:

Manach · 12-02-2018 7:44pm

Without an analysis of the sampling methods I could not specific the wrongs or rights of the survey results, but antedocally I reckon the satisfaction is too high.

somefeen · 12-02-2018 8:05pm

There's some holes in this alright.

75% said there is real time information at their regular stop.

Now I'm no statistician, but you generally get real time info at major train stations or routes that ar well maintained and busy.

So I'm kind of thinking that they made a point of surveying routes that they already knew would get good ratings.

How could so many people say there is real time info at their stop when so few stops have it?

Billy86 · 12-02-2018 8:39pm

Can't speak for Bus Eireann, but as a frequent user of Dublin Bus... no, just no.

Thankfully I don't study or work in town anymore, so no longer need to explain to my boss or lecturer that I was stood at the 16 bus stop (about 3-4 from the first stop) for over 90 minutes when it's supposed to come every 15-20, only to see four come flying by all at once... and then come back down all at once... all out of order. Or the alternative I used to have of fairly frequent taxis into college/work just to make sure I didn't get hammered in marking for attendance, or sacked.

Hilly Bill · 12-02-2018 9:10pm

thomasj wrote: »

Satisfaction ratings provided by the NTA
https://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Infographic_NTA_customer_satisfaction.pdf

You may just have to accept that from time to time that not everyone shares the same view point as you regarding public transport. There is more to the publics view than social media.

thomasj · 12-02-2018 9:26pm

I would accept these type of surveys if they released the methodology of these surveys to the public. info such as where the surveys took place and what questions were asked.

I would love to know that there was a good spread geographically surveyed and that its not the case that 90% surveyed use the 46A.

This is why people shrug off these surveys.

Hilly Bill · 12-02-2018 10:07pm

Would you question it if it shared your view point?

fly_agaric · 12-02-2018 10:54pm

This page has more detail for those interested, and links to a report (have not read it yet).

https://www.nationaltransport.ie/news/public-transport-gets-91-customer-satisfaction-rating/

Methodology

Conduct surveys of users of public transport to assess their level of satisfaction with service provision at an overall level and across a range of key metrics. Following a pilot phase in April 2017 we have focused on asking customers about their experience of usage “in general” rather than a specific journey.
•Face to face interviews with people aged 16+. Respondents recruited at stops/stations located throughout the country as they are waiting to board or alighting public transport services – interviews conducted using tablets with pre-programmed survey script.
•A total sample of 2,516 customers were interviewed, consisting of the following:
−Dublin Bus n=408
−Luas n=301
−Irish Rail InterCity and Commuter n=393
−DART n=202
−Bus Éireann n=925
−Private coaches n=287
•Data for the all public transport section has been weighted to reflect the number of passenger journeys. The all public transport data includes data for all modes of transport, excluding private buses.
•Fieldwork was conducted from early October until mid-November. No interviews for Irish Rail or DART were conducted during days of industrial action (1st and 7th November).
•We have weighted results for overall public transport by passenger numbers from the Authority’s website; this figure excludes results for private coaches.

I think you can conclude things from these kind of sample sizes once the sample is collected okay (to make it random i.e. representative of population you are sampling + not biased in some way). Smaller the sample I imagine, the more careful you must be about that. Also (health warning as have not read report) wondering about the face to face thing? Would it be a bit harder to gripe at a human and tell them you are not so happy with the service (!)

vectorvictor · 12-02-2018 11:12pm

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

But why would passenger journeys be relevant to the sample size?

Anyway 400 is an ok number for a sample, if random.

Pedantic much! If you feel 2.5 luas worth of pax is a good sample size over a year fair enough

Cookie_Monster · 12-02-2018 11:14pm

400 is too small, 1,000 is a pretty stand sample size, would have been easy to generate this for each mode type.
Without knowing the actual questions asked though I find it a pretty worthless survey, all depends what was asked and more importantly how it was asked.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 12-02-2018 11:17pm

vectorvictor wrote: »

Pedantic much! If you feel 2.5 luas worth of pax is a good sample size over a year fair enough

Yeh, but I understand statistics. 400 is enough to sample the US election to +- 5%, if randomly selected.

That doesn’t mean there aren’t other problems with the methodology. I can think of one obvious one - the people who stop are probably not in a rush. So this maybe excludes rush hour passengers. Or anybody who is late.

These are the ones less likely to be happy.

vectorvictor · 12-02-2018 11:18pm

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Yeh, but I understand statistics. 400 is enough to sample the US election to +- 5%, if randomly selected.

Well then youve proved your point that your cleverer than the rest of the world and can sleep well with your ego intact.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 12-02-2018 11:20pm

vectorvictor wrote: »

Well then youve proved your point that your cleverer than the rest of the world and can sleep well with your ego intact.

I know. I am all aglow.

fritzelly · 12-02-2018 11:25pm

The per transport survey respondents make a mockery of the results
40% of all surveyed were for the carrier of the least amount of passengers
Whereas DB had the same number surveyed as the train but carries 3 times the amount of passengers

Add in the weighting and who knows what the real result is - sure OAP's are probably under represented but you can boost their scores accordingly (free travel and all that)

fly_agaric · 12-02-2018 11:26pm

They say they did it "early October to mid November" so that is around about 46 days. For DB for example (408 surveys) they were doing around 9 passengers a day during that period so they would want to have been quite careful about design around times and locations etc. They should have given the text of the questions in report alright (you can get an idea I suppose from how they lay out results).

Stephen15 · 13-02-2018 12:34am

While DB may have it's flaws such as dwell times being the main one for me. For me anyway now this may be a case of geography and where I live but the services which are on my doorstep namely the 46a and the 145 I think they are excellent services fast than driving into town due to the QBCs and the buses are generally very frequent.

Billy86 · 13-02-2018 1:05am

Stephen15 wrote: »

While DB may have it's flaws such as dwell times being the main one for me. For me anyway now this may be a case of geography and where I live but the services which are on my doorstep namely the 46a and the 145 I think they are excellent services fast than driving into town due to the QBCs and the buses are generally very frequent.

Funny enough when the post above yours showed the low number of people being polled per day I almost posted that they waited for people getting off the 46A or 145 in the afternoon, e.g. outside of rush hour.

"So how was your sub-90 second wait for the two routes that each seems to have more buses servicing them than the rest of the city combined? Satisfactory? Wonder, tick the green box Johno we've got another!!"

Since the 15B/74A/whatever starts only 2-3 stops before Nassau St I used to go there after work to wait for it (this was before the realtime stuff so knowing when it was set to leave helped a bit, in theory anyway) and I can't tell you how irrationally under my skin it got to see what felt like 6-8 of them pass if I were waiting for 20-30 minutes on my own. As if the DART, Luas and other routes weren't enough!

ED E · 13-02-2018 1:10am

somefeen wrote: »

How could so many people say there is real time info at their stop when so few stops have it?

Loads of DB stops have it (nearly all??). All trains + DB + Luas = only BE draining the stats.

fritzelly · 13-02-2018 1:11am

I'm like that with the number 15's - there is a literally a plethora of them heading into the city and all the other buses real time info is nearly useless unless DB thinks 2 mins equals 5 mins or more

It's not April 1st is it?

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