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Cleaning Indian Sandstone Paving Slabs

  • 19-10-2009 10:14pm
    #1
    SPARTAN33
    Closed Accounts Posts: 131 ✭✭


    Hi Folks

    Hope someone can help, havent cleaned the patio Indian Sandstone paving in the back garden in a while so tried to start today with no great visible improvement, I used a cleaning product for paving areas and alot of scrubbing with not great reuslts. My problem is small groups of small black spots that seem to really discolour and are taking over the paving stones I think they might be lichens theres no flower on htem though just like kind of like ink spots they are more like stain spots on the sandstone slabs, Was wondering if there is another product I could use to get rid of them and clean up the paved area or would a power washer do the trick. Im sick of rubbing and scrubbing and getting no where. Those black spots or stains are hard to shift.

    Any help on these would be greatly appreciated


Comments

  • #2
    treesireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39 ✭treesireland


    sandstone is porus , algy and stuff will penatrat the stone. the only way to remove stains is by removing 1mm of the stone or more. if u have new sandstone and its clean and dry there are some products out there that seel the porus stone to prevent staning like u talk about. but i find these products make the sandstone slipy and do not last the test of time.


  • #3
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    .


    http://www.pavingexpert.com/maintain_02.htm#aml

    .
    .....the most helpful of websites when it comes to paving.:)



    .


  • #4
    treesireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39 ✭treesireland


    pardon the pun, the site u put up leves no stone unturned, i will keep the name it will be very helpfully to me thank u very much.


  • #5
    nanot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3 ✭nanot


    www.nanotechsolutions.ie


    Blackspot is hard to remove but desalin available from above or chlorus which is usually available at a farmers coop


  • #6
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Don't believe all you read. Pavingexpert recommends Glycophosphate for moss when in fact it will only kill a few types of moss.

    It is critical to seal it as soon as it is cleaned.


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  • #7
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    .



    actually they recommend glycophosphate as a standard moss killer instead of one containing ferrous sulphate which will cause colour change in the paving... when you take this in the context of all the advice given it is sound...they also have a great deal of information on sealing paving if you read further on:rolleyes:


    ....


  • #8
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Glycophosphate wont kill most mosses !. It is a systemic weed killer which translocates & depends on quite a large leaf area which mosses do not have. It would kill a sphagnum moss as this has a relatively large leaf. The main moss killers are based on tar acids. Armilartox is the most common but Jeyes Fluid is basically the same & much cheaper.

    The main problem with discolouration can come with people using bleach which is a very effective moss killer but you have to be very careful with dilution & overspray.


  • #9
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    Discodog wrote: »
    The main moss killers are based on tar acids. Armilartox is the most common but Jeyes Fluid is basically the same & much cheaper.

    .


    this from the paving expert website....

    "There are mosskillers that do not rely on ferrous sulphate. Armillotox is one such product that is popular with gardeners as it has pesticide properties that got it into trouble with the EU for a period, but it is now sold as a cleaner, rather than a pesticide. Jeyes' Fluid is another, similar product that may be more readily available. As far as is known, neither of these products has a deleterious effect on the paving itself."

    seems like sound advice when you read it!!(the complete article that is)


    .


  • #10
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    I was questioning their advice re glycophosphate !. If you want to use it then go ahead.


  • #11
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    Discodog wrote: »
    I was questioning their advice re glycophosphate !. If you want to use it then go ahead.


    and i was questioning your effort to pick things out of context to try and find fault with......personally i would follow their best advice which is "that most moss can be removed by sweeping and/or scraping".




    .


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  • #12
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Scrape away. I have 100 sq yds of mossed block to do tomorrow - I would be scraping for a week. Recommending a product to kill moss that will not kill most mosses is not taking something out of context & it didn't take a lot of effort to spot !.

    But as the author & I kind of know each other as we both post on a Pro Gardening forum I will ask him, just to satisfy my own curiosity. As someone who has been in this business for over 20 years I know that opinions vary. He will be pleased to know that his advice is being so avidly protected.


  • #13
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    ....

    so perhaps as a paving expert you can answer this.....what can you use to remove moss?... that does'nt contain ferrous sulphate, is not armillotox, or jeyes fluid, or bleach, but you are still set on using chemicals...the site goes into each of these methods in depth but says if you are still dead set on using chemicals... then - pathclear or glyphosate( a herbicide that kills some but not all mosses) will do the job without re-colouring the paving....not exactly a recommendation for using round-up would you agree?


    btw i have no vested interest in the site "pavingexpert" but i have found it useful for many years, just like tens of thousands of other people,






    .


  • #14
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    I am not a Paving expert. I design & maintain gardens. I will not be treating the drive tomorrow as rain is expected during tomorrow night. Every driveway is different. This one has good kerbing & drainage so I will use Jeyes Fluid.

    Moss/weeds should be a major consideration when selecting paving. The modern blocks have a bevelled edge that creates a v shaped trough that is perfect for moss & makes it really hard to remove. Once the moss is dead I will use a powered rotary brush to remove it.

    Copper can be effective. When i was working in the West of England we fitted copper wires to old stone slate roofs. Apparently it is a very old idea & relies on rainwater to dissolve tiny amounts of copper which washes down the roof. The idea has been copied by a company who make copper caps for roof ridges.

    I am thinking of incorporating something similar into the next driveway.


  • #15
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    Discodog wrote: »
    This one has good kerbing & drainage so I will use Jeyes Fluid.
    quote]

    excellent choice...as recommended by paving expert:)




    .


  • #16
    treesireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39 ✭treesireland


    oh lads what great bitch slaping. brill entertainment keep going.
    i think the last coment is wining. its a monday morning , cold, fing frizing,
    to day is my friday . and i realy anjoyed reading ur chat , well done lads, and thank you.
    and ps.
    a translocated chimical in its dsizne or makeup , dose not need a large surfus area to enter the plant, it simpely needs the right envirment .
    1. temp
    2. moistur
    3. day light


  • #17
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Ok we will bitch on !. A translocated chemical needs leaves !.


  • #18
    Sonnenblumen
    Registered Users Posts: 5,834 ✭✭✭Sonnenblumen


    Discodog wrote: »
    Don't believe all you read. Pavingexpert recommends Glycophosphate for moss when in fact it will only kill a few types of moss.

    It is critical to seal it as soon as it is cleaned.


    ...and don't believe all you read either. Sealing is not essential after installation and/or following routine maintenance.
    There are several solutions which do not cause staining etc for dealing with moss.


  • #19
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    I would always seal especially with Sandstone.


  • #20
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    Discodog wrote: »
    I would always seal especially with Sandstone.


    .i would tend to agree, both from a maintenance point and also with the quality (or lack of!) of the sandstone that has flooded into the market in the last few years...feathering of the surface from water ingress is a particular problem with poor quality sandstone.



    .


  • #21
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,818 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Hang on a minute why aren't you criticising Sonnen for not following the advice of paving expert :D

    How can we bitch if you start agreeing with me !.

    The joke is that one of the main pro gardening forums is often a big bitch fest as experts never agree & sometimes the mods have to pull them apart !


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  • #22
    dardevle
    Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭dardevle


    Discodog wrote: »
    How can we bitch if you start agreeing with me !./quote]

    .
    don't believe all you read!;)


    .


  • #23
    treesireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39 ✭treesireland


    what dose that make you , a pro or a mod:):):)


  • #24
    castlemoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭castlemoy


    the best sealer for sandstone is dry treat. proven the best sealer by a mile


  • #25
    treesireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39 ✭treesireland


    who stocks it:)


  • #26
    edanto
    Registered Users Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭edanto


    (continuing an old thread)

    I put in an Indian Sandstone patio about 3 years ago and didn't seal it at the time and have now got a lot of black lichen spots to try and deal with.

    So far today, I've just done a deep clean with a power wash and then after it dried off one spray with Jeyes Fluid (100ml in 5L), let it sit for about an hour and then washed it and scrubbed with a garden brush. No impact at all on the lichen, but am I headed in the right direction or wasting time?

    Since finding this thread, I've also been reading the paving expert site on Lichen http://www.pavingexpert.com/maintain_03.htm and I am wondering

    (i) am I wasting my time with a few sprays with Jeyes and scrubbing; should I move to chemicals like swimming pool chlorine or household bleach; and something with stronger bristles to scrub with?

    (ii) if a few round of that does't work, what would be next? The paving expert page suggests sandblasting; has anyone tried that with success on Indian Sandstone; I presume I'd need to re-grout after sandblasting; and I've no idea what it might cost.


  • #27
    feartheclaw
    Registered Users Posts: 91 ✭✭feartheclaw


    edanto wrote: »
    (continuing an old thread)

    I put in an Indian Sandstone patio about 3 years ago and didn't seal it at the time and have now got a lot of black lichen spots to try and deal with.

    So far today, I've just done a deep clean with a power wash and then after it dried off one spray with Jeyes Fluid (100ml in 5L), let it sit for about an hour and then washed it and scrubbed with a garden brush. No impact at all on the lichen, but am I headed in the right direction or wasting time?

    Since finding this thread, I've also been reading the paving expert site on Lichen http://www.pavingexpert.com/maintain_03.htm and I am wondering

    (i) am I wasting my time with a few sprays with Jeyes and scrubbing; should I move to chemicals like swimming pool chlorine or household bleach; and something with stronger bristles to scrub with?

    (ii) if a few round of that does't work, what would be next? The paving expert page suggests sandblasting; has anyone tried that with success on Indian Sandstone; I presume I'd need to re-grout after sandblasting; and I've no idea what it might cost.

    Re-continuing old thread - I have the same problem - interested to see how you got on..?
    Thanks
    ftc


  • #28
    Frogeye
    Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭Frogeye


    Any idea of a paving that doesn't have this problem? Was considering Indian sandstone but need something as low maintenance as possible. Would limestone or granite paving slabs be better?

    Frogeye


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