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Half a million for a deep retrofit & small extension?

  • 12-10-2020 9:11am
    #1
    ZeroSum76
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭


    Hi folks - apologies if this is not the correct forum if so please redirect me.

    Granted I am possibly well out of touch with construction costs but my wife and I have received 75% of tender responses and nearly dropped dead at the costs that have come back. We're doing a deep retrofit of an old 4 bed detached house and extending to the side, taking it from 149sqm to 200sqm.

    It's a complete gut job and we've specified a high spec (solar PV, NILAN heat recovery system, good airtightness etc.) but we're talking a 200sqm job just. Not massive. The tender responses thus far are coming in between €440k and €550k :eek::confused:

    Have construction and material costs really gone that crazy? We were thinking maybe €280 to €300k given the high spec. Were we dreaming?


Comments

  • #2
    s1ippy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭s1ippy


    Yeah I want to do the same with our place so I'm going to follow this thread, but I'm not optimistic.

    It's really more economical these days to either buy a new build with all the mod cons included or buy the resources and oversee all the work oneself.


  • #3
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,352 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Rule of thumb.

    €1k per square meter for refurb.
    €2k per square meter for new build.
    That equates to €150k plus €100k for your house so about €250k.

    Now you throw in the high spec which adds considerable amount
    I would have guessed maybe an extra 100k at least but o don’t know your detailed spec.


  • #4
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,068 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    What did you mean by a deep retrofit are you knocking most of the internal walls, underfloor heating, new bathrooms, ceilings, windows, new roof.

    Were doing it at a snails pace but have helped friends get there's prepped for a lot of the work needed.

    It seems like a huge amount, taking the extension out of it exactly what are you doing?


  • #5
    ZeroSum76
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭ZeroSum76


    Thanks for the responses. Most of the internal structural walls are remaining. Stud walls getting knocked, ground floor totally reconfigured. New bathrooms, new kitchen, new windows, bi fold doors for a big opening, air to air heat recovery system, solar PV panels on roof, good standard of airtightness. Dropping ground floor level (currently suspended wooden floor and insulation outside underneath and celing... new everything essentially. Still sound excessive?


  • #6
    bobgaf
    Registered Users Posts: 159 ✭✭bobgaf


    Run it by a professional. For that type of money, the professional fee would be money well spent.


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  • #7
    ZeroSum76
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭ZeroSum76


    You mean like a Quantity Surveyor?


  • #8
    bobgaf
    Registered Users Posts: 159 ✭✭bobgaf


    Exactly. Best money you will spend if you are going to be spending between 350k and 500k.


  • #9
    muffler
    Registered Users Posts: 45,808 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    In assuming this is Dublin / East coast prices?


  • #10
    ZeroSum76
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭ZeroSum76


    Yes this is East Coast. Wicklow to be precise.

    Each builder who replied to tender provided a full breakdown which were all presumably (and definitely looks like) provided by their own QS.

    Prices must be just mad at the moment??


  • #11
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,352 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    ZeroSum76 wrote: »
    You mean like a Quantity Surveyor?

    QS for the money side but you need a good engineer/architect or surveyor to make sure the details are done correctly.


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  • #12
    tabby aspreme
    Registered Users Posts: 3,846 ✭✭✭tabby aspreme


    Builder's doing one off houses and good refurb work are very busy at the moment and seem to have a lot of work lined up for next year, and the prices have risen accordingly.


  • #13
    ec_pc
    Registered Users Posts: 446 ✭✭ec_pc


    Had a similar approach last year, initial quotes came in about 100K over our budget for complete gutting of old house (just roof and 3 external walls were kept) and significant extension in Kildare. We got a turnkey finish, but we took care of many of the final finishes.

    We went from about 140 square meters to approx 270 complete retrofit, Solar PV A2W heat pump etc , A2 rating in the end.

    I think the homeowners idea of cost is always underestimated. As part of our build, we provided sanitaryware & Flooring both of which were fitted by builder / plumbers. We also arranged our own kitchen and stairs. We painted the entire house from top to bottom (never again, but prices to paint all interiors and woodwork were frightening).

    To reduce our costs, we had to make some tough decisions at the start including reducing extension by about 10 SQ meters on both floors, changed roof finishes, removed all landscaping work, gates, fencing, stairs etc.

    However, we did not scrimp on insulation, heating etc as these are essentially the fabric of the house and could not be easily changed in future.

    I found it far more cost efficient to supply the builder with items and have him fit them (within reason). Saved over 2.5k by providing internal doors and brassware.

    Shop around with builders, based on recommendations. We retained a professional to keep an eye on the build (well worth the money).


  • #14
    ml100
    Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭ml100


    ZeroSum76 wrote: »
    Hi folks - apologies if this is not the correct forum if so please redirect me.

    Granted I am possibly well out of touch with construction costs but my wife and I have received 75% of tender responses and nearly dropped dead at the costs that have come back. We're doing a deep retrofit of an old 4 bed detached house and extending to the side, taking it from 149sqm to 200sqm.

    It's a complete gut job and we've specified a high spec (solar PV, NILAN heat recovery system, good airtightness etc.) but we're talking a 200sqm job just. Not massive. The tender responses thus far are coming in between €440k and €550k :eek::confused:

    Have construction and material costs really gone that crazy? We were thinking maybe €280 to €300k given the high spec. Were we dreaming?

    Did the remaining tenders come in any lower, at that price is it economically viable to proceed?, the building industry in this country is very frustrating, its boom and bust as the cost of getting a job done is largely dependent on the availability of builders, if they are busy the prices are high until the market over corrects, I.e. bust!


  • #15
    3d4life
    Registered Users Posts: 802 ✭✭✭3d4life


    OP, cant figure out if this is a detached house.

    If it is, have you looked at the option of demolish & build new ?


  • #16
    VANG1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 222 ✭✭VANG1


    Would strongly advise getting your own QS. would be self financing, otherwise you will be fleeced on any changes or issues arising. Maybe be cheaper to knock and rebuild. It is normal to negotiate with the builders after tender and make adjustments to get a final deal. Good luck.


  • #17
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,003 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    OP I'd bite your hand off for those prices.

    My architect estimate for a similar job on a 200sqm detached house in Dublin is 900K, QS just came back with the same figures.
    In Dublin its 1500/yard for renovation and 2500/yard for new.

    Our job is knocking down an old flat roof extension and rebuilding a two storey extension in its place, then complete gut job on the inside, laying concrete floors, external insulation, wiring, plumbing, plastering, heat pump etc.

    We didnt pay much more for the house so its a bit of a punch to the gut.
    Insurance rebuild costs are about 1/3 so I hope a fire doesnt break out while we are next away! :-o


  • #18
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,003 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    /edit to add that we were assuming prices would be coming down in 2021 due to reduced building with COVID impacts and commercial sector slowing down, have yet to see it though!


  • #19
    bubbagumss
    Site Banned Posts: 26 ✭bubbagumss


    should be about 200 thousand
    builders bid high as they don't want the work

    have you plans drawn


  • #20
    bubbagumss
    Site Banned Posts: 26 ✭bubbagumss


    building costs

    https://www.houseandhome.ie/advice/renovation-project-price-guide-costs-30057


  • #21
    Merrion
    Registered Users Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭Merrion


    I got a similar quote (€400k for an extension) and am told it may be deliberately high because they just can't get the labour so are only doing "premium" priced work.


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  • #22
    Theboinkmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,963 ✭✭✭Theboinkmaster


    GreeBo wrote: »
    /edit to add that we were assuming prices would be coming down in 2021 due to reduced building with COVID impacts and commercial sector slowing down, have yet to see it though!

    That’s a big assumption - they could very easily go up


  • #23
    mad m
    Registered Users Posts: 9,001 ✭✭✭mad m


    Think new Electrical spec coming in Feb 2021 so it will push prices up even further. Low smoke cable being introduced afaik, not sure regarding other spec yet.


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