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Anti-vaxxers

  • 25-08-2017 9:34am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 988 ✭✭✭Ashbourne hoop


    Following on from the flat earthers thread, I was wondering what people thought of, in my opinion, an even more dangerous group, anti vaxxers. Vaccine preventable diseases are on the rise, in the US there were 3 times as many cases of measles then there were in the previous year. Andrew Wakefield, who was discredited as much as any doctor could possibly be, still appears to have huge influence on people. The uptake rate of the HPV vaccine is reportedly down to 50%. Anti-vaxxer views appear to be very popular on social media where statements like "big pharma conspiracy" are common. With all the scientific evidence available, there are still a growing number of anti vaxxers. Be interested in peoples views on this.


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭cbyrd


    This should be fun ....


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,262 ✭✭✭✭jester77


    These people are dangerous.

    Some countries are making it compulsory for children to be vaccinated before they are allowed in daycare or school. Every country should start making this a law to eliminate these nut cases.


  • Registered Users Posts: 988 ✭✭✭Ashbourne hoop


    jester77 wrote: »
    These people are dangerous.

    Some countries are making it compulsory for children to be vaccinated before they are allowed in daycare or school. Every country should start making this a law to eliminate these nut cases.

    I agree. I think in Australia you're child needs to be vaccinated before they can go into crèche.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    I thought we were pro choice, no?


  • Administrators, Computer Games Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 32,073 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Mickeroo


    I thought we were pro choice, no?

    i'd have no issue with an anti-vaxxer getting an abortion if they wanted.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,288 ✭✭✭✭branie2


    They think that the MMR vaccine causes autism


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,100 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    Kennels won't accept your dog until it's had its shots (kennel cough).


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,017 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    I think we call all agree that the pharmaceutical conglomerates have our best interests at heart


  • Registered Users Posts: 999 ✭✭✭fizzypish


    I thought we were pro choice, no?

    My limited understanding is that vaccines are effective at a population level. A group not indulging in the vaccine leads to a hand hold for the ailment to grip onto. If it gains enough momentum then it can also get into the vaccinated population.
    Even if vaccines can cause autism/something (I don't know?) in a small percentage of children, its still probably better than the disease going through the population like wild fire. Probably but I don't know the figures.

    From a pure numbers point of view, more people are alive with vaccines than without although I have no figures to back this up so maybe I should shut the **** up.....


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,066 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    I think we call all agree that the pharmaceutical conglomerates all the doctors, except for the guy who was struck off for falsifying studies have our best interests at heart

    Fixed it for you.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    Pherekydes wrote: »
    Kennels won't accept your dog until it's had its shots (kennel cough).

    Not true for all kennels. Some accept dogs without the KC vaccination but you need to sign a waiver that if they catch anything it's your problem. it's different in that there are many strains of KC, it's a virus like the common cold.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,863 ✭✭✭mikhail


    I think we call all agree that the pharmaceutical conglomerates have our best interests at heart
    And of course the guys selling water to cure cancer are entirely philanthropic too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,481 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    jester77 wrote: »
    These people are dangerous.

    Some countries are making it compulsory for children to be vaccinated before they are allowed in daycare or school. Every country should start making this a law to eliminate these nut cases.

    Shoot to kill policy?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    Problem is, when you see the devastation caused by the swine flu jab, their arguments are not too crazy

    https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/history/narcolepsy-flu.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,066 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Problem is, when you see the devastation caused by the swine flu jab, their arguments are not too crazy

    https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/history/narcolepsy-flu.html

    Did you read to the end of that?
    In response to the events in Europe, CDC reviewed data from the U.S. Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) and the Vaccine Safety Datalink (VSD) and found no indication of any association between U.S.-licensed H1N1 or seasonal influenza vaccine and narcolepsy.

    In 2014, CDC published a study on the association between 2009 H1N1 influenza vaccines, 2010/2011 seasonal influenza vaccines, and narcolepsy. The analysis included more than 650,000 people who received the pandemic flu vaccine in 2009 and over 870,000 people who received the seasonal flu vaccine in 2010/2011. The study found that vaccination was not associated with an increased risk for narcolepsy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,059 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Problem is, when you see the devastation caused by the swine flu jab, their arguments are not too crazy

    https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/history/narcolepsy-flu.html


    what does this have to do with opposition to the MMR vaccine? I doubt most anti-vaxxers have even heard of the H1N1 vaccine.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 81,310 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    I agree that they are dangerous


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,414 ✭✭✭tigger123


    The parents are making bad decisions based on scientifically unfounded concerns, and jeopardizing the health of their kids. Its pretty awful.

    All based on ****e they read on their FB feed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,066 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    tigger123 wrote: »
    The parents are making bad decisions based on scientifically unfounded concerns, and jeopardizing the health of their kids. Its pretty awful.

    All based on ****e they read on their FB feed.

    Google took action recently to make sure that accurate results appear for searches on vaccines. Until then if you searched for "Are vaccines bad" you would get loads of dodgy results.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 40,059 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    tigger123 wrote: »
    The parents are making bad decisions based on scientifically unfounded concerns, and jeopardizing the health of their kids. Its pretty awful.

    All based on ****e they read on their FB feed.


    well if it was only the health of their own kids they were affected that would be bad enough. They are also affecting the health of kids who cannot have the MMR vaccine and depend on herd immunity. They are putting in danger the lives of children who already have medical problems.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    When my son went to Kindergarten in Austria I found out that 50% of all kids didn't have the most necessary shots (you need to provide the information when you put the name down). That was somewhat shocking. At some point they had chicken pox going through all the rooms, it was awful because almost every kid caught it. It really showed how fast this spreads and it's concerning to think there might be something going around in the same pace that's more serious than chicken pox.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,568 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Forced vaccination laws are a slippery slope, doing similar to Australia and not allowing kids attend public schools without them or even holding back certain benefits is the way to go


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,414 ✭✭✭tigger123


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Forced vaccination laws are a slippery slope, doing similar to Australia and not allowing kids attend public schools without them or even holding back certain benefits is the way to go

    It's an excellent way to tackle it: 'If you're going to put the population of the school at risk, you're not welcome.'


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,066 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    LirW wrote: »
    When my son went to Kindergarten in Austria I found out that 50% of all kids didn't have the most necessary shots (you need to provide the information when you put the name down). That was somewhat shocking. At some point they had chicken pox going through all the rooms, it was awful because almost every kid caught it. It really showed how fast this spreads and it's concerning to think there might be something going around in the same pace that's more serious than chicken pox.

    CDC recommend a chicken pox vaccine.
    https://www.cdc.gov/features/preventchickenpox/index.html
    Most children with chickenpox completely recover. But it can be serious, even deadly, especially for babies, pregnant women, adolescents, adults, and people with weakened immune systems. Make sure everyone in your family is up to date on their chickenpox vaccinations.

    Chickenpox is a very contagious disease. Someone can get it if they have never been vaccinated or had chickenpox. Chickenpox causes a blister-like rash, itching, tiredness, and fever. This leaves a person feeling very sick and uncomfortable, and may cause sick people to miss a week or more of school or work.

    Chickenpox can be serious. Before there was a vaccine, each year chickenpox caused about 4 million people to get sick, more than 10,500 hospitalizations, and about 100 to 150 deaths. Most people who get severe chickenpox are healthy beforehand. Read about a healthy teenager who got chickenpox and died.

    I've had chickenpox twice. Once as a kid and once as a 18 year old. The second time I had about one blister per square inch including on the inside of my throat. The blisters burst and went septic. I needed liquid antibiotics and survived on ice cream for three days because I couldn't swallow whole foods.

    Kids need to be vaccinated against this stuff.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 10,432 Mod ✭✭✭✭xzanti


    Below is an excerpt from the Centre for Disease Control website. I just randomly picked the HPV vaccine, but the advice is similar for most of the vaccines.

    I'm not an "anti-vaxxer". My son is vaccinated fully. But I would ponder why there is no allergy test for kids before the vaccines are given. They appear to acknowledge that some are susceptible to allergic reaction. But how are we to know if we're going to have a "life threatening reaction" to a vaccine, if you've never had it before?

    I would akin it to handing out peanuts to a class full of kids, who've never had peanuts, without some sort of patch test first.

    https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjemMP2kPLVAhWJJ8AKHd0vAFMQFgg3MAI&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fvaccines%2Fvpd%2Fshould-not-vacc.html&usg=AFQjCNEVCEMw1EcrBwUUORNWItttJv7VuA
    HPV (Human Papillomavirus) vaccine
    Some people should not get this vaccine.
    Anyone who has had a severe (life-threatening) allergic reaction to a dose of HPV vaccine should not get another dose.
    Anyone who has a severe (life threatening) allergy to any component of HPV vaccine should not get the vaccine.
    Tell your doctor if you have any severe allergies that you know of, including a severe allergy to yeast.
    HPV vaccine is not recommended for pregnant women. If you learn that you were pregnant when you were vaccinated, there is no reason to expect any problems for you or your baby. Any woman who learns she was pregnant when she got HPV vaccine is encouraged to contact the manufacturer’s registry for HPV vaccination during pregnancy at 1-800-986-8999. Women who are breastfeeding may be vaccinated.
    If you have a mild illness, such as a cold, you can probably get the vaccine today. If you are moderately or severely ill, you should probably wait until you recover. Your doctor can advise you.
    This information was taken directly from the HPV VIS


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,198 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    tigger123 wrote: »
    The parents are making bad decisions based on scientifically unfounded concerns, and jeopardizing the health of their kids. Its pretty awful.
    Jeapordizing the health of their own kids is one thing. Jeapordizing the healthy of somebody else's immuno-compromised kid is unconscionable.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    Grayson wrote: »
    CDC recommend a chicken pox vaccine.
    https://www.cdc.gov/features/preventchickenpox/index.html



    I've had chickenpox twice. Once as a kid and once as a 18 year old. The second time I had about one blister per square inch including on the inside of my throat. The blisters burst and went septic. I needed liquid antibiotics and survived on ice cream for three days because I couldn't swallow whole foods.

    Kids need to be vaccinated against this stuff.

    Over there it wasn't recommended back then, therefore you have to pay for it on your own. But when so many haven't any shots at all, you can't expect people to get that one that isn't paid for. It's unbelievable.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,969 ✭✭✭✭alchemist33


    The annoying thing about the MMR scandal is that it took Andrew Wakefield being found guilty of misconduct by the GMC to really convince most of the public that the MMR was safe. Before that the MMR/autism thing was a mainstream belief despite there being no credible evidence for it. Wakefield made a name for himself on chatshows on the back of a study involving 12 children, which is absolutely tiny and unscientific to base such an important claim on. There were studies involving thousands which refuted it (I researched this before I had my first child vaccinated) which showed no link but a charismatic man, a scare study and a conspiracy theory somehow seemed to hold more weight with a lot of people. Only for the fact Wakefield went much further than making a spurious claim, and was caught, he'd still be lauded as an anti-establishment hero by some.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭draiochtanois


    This post has been deleted.


This discussion has been closed.
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