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Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee *poll not working - pl ignore*

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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    radio rira is not an rte owned and ran station though. what is unique about it is it speaks irish instead of english but it's music is played on plenty of other radio stations. essentially it's content is already covered but just not together in 1 station. chill would be more minority and within rte's remit. radio rira as a privately owned station is the responsibility of those behind it. if radio rira wish to be on more outlets then it is for them to make that decision and discuss with whoever to make it happen.
    the channel 4 situation is not comparible to the situation with rte 2 as it was set up in different circumstances within a very different country with a large population. ireland is a tiny population where the commercial tv that does exist here is providing more or less what is already available on ITV etc.

    I said it should merge with TG4 and RnaG. (It's funded by CNaG which in turn gets funding from Government).

    Channel 4 situation is even more comparable for Ireland than it is for Britain.

    As I said in Ireland we have 2 things happening, English Channels eating up revenue and a duopoly in Irish content providers.

    Virgin Media does very little outside news and CA, and I can see them to continue to reduce their output as time goes on, even with the hit of love Island. Which means there are then only 2 Irish content providers.

    By making RTÉ2 a commercial publisher/broadcaster they could give opportunities to different content producers, that otherwise get cut when RTÉ decide that should stop moving.

    But tell me what RTÉ2 is currently doing well from a public service point of view or a commerical point of view for RTÉ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,928 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Elmo wrote: »
    I said it should merge with TG4 and RnaG. (It's funded by CNaG which in turn gets funding from Government).

    or just leave it as it is . it can stand on it's own merrits separately yet compliment the other irish services.
    Elmo wrote: »
    Channel 4 situation is even more comparable for Ireland than it is for Britain.

    As I said in Ireland we have 2 things happening, English Channels eating up revenue and a duopoly in Irish content providers.

    Virgin Media does very little outside news and CA, and I can see them to continue to reduce their output as time goes on, even with the hit of love Island. Which means there are then only 2 Irish content providers.

    by the sounds of it that is all that is viable given the size of our market and the ability to receive much of the same programming elsewhere.
    if there is room for more commercial channels then they will no doubt launch.
    Elmo wrote: »
    By making RTÉ2 a commercial publisher/broadcaster they could give opportunities to different content producers, that otherwise get cut when RTÉ decide that should stop moving.

    But tell me what RTÉ2 is currently doing well from a public service point of view or a commerical point of view for RTÉ?

    could, but probably won't in reality. a commercial operator could probably launch their own channel to do this if they feel there is an audience.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    or just leave it as it is . it can stand on it's own merrits separately yet compliment the other irish services.

    But its not complimenting any of the other Irish Services not even RTÉ ONE

    Tonight from 7. Will and Grace, Soccer Republic, Return of Gaint Killers, Film
    Tueday from 7. TBBT, WWC 2019, Blue Bloods
    Wed from 7. TBBT, The Great House Revival (RTÉ ONE repeat), MasterChef UK, No Offence, Safe Harbour
    Thurs From 7, Neighbours, Wild Tales from the Village, Fr Ted (again), This Crowed House (Repeat), The Handmaids Tale, The Walking Dead
    Friday From 7, Neighbours, Silk Road, Coast, Film
    Sat from 7, Top Gear, Mayday, Marsupials, Hilter's Jurrasic Park, Film
    Sun from 7, Bond, The Sunday Game

    And that's an unusually good week!


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,928 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Elmo wrote: »
    But its not complimenting any of the other Irish Services not even RTÉ ONE

    Tonight from 7. Will and Grace, Soccer Republic, Return of Gaint Killers, Film
    Tueday from 7. TBBT, WWC 2019, Blue Bloods
    Wed from 7. TBBT, The Great House Revival (RTÉ ONE repeat), MasterChef UK, No Offence, Safe Harbour
    Thurs From 7, Neighbours, Wild Tales from the Village, Fr Ted (again), This Crowed House (Repeat), The Handmaids Tale, The Walking Dead
    Friday From 7, Neighbours, Silk Road, Coast, Film
    Sat from 7, Top Gear, Mayday, Marsupials, Hilter's Jurrasic Park, Film
    Sun from 7, Bond, The Sunday Game

    And that's an unusually good week!

    presumably you are talking about rte2? i thought you wanted that to go to the commercial sector?
    what channel exactly are you wanting to merge with tg4 and rnag?

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    presumably you are talking about rte2? i thought you wanted that to go to the commercial sector?
    what channel exactly are you wanting to merge with tg4 and rnag?

    I am just saying RTÉ2 currently has no place in RTÉ and neither does 2FM. If it does remain with RTÉ then they need to decide to do something with as its audience levels continue to drop.

    TnaG: TG4, RTÉjr/Irish Film Channel, RTÉjrRadio/Radio RiRa, RnaG
    And if you want to know: €30m to Irish Lanugage, €20m to Children's content, €20m to Film
    It won't happen.

    So we are left with RTÉ having to position RTÉ2 correctly.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 39,466 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    95% of what is on all public broadcasters and paid broadcasters (including stream services - which will be furthered diluted in the next 18 months) is absolute meh.

    The 5% one person thinks is decent, varies and comes down to personal taste.

    €160 is probably the right price point for the fee. There is zero justification for an increase in that currently.

    They get a lot right but they get the same amount wrong, axe needs to be taken to it, starting with a serious rethink of their sports offerings.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,928 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Elmo wrote: »
    I am just saying RTÉ2 currently has no place in RTÉ and neither does 2FM. If it does remain with RTÉ then they need to decide to do something with as its audience levels continue to drop.

    their place is that they are providing the programs they are providing.
    really the argument here should be about the programming, rather then about whether the networks should or shouldn't be handed to the commercial sector who can set up channels themselves if there is an audience, at least on tv platforms anyway.
    Elmo wrote: »
    TnaG: TG4, RTÉjr/Irish Film Channel, RTÉjrRadio/Radio RiRa, RnaG
    And if you want to know: €30m to Irish Lanugage, €20m to Children's content, €20m to Film
    It won't happen.

    there wouldn't be any point to this, apart from maybe merging rtejr tv with something as it's only ever 12 hours a day anyway and will never be 24 hours.
    radio rira is a separate channel providing pop music with the irish language. it can stand as it is on it's own merrits. rnag provides mostly talk with some music. both are targeting different markets within the irish speaking community, small as they are.
    tnag is tg4 is it not?
    Elmo wrote: »
    So we are left with RTÉ having to position RTÉ2 correctly.

    that can be done regardless of whatever happens to the irish language channels.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 840 ✭✭✭The Late Late Show


    Just looking at the TV programmes for this evening. Not a thing worth watching on any of them. Worse than useless. And it is NOT just RTE.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    their place is that they are providing the programs they are providing.
    really the argument here should be about the programming, rather then about whether the networks should or shouldn't be handed to the commercial sector who can set up channels themselves if there is an audience, at least on tv platforms anyway.

    Yes and RTÉ aren't providing content so either they need to change and reform or we need to look at alternatives.
    there wouldn't be any point to this, apart from maybe merging rtejr tv with something as it's only ever 12 hours a day anyway and will never be 24 hours.
    radio rira is a separate channel providing pop music with the irish language. it can stand as it is on it's own merrits. rnag provides mostly talk with some music. both are targeting different markets within the irish speaking community, small as they are.
    tnag is tg4 is it not?

    Economies of Scale, TG4 would use the RnaG newsroom, TG4 would use RTÉjr/Cula4 to provide original Irish children's content (increase funding from 5m to 20m) in both Irish and English. Radio RiRa would also have EofS. In particular having TG4 and RnaG as separate is crazy.

    Bigger investment into Irish Film along with the current investment by the Screen Ireland. Reducing the amount going to TG4 from the Exchequer to NIL.

    Have to spell this out: -
    TG4 - As is
    RTÉjr 7am to 7pm (English Language)
    Film Channel 7pm to 2am (Multilingual)
    RTÉjr Radio 7am to 7pm
    Radio RiRa 7pm to 7am
    RnaG - As Is


    While by moving RTÉ2 to commercial or just Independent of RTÉ, you create an environment where by you can have a number of Irish channels in a better position to compete for Ad revenue and a hopeful increase in audience numbers, leading to more ad revenue across the aboard for Irish content.

    But again this is hypothetical and you can argue against it if you want.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,767 ✭✭✭Scotty #


    CJhaughey wrote: »
    4166 people have to pay for their license just so Ryan Tubridy can have the salary he enjoys.
    Ahh would you stop!! That's nonsense! You think Ryan Tubridy's salary comes from your TV licence fee? Really?? To advertise on the Late Late show cost €10k- €15k PER MINUTE! Day time Radio1 - upto €4000 per minute. The likes of Darcy, Tubridy, Duffy get nothing from the TV licence.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 51,118 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Scotty # wrote: »
    Ahh would you stop!! That's nonsense! You think Ryan Tubridy's salary comes from your TV licence fee? Really?? To advertise on the Late Late show cost €10k- €15k PER MINUTE! Day time Radio1 - upto €4000 per minute. The likes of Darcy, Tubridy, Duffy get nothing from the TV licence.

    Well they’re robbing someone else so.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Scotty # wrote: »
    Ahh would you stop!! That's nonsense! You think Ryan Tubridy's salary comes from your TV licence fee? Really?? To advertise on the Late Late show cost €10k- €15k PER MINUTE! Day time Radio1 - upto €4000 per minute. The likes of Darcy, Tubridy, Duffy get nothing from the TV licence.

    There also supposed to support the rest of RTÉ. It's not just about the amount raised on their shows alone but how much that investment can be redistributed.

    I'd say RTÉ lost money with the move or Ray D'Arcy. They took that risk and lost an audience on TV, worth much more than his radio show.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,928 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Elmo wrote: »
    Yes and RTÉ aren't providing content so either they need to change and reform or we need to look at alternatives.

    the only other alternative is a new state broadcaster set up from the ground up. the commercial sector certainly isn't that alternative and nor should they forced to be.
    Elmo wrote: »
    Economies of Scale, TG4 would use the RnaG newsroom, TG4 would use RTÉjr/Cula4 to provide original Irish children's content (increase funding from 5m to 20m) in both Irish and English. Radio RiRa would also have EofS. In particular having TG4 and RnaG as separate is crazy.

    Bigger investment into Irish Film along with the current investment by the Screen Ireland. Reducing the amount going to TG4 from the Exchequer to NIL.

    those economies of scale can already be implemented without removing or reducing the content which merging would do in some areas.
    Elmo wrote: »
    Have to spell this out: -
    TG4 - As is
    RTÉjr 7am to 7pm (English Language)
    Film Channel 7pm to 2am (Multilingual)
    RTÉjr Radio 7am to 7pm
    Radio RiRa 7pm to 7am
    RnaG - As Is

    what about those who want to listen to pop music with irish language between 7am and 7pm? there is i believe, generally less of an audience for radio between 7pm and 7am so i am not seeing a benefit in shoving radio rira which i believe targets a younger audience off to a 12 hour night slot.
    rte chill already uses the channel used by rtejr radio from 7pm to 7am anyway.
    Elmo wrote: »
    While by moving RTÉ2 to commercial or just Independent of RTÉ, you create an environment where by you can have a number of Irish channels in a better position to compete for Ad revenue and a hopeful increase in audience numbers, leading to more ad revenue across the aboard for Irish content.

    that can already be done without having rte2 independant or within the commercial sector. rte 2 is repositioned for extra public service content and any commercial providers who think they have an audience can set up their own channels. i suspect though ireland is to small a market for many more commercial channels whereas radio not so much as radio can be done quite easily and cheaply if the regulatory environment were to support it.
    Elmo wrote: »
    But again this is hypothetical and you can argue against it if you want.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Regardless End Of The Road, changes need to be made. And I don't see RTÉ making any changes internal to help themselves.

    They have massive opportunities to provide an alternative and a mainstream.

    The idea that you could consider that Imported Programming is worth 25million in this day and age is mystifying. And to consider not cutting that budget is even more mystifying.

    RTÉ since 2009 has largely retained its budget, yes since 2008 its drops 23% but that is in the past.

    Reasons for this include:-

    1. The Down turn
    2. Loss of audience

    Even when you consider there loss of audiences in 2018 commercial income was only down 1%. And much of that loss was because they lost audience in TV down 6% I think, but you'd have to work out 2 factors.

    1. Movement to onDemand
    2. Loss of an audience to other channels RTÉ2 has nothing of not expect sport, when you have a 6% share for most of the year, that's where you have made losses not when you get 10% during the WC2018.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,086 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Just looking at the TV programmes for this evening. Not a thing worth watching on any of them. Worse than useless. And it is NOT just RTE.

    https://www.rte.ie/culture/2018/1015/1003311-the-lonely-battle-of-thomas-reid-one-mans-struggle-to-fight-th/

    Just a plug for this.

    Fergal Ward's award winning documentary.

    Unmissable.

    Should be of interest to anyone interested in farming, property rights, FDI issues or just human nature.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 314 ✭✭Blinky Plebum


    Scotty # wrote: »
    Ahh would you stop!! That's nonsense! You think Ryan Tubridy's salary comes from your TV licence fee? Really?? To advertise on the Late Late show cost €10k- €15k PER MINUTE! Day time Radio1 - upto €4000 per minute. The likes of Darcy, Tubridy, Duffy get nothing from the TV licence.


    Then if the money these stars can generate is so good we shouldn't need to pay money to prop up RTE they can use all this advertising revenue to keep the station going and we don't need to be forced to prop up RTE through the license fee.

    RTE had a deficit of €13 million for 2018 which clearly means the big salaries the so called stars are getting paid are not really value for money.

    Put a cap on salaries in RTE at £150K per annum (a great salary) and if it's not enough for Ray D'Arcy,Duffy,Tubridy and Co they can see will someone else pay them more.

    I have no probem supporting RTE if it goes towards public service prgramming but if the so called stars aren't able to generate the revenue to get RTE to make a surplus in a year the they really aren't worth the money thay are being paid.I'd much prefer is we simpy had a purely public service broadcasting channel that the license fee supports showing news,documentaries,sport that wouldn't normally be covered and the likes of the LLS,D'Arcy Show etc go onto a commercial station which the public contributes nothing towards.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Just to put in context, tubs, Duffy and darcy would both get into the BBC's list:-

    Ryan Tubridy 495
    Steve Wright: £465,000 - £469,999
    Ray D'Arcy 450
    Alan Shearer: £440,000 - £444,999
    Joe Duffy 390
    Andrew Marr: £390,000 - £394,999
    Zoe Ball: £370,000 - £374,999
    Claudia Winkleman: £370,000 - £374,999
    Vanessa Feltz: £355,000 - £359,999
    Jason Mohammad: £355,000 - £359,999
    Marian Finucane 301
    Miriam O'Callaghan 301
    Sean O'Rourke 299
    Claire Byrne 300

    https://www.rte.ie/news/uk/2019/0702/1059689-bbc-annual-report/

    I know exchange rate but still.


  • Registered Users Posts: 39,466 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Elmo wrote: »
    Just to put in context, tubs, Duffy and darcy would both get into the BBC's list:-

    Ryan Tubridy 495
    Steve Wright: £465,000 - £469,999
    Ray D'Arcy 450
    Alan Shearer: £440,000 - £444,999
    Joe Duffy 390
    Andrew Marr: £390,000 - £394,999
    Zoe Ball: £370,000 - £374,999
    Claudia Winkleman: £370,000 - £374,999
    Vanessa Feltz: £355,000 - £359,999
    Jason Mohammad: £355,000 - £359,999
    Marian Finucane 301
    Miriam O'Callaghan 301
    Sean O'Rourke 299
    Claire Byrne 300

    https://www.rte.ie/news/uk/2019/0702/1059689-bbc-annual-report/

    I know exchange rate but still.

    Shearer, near half a million pounds?

    Fúcking Hell!


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Boggles wrote: »
    Shearer, near half a million pounds?

    Fúcking Hell!

    I know they could have got D'Arcy for that!


  • Registered Users Posts: 39,466 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Elmo wrote: »
    I know they could have got D'Arcy for that!

    As bad as Ray is, you have made him look a bargain compared to Shearer.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,139 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    elperello wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/culture/2018/1015/1003311-the-lonely-battle-of-thomas-reid-one-mans-struggle-to-fight-th/

    Just a plug for this.

    Fergal Ward's award winning documentary.

    Unmissable.

    Should be of interest to anyone interested in farming, property rights, FDI issues or just human nature.

    The Twink documentary they're airing in a week or so will I'm sure be quality. Unmissable


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭jippo nolan


    The Twink documentary they're airing in a week or so will I'm sure be quality. Unmissable

    So Twink gets a dig out, so to speak!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,139 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    So Twink gets a dig out, so to speak!



    Here's the trailer.
    https://youtu.be/FHHPoUbg6iY

    Money well spent.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Boggles wrote: »
    As bad as Ray is, you have made him look a bargain compared to Shearer.

    Sorry that figure is for a minute on the air :D
    The Twink documentary they're airing in a week or so will I'm sure be quality. Unmissable

    Also they only paid for broadcast rights for The Lonely Battle.... it was funded by NDR! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norddeutscher_Rundfunk Strangely doesn't look like it was part of RTÉ deal with ARTE, which is supported by NDR!


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,086 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    The Twink documentary they're airing in a week or so will I'm sure be quality. Unmissable

    Did you watch the Thomas Reid documentary?

    And as you suggest I expect I will watch the Twink documentary.

    Fascinating career in show business going back 50 years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,395 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    elperello wrote: »
    Did you watch the Thomas Reid documentary?

    And as you suggest I expect I will watch the Twink documentary.

    Fascinating career in show business going back 50 years.


    The Thomas Reid documentary was brilliant. Wasn't an RTE production though.

    Sticking together Twink clips is more RTE's bag.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    elperello wrote: »
    Did you watch the Thomas Reid documentary?

    And as you suggest I expect I will watch the Twink documentary.

    Fascinating career in show business going back 50 years.

    Actually it’s 58


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,086 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    kneemos wrote: »
    The Thomas Reid documentary was brilliant. Wasn't an RTE production though.

    Sticking together Twink clips is more RTE's bag.

    I never said it was.
    RTE gave it an airing.

    I'll suspend judgement on the Twink documentary until I see it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 39,466 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    elperello wrote: »
    Fascinating career in show business going back 50 years.
    Twink described the Irish singer, Linda Martin, as a "cúnt" during a tirade in May 2010

    Bloody Legend, I'll be giving it a watch.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,767 ✭✭✭Scotty #


    Then if the money these stars can generate is so good we shouldn't need to pay money to prop up RTE they can use all this advertising revenue to keep the station going and we don't need to be forced to prop up RTE through the license fee.

    RTE had a deficit of €13 million for 2018 which clearly means the big salaries the so called stars are getting paid are not really value for money.

    Put a cap on salaries in RTE at £150K per annum (a great salary) and if it's not enough for Ray D'Arcy,Duffy,Tubridy and Co they can see will someone else pay them more.

    I have no probem supporting RTE if it goes towards public service prgramming but if the so called stars aren't able to generate the revenue to get RTE to make a surplus in a year the they really aren't worth the money thay are being paid.I'd much prefer is we simpy had a purely public service broadcasting channel that the license fee supports showing news,documentaries,sport that wouldn't normally be covered and the likes of the LLS,D'Arcy Show etc go onto a commercial station which the public contributes nothing towards.

    Capped salaries? This is the real world! Tubs is not going to work for the same money as say, Claire Byrne, despite taking in 10x, maybe 20x times her revenue. You think any of those presenters would work for €150K a year knowing the millions they generate? Joe Duffy has 400K daily listeners. That's over 10% of the adult population of this country. He's an advertising gold mine!

    As I said earlier, the hosts on the big money are generating income for RTE, not costing it money. If they all left, taking their listeners and advertiser revenue with them, it would just cause an even bigger deficit. Suggesting a cut in their salaries as a way for RTE to save money is nonsensical. RTE needs them. That's why they're on the big bucks!


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