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Registration of classic vehicles after Brexit

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    You are correct there. Let's see how quickly they change the rules to benefit themselves

    They cant and don't need to change the rules , now they get VAT 23% and vrt say roughly 20% on average Even if imports from the UK drop by 50%( which in the medium term I dont think they will) the exchequer wont be any worse off.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    Car99 wrote: »
    They cant and don't need to change the rules , now they get VAT 23% and vrt say roughly 20% on average Even if imports from the UK drop by 50%( which in the medium term I dont think they will) the exchequer wont be any worse off.
    If that's the case , cars are going to become even more expensive. Prohibitively so.

    Importing from EU directly will become more attractive. A nice LHD from France for instance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    Tomal wrote: »
    Thanks for information on this very confusing situation. The problem is the seller in NI may not have any paperwork so therefore VAT will need to be paid I suppose. Will classics that have had restorations or are repaired Cat cars have any Vat increases or reductions.

    Is it better to hold off on purchasing for a few months until all this is ironed out.

    Do agree that this is playing into the roll out of electric, Hybrid vehicles as will reduce the amount of diesels coming in. Was listening to radio and they covered some of this explaining if you buy a German marque from UK you pay import duty but not if you buy a UK marque. Does that mean we will all be driving Jags! Its all messed up really.Correct me if wrong on this but thats what I gleaned from it.

    Seller in NI must have a V5 otherwise you would be mad to buy it unless it's for parts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    If that's the case , cars are going to become even more expensive. Prohibitively so.

    Importing from EU directly will become more attractive. A nice LHD from France for instance.
    Yep I wouldnt say prohibitively as the cost of 2nd hand cars here will increase because of the import cost increases.

    A nice LHD from Europe would save you the VAT but cost of shipping , insurance and resale value would wipe out alot of those savings.

    For a classic LHD wouldnt bother me at all . I have one for the last 10 years and it diesnt affect my enjoyment of the car at all.


  • Registered Users Posts: 54 ✭✭Tomal


    Going forward is not the future all LHD here!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,295 ✭✭✭w124man


    What's about Nissans? They are made in england

    Very few are and most parts are imported so Rules of Origin will kick in.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    w124man wrote: »
    Very few are and most parts are imported so Rules of Origin will kick in.
    So how is the regular personal buyer supposed to know this amount of detail of how a car is made.
    It's a crazy system.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Isambard


    would not the Cert of COnformity sort that out or have they gone to the wall now?

    I see truckers from the EU have had their sandwiches taken off them entering the EU, so I can see the car thing only getting worse. Unbelievable, but they've done it to themselves.


  • Registered Users Posts: 695 ✭✭✭Tazio


    Tomal wrote: »
    Going forward is not the future all LHD here!


    I totally agree with you... but if we switched over, besides the cost, imagine the carnage.

    Car99 wrote: »
    For a classic LHD wouldnt bother me at all . I have one for the last 10 years and it diesnt affect my enjoyment of the car at all.

    same here. bought one in Spain a few years back. the only time I get caught out is at the toll booths :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 64,542 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Tazio wrote: »
    same here. bought one in Spain a few years back. the only time I get caught out is at the toll booths :)

    Funny you mention that. I've my Boxster 5 years now and I've never been through a toll booth. Paid parking a few times alright.

    (It's RHD, but I don't think LHD would bother me, although of course with a sports car you'd want to overtake other cars, which is not ideal in a LHD car)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,740 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Tomal wrote: »
    Thanks for information on this very confusing situation. The problem is the seller in NI may not have any paperwork so therefore VAT will need to be paid I suppose. Will classics that have had restorations or are repaired Cat cars have any Vat increases or reductions.

    Is it better to hold off on purchasing for a few months until all this is ironed out.

    If there is no V5, it's not a car. It's just a collection of spares.

    There is no way you should buy any vehicle without a V5, and in the name of the seller as well.

    Besides, you can't register it here without the V5 anyway.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Isambard


    i think he's referring to previous paperwork that may be necessary showing the papertrail into NI


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,105 ✭✭✭hi5


    If the V5 has a Northern Ireland address then he doesn't need any other paperwork, there is no VAT.
    He may need an Invoice for VRT but that's always been the case.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    Car99 wrote: »
    They cant and don't need to change the rules , now they get VAT 23% and vrt say roughly 20% on average Even if imports from the UK drop by 50%( which in the medium term I dont think they will) the exchequer wont be any worse off.

    UK imports have all but stopped. I know a lad who at the height of things had 3 car transporters on the road and each of them back 2 or 3 times every week, He sold his trucks late last year and many others have done the same. There simply isn't the market for them anymore.

    Because of Brexit and new NOX/emission tarrifs, Imports have become prohibitively expensive for most, yes there will still be some but I would estimate maybe 5% or less of what it used to be. There were 109,000 cars imported in 2019, I would be willing to bet that less than 10,000 will be imported this year and many of them will be niche/classic type cars.


  • Registered Users Posts: 150 ✭✭Garvan


    Aren't the Irish Government paying fines to to EU for charging illegal VRT?

    The monies collected used to cover the fine and then some. But now I doubt it. You'd be crackers to import.

    So now Gov.ie is paying out to the EU with little coming in.

    I'm hoping they'll look at the empty coffers, realise there is a solution and ditch VRT.

    The North is s*** for second hand stuff especially motorbikes so I'm saying my prayers tonight ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,295 ✭✭✭w124man


    Garvan wrote: »
    Aren't the Irish Government paying fines to to EU for charging illegal VRT?

    Aw here we go!!

    No they aren't! VRT is not illegal!


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 2,957 Mod ✭✭✭✭macplaxton


    Mod note:

    Can we stick to discussing stuff relevant 'Classic Cars' in this thread please.

    For any more general vehicle import stuff, use the relevant thread in the 'Buying and Selling' section of Motors (or if less than 4 wheels, stick it in the Motorbikes sub forum)


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 2,957 Mod ✭✭✭✭macplaxton


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Besides, you can't register it here without the V5 anyway.

    Harder, but not impossible. You can with a dating cert as last resort.
    Can NCTS accept dating certs for vehicles pre 1981?

    Original registration certificate must be provided in all cases. A suitable dating certificate may be entertained as a last resort, but only in cases where the customer has not provided acceptable evidence explaining the absence of the original vehicle registration record e.g. a written statement from the registration authority of the previous country clarifying the position.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    macplaxton wrote: »
    Harder, but not impossible. You can with a dating cert as last resort.

    Interesting , is the dating cert for pre '81 set in stone or does it roll on a year every year?


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 2,957 Mod ✭✭✭✭macplaxton


    No idea as I can't see any reference to it in the VRT Manuals, it's on the NCTS FAQs page though (Q.20):
    Can NCTS accept dating certs for vehicles pre 1981?

    Original registration certificate must be provided in all cases. A suitable dating certificate may be entertained as a last resort, but only in cases where the customer has not provided acceptable evidence explaining the absence of the original vehicle registration record e.g. a written statement from the registration authority of the previous country clarifying the position.

    Do I need to provide registration documents for all motorcycles from 1981 on?

    Yes. In particular, cases where a bike has been re-discovered/re-built in a shed, it is likely to have already been registered in the state. The customer should pursue these records with DTTAS, in the first place, and take the necessary steps to have the registration re activated. These are not Revenue cases. If the vehicle has come from another country, the customer must deal with the relative authority in the country of origin, to begin with. In all such cases, an original registration document is the primary requirement.

    Other than that minor concession for 40+ year-old vehicles, Revenue will not lift a finger for you if you don't have the vehicle registration/deregistration papers from the exporting country.

    ALWAYS GET A V5C


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    Just seen this thread on the Autosport forum, from the UK perspective

    https://forums.autosport.com/topic/217045-old-car-vat-between-the-uk-and-europe/

    A little snippet "One of the major dealers of classic cars, based in London, told me that he will go to establish a company/office in Ireland not to loose the ties to buyers/sellers in EU."


  • Registered Users Posts: 4 brenl


    Good morning all - have anyone looked into or actually imported a car post Brexit ? From what I have read it looks like the VAT is now applicable to car imports as well as VRT.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,105 ✭✭✭hi5


    VAT on classic cars 30 plus years old in France is 5.5%. you could import your classic from UK to France and pay your VAT there at 5.5% and then onto Ireland.

    http://www.viathema.com/classic-car-information/auto-moto-import-eu/


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Isambard


    brenl wrote: »
    Good morning all - have anyone looked into or actually imported a car post Brexit ? From what I have read it looks like the VAT is now applicable to car imports as well as VRT.

    it is, if the car is from GB. Not from NI. It's best if we avoid confusion and stop using the name UK in this context.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,740 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    brenl wrote: »
    Good morning all - have anyone looked into or actually imported a car post Brexit ? From what I have read it looks like the VAT is now applicable to car imports as well as VRT.

    Actively awaiting the first guinea pig, we are.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    hi5 wrote: »
    VAT on classic cars 30 plus years old in France is 5.5%. you could import your classic from UK to France and pay your VAT there at 5.5% and then onto Ireland.

    http://www.viathema.com/classic-car-information/auto-moto-import-eu/

    UK is also 5%. Didnt people have issues with revenue in the past trying to bring in cars from outside Europe via the uk to avail of the 5% rate only for revenue tocharge them again on import to Ireland.

    I think to get the 5% you would have to register the car in the country of import then with an EU member state registration document you would not need to worry about the VAT on import to Ireland.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    Car99 wrote: »
    UK is also 5%. Didnt people have issues with revenue in the past trying to bring in cars from outside Europe via the uk to avail of the 5% rate only for revenue tocharge them again on import to Ireland.

    I think to get the 5% you would have to register the car in the country of import then with an EU member state registration document you would not need to worry about the VAT on import to Ireland.

    Best option is to register it in the north beforehand, if you know somebody to do that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,295 ✭✭✭w124man


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Actively awaiting the first guinea pig, we are.

    Friend of mine has just brought in a year old C Class diesel Mercedes. The VAT and duty content cost almost €10,000 on top of the VRT and NOX and, of course, the purchase price.

    IF you buy from a dealer and IF you are VAT registered, you can claim the UK VAT back


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    w124man wrote: »
    Friend of mine has just brought in a year old C Class diesel Mercedes. The VAT and duty content cost almost €10,000 on top of the VRT and NOX and, of course, the purchase price.

    IF you buy from a dealer and IF you are VAT registered, you can claim the UK VAT back

    Did it work out cheaper or the same as buying the same car here?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,740 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    two more I heard about in recent days:
    1999 XKR - €5000

    2017 X7 - I didn't get the exact number, but it was up €3500 over what the calc was in early December. He couldn't get an inspection until January 17th and they basically shrugged their shoulders and said 'It's 2021, 2021 rules apply'. So he coughed up and is appealing it.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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