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Fixer upper experiences?

  • 28-07-2020 10:12pm
    #1
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭


    Hi guys,

    I'm looking into buying a house that was built in the 70s that needs a few large jobs done to it. I had a viewing yesterday and brought a family friend along who has been a builder for 20+ years and he noticed some of the following that needs to be done:

    - BER is G rated. House will need whole new heating system, insulation, boiler and windows

    - Rewiring, most likely of whole house

    - Woodworm visible on outside of garage roof, unsure if it extends to inside of house (will need surveyor to check this out)

    - Whole house needs to be plastered

    - Cosmetically house is quite old and will need to be updated with carpets taken out etc

    From visual inspection he thinks the house roof and build seems very sturdy with no evidence of damp or leaks. The plumbing will need to be checked by surveyor but presumably needs to be done.

    The perks of this particular house are that it's in a great location and has great potential for extending in the future.

    Just wondering if anyone has had experience of fixer uppers and what your thoughts are?


Comments

  • #2
    Queenio
    Registered Users Posts: 53 ✭✭Queenio


    Ridgerun wrote: »
    - BER is G rated. House willpneed whole new heating system, insulation, boiler and windows

    - Rewiring, most likely of whole house

    - Woodworm visible on outside of garage roof, unsure if it extends to inside of house (will need surveyor to check this out)

    - Whole house needs to be plastered

    - Cosmetically house is quite old and will need to be updated with carpets taken out etc

    From visual inspection he thinks the house roof and build seems very sturdy with no evidence of damp or leaks. The plumbing will need to be checked by surveyor but presumably needs to be done.

    The perks of this particular house are that it's in a great location and has great potential for extending in the future

    I'm sale agreed on a similar property although it's D1 rated at least. Have been talked through the structural survey report and decided to go ahead. The urgent / immediate remedial works for us will be flashing to a garage roof, gutters, fumigation and an electrician to review the electrics. I suspect we will need a rewiring Job. All the rest can wait. We plan to extend in 5 years so makes sense to do things properly once. Location is great. Big back garden with tons of space and I think the potential is great for a solidly build 60s house that's
    In a good area. Remind me of this in a year and see if I still think the same! 😂


  • #3
    BrokenArrows
    Registered Users Posts: 7,500 ✭✭✭BrokenArrows


    If it's the right price and you have the cash to do the work then go for it. I've done it before.

    Just make sure that the price after renovation costs are worth it compared to buying something already renovated. You should also include hassle and stress to your costings.


  • #4
    Smiley11
    Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭Smiley11


    We've placed a bid on a serious project after a lot of thought & number crunching. We haven't had our engineer in yet but I can see the whole house needs to be rewired, heating updated, insulation, decorating, flooring & thats just for starters. We want to remove the chimneys as well & have decided this needs to be done before moving in or its a major upheaval down the line.

    We can afford the initial work but the rest will have to be done on a phased basis. I'm happy to do that as its the forever home but it definitely requires a lot of patience & dedication. I think that if you love the house enough you'll be willing to take on the work.

    For us, we don't care about the value after renovation because we'll never be moving out but its certainly something to consider if you don't intend to stay in yours forever. I've looked at the ceiling prices in our area & we'd most likely be going over that in our eventual spend. You definitely need to consider the total cost if you think you might sell up in a few years.


  • #5
    Rew
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 8,679 Mod ✭✭✭✭Rew


    You looking at 100-150k renovation, so make sure you have the money and that it will be worth 100-150k more after. You may hit issues with mortgage as banks often withhold funds till critical works are done.


  • #6
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Is it hollow block? If you can avoid hollowblock. They are very hard to make cosy. I think external insulation is the only option with these houses.


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  • #7
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Smiley11 wrote: »
    We've placed a bid on a serious project after a lot of thought & number crunching. We haven't had our engineer in yet but I can see the whole house needs to be rewired, heating updated, insulation, decorating, flooring & thats just for starters. We want to remove the chimneys as well & have decided this needs to be done before moving in or its a major upheaval down the line.

    By all means block a chimney but the idea of removing the entire thing doesn't make sense to me. Changes the look of the house in a negative way and unnecessary cost.


  • #8
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 26,986 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    Is this a house for life or just a stepping stone?
    If its a house for life I wouldn't worry as much about recouping the costs invested, if its just a stepping stone then its obviously much more important to do the maths.

    I've done it and made money from it, a lot depends on how much you can do yourself and how long you are willing to live with "a work in progress".
    The cheapest way is to do as much yourself and do it as you go (other than things like plumbing and wiring) but plastering and finishing room by room for example, while being more expensive in the long term, means you don't have a large initial outlay.

    /edit
    lol
    forgot to add that I'm in a total fixer upper for the last 12 months, ~80 years old and needs everything done to it (plumbing, wiring, slab poured, EWI, roof needs a bit of TLC, windows/doors, some flat roof extensions that need rebuilding) and we have 1 toddler and another on the way.
    Its all about how you look and deal with things, we will get the structural work done in one go and then finish each room as needed.


  • #9
    Smiley11
    Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭Smiley11


    Yellow_Fern wrote: »
    By all means block a chimney but the idea of removing the entire thing doesn't make sense to me. Changes the look of the house in a negative way and unnecessary cost.


    Thanks but we'd be removing the entire wall to make an open plan living space & the second chimney has already been partially removed so we won't miss either. Removing it in its entirety will also free up space above for an extra bathroom rather than extend so it makes sense for us.


  • #10
    jonnybravo
    Registered Users Posts: 568 ✭✭✭jonnybravo


    We're in the middle of our second fixer upper at the moment (both 1970's houses in Dublin 15).

    The first was a full rewire, replumbing, kitchen bathrooms, flooring, changing windows doors etc. It was pre kids so was much easier as had more time to organise things and didn't make a difference if it wasn't finished when we moved in.

    The second is the same as the first plus a small extension, knocking an internal wall (which needs steel support), underfloor heating & external wall insulation. It's obviously taking a lot longer and it was a lot harder & more expensive to get people to do the work (first house was 2012). We need the house pretty much finished before we move in. We're lucky that we have a house to stay in while the work is going on so pressure to move in is less, but it does take a lot of time.


  • #11
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    IF its your first time it will be a learning experience.
    Ive done similar with so many houses now I could do it very economically and in my sleep. But the first time I was totally lost. Great experience though.


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  • #12
    Moonbeams8
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22 ✭Moonbeams8


    I'm in the middle of renovating my house now. First time, huge learning experience. Hoping it will all be worth it in the end as right now I'm in the thick of it and there are some hard moments for sure.


  • #13
    SheepTurtle
    Registered Users Posts: 16 ✭SheepTurtle


    Does anyone know if banks are giving loans on top of mortgages for renovations?

    I have seen a house with huge potential online, haven't gone to see it in real life yet due to working hours, but it needs some work - new kitchen, bathroom and reviewing of hall/sitting room layout but it can be lived in. There doesn't seem to be any big structural work as far as I can see. No expert now! We only have our deposit at this time though and not much for renovations.


  • #14
    myate
    Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭myate


    We've just gone through that process! Bought in late November, started reno a week later, finished the majority of it the week before lockdown! We had an architect do plans for it, as the house had massive potential but wasn't taking advantage of it. Architect done the plans only, we looked after getting various trades to reno it. A builder/carpenter did the majority of the work, then had a separate plumber, electrician, bathroom install, windows/doors etc.
    Planned to spend around 50k...that soon went to 65ish when we made a few changes to plans. Then we said we'd do a small extension properly instead of just re-roofing. That sent it to 100k, including landscaping, tarmac which we could have left but it's done now & finished! So yes we went over budget but only because we did more.
    I'm good a dealing with people & project managing (apparently) and was on site nearly every day keeping trades on track & lined up. But even then it was constant following up & chasing to get stuff done, electrics especially.
    We knew the finish the house was going to have, so making those decisions was fast, easy & no problem for us & certainly didn't delay anything. Example, we priced, then ordered our kitchen & had it installed 3 weeks later!
    Huge learning experience as others mentioned, but we're delighted with the finished house now! I haven't got it valued yet, but don't really care as wont be selling, ever!!


  • #15
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    I know you don't want to sell it but..

    Considering you put in 100k into the house above what you paid for it, its sounds unlikely you would get that back if you tried to sell it.

    So it that kinda investment wouldn't make sense if you trying to flip it. Only if you were intending to live in it long term? Any thoughts?


  • #16
    duffman13
    Registered Users Posts: 8,945 ✭✭✭duffman13


    Ridgerun wrote: »
    Hi guys,

    I'm looking into buying a house that was built in the 70s that needs a few large jobs done to it. I had a viewing yesterday and brought a family friend along who has been a builder for 20+ years and he noticed some of the following that needs to be done:

    - BER is G rated. House will need whole new heating system, insulation, boiler and windows

    - Rewiring, most likely of whole house

    - Woodworm visible on outside of garage roof, unsure if it extends to inside of house (will need surveyor to check this out)

    - Whole house needs to be plastered

    - Cosmetically house is quite old and will need to be updated with carpets taken out etc

    From visual inspection he thinks the house roof and build seems very sturdy with no evidence of damp or leaks. The plumbing will need to be checked by surveyor but presumably needs to be done.

    The perks of this particular house are that it's in a great location and has great potential for extending in the future.

    Just wondering if anyone has had experience of fixer uppers and what your thoughts are?

    I'll give you costings on similar work I did recently on a 3 bed semi in Dublin

    BER was E, got internal insulation with 75mm warmboard done by a plasterer for 7.5k, this included replastering the entire house. The cost of the 100mm board with companies offer the SEAI grant was around 12k, plus more for plastering the remaining walls,

    I got a new combi boiler for 3k, radiators were thankfully new enough.

    Windows including removal of a porch and adding a palladio door was around 8k

    Wooden floors and carpet 4k for the entire house and after plastering it needed it.

    Rewiring 6k

    Bathroom 6k

    Kitchen, Huge sliderobe wardrobe and a feature wall 10k (All from same carpenter so priced the whole thing together)

    A fully renovated property of similar standard went for 60k more but we got to put our own stamp on it.

    All of the above was multiple quotes from multiple suppliers and a fair bit of haggling


  • #17
    myate
    Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭myate


    beauf wrote: »
    I know you don't want to sell it but..

    Considering you put in 100k into the house above what you paid for it, its sounds unlikely you would get that back if you tried to sell it.

    So it that kinda investment wouldn't make sense if you trying to flip it. Only if you were intending to live in it long term? Any thoughts?


    Because of the location, prime seaside village, panoramic sea views, not overlooked, I'd get very close to it....a bidding war would probably help matters!! Houses here with no views, in crowded estates go for stupid money. I will get it valued at some point...just no point now with Covid around.

    Totally agree, if this was a pure flip, I wouldn't have gone near 100k, could have stuck to 60k easily. Or if I bought to rent it out, spend even less. But it's house for life.


  • #18
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Rew wrote: »
    You looking at 100-150k renovation, so make sure you have the money and that it will be worth 100-150k more after. You may hit issues with mortgage as banks often withhold funds till critical works are done.

    I dunno if thats always true. If I put 100k~150k into my house I'm probably competing with bigger houses in my area some of which will have much of this kinda renovation already done. Also areas are kinda capped. Another 100~200 might put you in a better location down the road.

    If you love the area, and you're staying for another 5~20yrs thats not an issue though.


  • #19
    Moonbeams8
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22 ✭Moonbeams8


    I think there's some good points here about budgeting. I was strict with my budget at the start as I'm doing this by myself but you get sucked in!!

    Because I was already paying for the labour I decided to do some work that would eventually be needed upstairs anyways. While the house is a building site you start thinking "I'll just do this now and get it done!". I'm looking at going max 15k over budget by the end. My house is in a great area and it was an old house in need of love so I do feel confident with my decisions. It may be my forever house but if not, it'll be mine for the foreseeable future regardless so I went with my gut. I'll be so delighted when it's done, right now I'm finding the covid delays tough. First world problems!


  • #20
    smelly sock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,820 ✭✭✭smelly sock


    You're never finished with houses tbh. If the price is attractive go for it. If its your home for life then there is no rush to get everything done immediately.


  • #21
    enricoh
    Registered Users Posts: 4,798 ✭✭✭enricoh


    smelly sock wrote: »
    You're never finished with houses tbh. If the price is attractive go for it. If its your home for life then there is no rush to get everything done immediately.

    Yeah, same as that. Someone was on earlier about buying fixer uppers, renovate n selling them on. I don't think that's an option anymore unless you are in the building game. Materials are gone expensive and tradesmen are scarce n expensive. Too many unknowns with global recession, brexit etc for my liking anyway!


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  • #22
    3DataModem
    Registered Users Posts: 3,936 ✭✭✭3DataModem


    My advice: don't do it to save money, do it because you *want* to do it.


  • #23
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 14,344 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    I'm in and out of many derelict houses quite often, and it's important to figure out what you're working with. I've an interest in buying a "forever home" that's a cheap and cheerful do-er upper, and after having been in what must be about 100 derelict houses over the last couple of years, all at varying stages of build or damage having occurred, I think I've decided that the best thing to do, no matter what you buy, is to immediately strip it all back to bare block and wood work.


    It's the kind of work that'd fill a roll-on skip, but you could DIY it and at least you'd really know what you're dealing with. You can see all the nuts and bolts (so to speak) and figure out where you're likely to have issues. Also gives you the opportunity to rewire, run plumbing, insulate, plaster, etc. without having to work around things.


    Ive chatted to a lot of people who bought fixer upper houses and immediately went down the road of aesthetics and making them look nice, and didn't pay enough attention to the structural stuff, and were invariably pushed back to the start line repeatedly when they'd have to undo stuff to get back to where the were.

    Water is the biggest enemy in many of these houses, so a trustworthy roofer, and perhaps window/door installer, would be the first phonecall I'd be making.

    Some surveyors are excellent at picking up on things, but others don't really care and just fly through the house picking up the very obvious stuff. So be careful there, too. I've seen surveyors write a report by simply taking a half-second glance at the house, whereas others would be trying to pull up carpet and spending an age in the attic.

    Yellow_Fern wrote: »
    Is it hollow block? If you can avoid hollowblock. They are very hard to make cosy. I think external insulation is the only option with these houses.

    By hollow block, presumably you mean cavity blocks (number 8 shape)?

    If so, I'd argue that rendering outside, and internally insulating may be a better approach. We built an extension with cavity blocks and internally insulated. With the heating on only a short period of time the place is roasting (and tends to generally hold the heat).

    The rest of the house is cavity wall, but you'd not notice any difference between the two.


  • #24
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    We're just out the other end of a complete renovation of a 1960s home.

    My advice would be to figure out everything that needs to be done with an engineer, set your budget and then get it costed properly by a QS. You can then make a list of priorities and trim out the excess fat and get it back to your budget.

    Doing things on the hoof and adding in extra bits, knocking a wall here and there or changing plans is the best way to blow your budget and turn the project into a nightmare.

    We budgeted 190k for the whole project and came in bang on and happy, whereas I know a friend who did something similar, budgeted 80k, spent 160k and the whole experience was a disaster, as well as the end product as so much was unplanned and done on the hoof.


  • #25
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Deleted User wrote: »


    By hollow block, presumably you mean cavity blocks (number 8 shape)?

    If so, I'd argue that rendering outside, and internally insulating may be a better approach. We built an extension with cavity blocks and internally insulated. With the heating on only a short period of time the place is roasting (and tends to generally hold the heat).

    The rest of the house is cavity wall, but you'd not notice any difference between the two.

    Yes those. Glad to hear you good experience. You can have issues with cold bridges with these kind of wall.


  • #26
    brisan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,242 ✭✭✭brisan


    Ridgerun wrote: »
    Hi guys,

    I'm looking into buying a house that was built in the 70s that needs a few large jobs done to it. I had a viewing yesterday and brought a family friend along who has been a builder for 20+ years and he noticed some of the following that needs to be done:

    - BER is G rated. House will need whole new heating system, insulation, boiler and windows

    - Rewiring, most likely of whole house

    - Woodworm visible on outside of garage roof, unsure if it extends to inside of house (will need surveyor to check this out)

    - Whole house needs to be plastered

    - Cosmetically house is quite old and will need to be updated with carpets taken out etc

    From visual inspection he thinks the house roof and build seems very sturdy with no evidence of damp or leaks. The plumbing will need to be checked by surveyor but presumably needs to be done.

    The perks of this particular house are that it's in a great location and has great potential for extending in the future.

    Just wondering if anyone has had experience of fixer uppers and what your thoughts are?
    Myself and my 2 brothers have bought and flipped numerous houses as a team ( they still do I dont)
    Caveat I am a sparks ,my brothers are a plumber and a carpenter /cabinet maker and we are not afraid of doing donkey work.
    Plus we have numerous contacts in the trade.

    1) Builders/tradesmen prices are very high at the moment as demand is high.
    2) A lot of houses built in the 70s will have Gunbarrell (GB) piping which will have to come out.
    At certain times in the 70s copper was very expensive
    This will cost as all new piping preferably copper but a lot use PEX (Qualpex)
    Rewiring is probably needed
    Insulating the rooms could take 3-4 inches off the size of a room.
    A wrap on the outside is easier,less disruptive but more expensive
    3)Go for triple glazed instead of double glazed if you can
    Its better for soundproofing as well as insulation.
    Do not get too hung up on the BER rating
    It will take a lot to get 25-30 k back in heating bills
    Good windows, a good boiler balloons in chimney ,attic insulation and even shutters rather than blinds on windows will help a lot.
    4 )If you can leave the house empty and let the tradesmen have at it ,a lot easier and a lot less stressful.
    If you know tradesmen its a lot cheaper to get direct labour than hiring a contractor.


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