Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

5starpool · 22-08-2014 11:47PM

J. Marston wrote: »

No way.

I don't understand why they're buying him really. I saw a stat the other day where Sturridge has outscored Torres and Suarez in their first 50 games for Liverpool.

Squad depth maybe but if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Someone else is needed. I'm not convinced Balotelli is the answer, but Sturridge has a tendency to get injured leaving the only other strikers at the club as Borini and Lambert which is not enough for a club that is aiming to challenge at the top end of the league as well as CL and other commitments.

Balotelli is a risk for sure, but something else is definitely needed.

kryogen · 22-08-2014 11:48PM

5starpool wrote: »

Bit early to come to that conclusion isn't it? I could point to lots of other players that they are likely to be better value than, and you could point to ones they are likely to be worse value that, but the above have played a combined total of 1 competitive game for Liverpool so far, so value to Liverpool relative to what has been paid can't exactly be established yet can it?

Nope, not definitively, purely talking about on paper value which is what was being discussed I imagine since Balotelli has not played a game for Liverpool and the poster was intimating Liverpool have got a good deal for a player of his calibre. On paper

Can't actually judge the transfer window and the players bought in it for quite some time yet and whether they turned out to be money well spent, a bargain or an overpriced flop

Adamocovic · 22-08-2014 11:48PM

twam2008 wrote: »

A bit of a reality check is needed though, this team is nowhere near winning the league, I think most would be happy to finish fourth this season, to compare it to a side that previously won the league has no bearing.

I never said we were going to win the league. I've said many times I can't imagine us posing a threat until 2-3 key players are brought in.

What I have said is that this team in my mind is not nearly as terrible as people like to make out. Surely they have the capabilities of getting fourth.

I'm not comparing, I'm pointing out that most of the players we think are awful have won league titles before. Surely that would suggest they aren't as bad as people are saying and that they should be able to, with the right guidance, challenge for a top 4 and get it.

kryogen · 22-08-2014 11:50PM

5starpool wrote: »

Someone else is needed. I'm not convinced Balotelli is the answer, but Sturridge has a tendency to get injured leaving the only other strikers at the club as Borini and Lambert which is not enough for a club that is aiming to challenge at the top end of the league as well as CL and other commitments.

Balotelli is a risk for sure, but something else is definitely needed.

Pfft, injury concerns? Welcome to the Manchester United thread, where every player gets injured on a regular basis, some simply walking from the dressing room to the pitch!

On a serious note, I understand the concern about Sturridge, but I would have been looking to bring in back up/partner that would compliment him rather then someone like Mario. Could have it completely wrong, they could hit it off, as I said, could be a stroke of genius, just my take on the situation is all.

RobbingBandit · 22-08-2014 11:51PM

kryogen wrote: »

As you can also see by the bolded part you mention players, meaning your comment is not purely exclusive to the Balotelli deal, then go on to say someone should teach the Man Utd guys how to lowball. It seems to be a comment on transfer policy rather then a particular transfer.

If you were just referring to this one transfer that Liverpool are involved in and not a general comment on how they have gone about their business this year it seems a bit misplaced and silly when you take the actual deal itself into context. If you are just talking about the Balotelli deal then Liverpool have not lowballed, they have been offered a player Milan want rid of at a cut price deal. No genius transfer guru stuff going on there.

If you were talking about how Liverpool have dealt with transfers this year the sentence would make sense, though be inaccurate imho.

I do get a chuckle from the desire for Utd to lowball, which was one of the stronger criticisms of the club last season, lowballing

WE are thinking of paying more than 3 times £16m (£50m for Di Maria) not Liverpool. Hope that is clear now as I am too sleepy now.

Adamocovic · 22-08-2014 11:51PM

RobbingBandit wrote: »

No they were not useless by any means they were overwhelmed by a very good Dutch side in that 5-1 match. Some of their best players and several other countries to boot were suffering from exhaustion, look at Messi, Neymar and Ronaldo, none of them performed on the level expected, same could be said of United last season and last Sunday too.

As I said above repeat successes are few and far between, players get older, injured, sold or just have a poor period of performance it can have a long lasting effect on both the individual and overall team moral.

Well that's what I'm getting at. I just think people are taking our recent problems as players being awful rather than players not performing to their potential.

Hopefully VG can bring in confidence and structure and we can go back to seeing Old Trafford being a place teams are dreading to go to.

JRant · 22-08-2014 11:56PM

Adamocovic wrote: »

I'm playing the same tune but when I see people using that argument it kind of annoys me.

Yes I am aware we have lost the likes of Evra, Vidic, Ferdinand, Giggs and Scholes but VG has inherited a team that has won the league before, and not so long ago. Yes they are experiencing a tough time and work needs to be done but this idea of him getting a squad that is "crap" I don't buy into at all.

You'd swear he took over a team that has been near relegation for the last 10 seasons the way some people talk about it.

I still think we need to bring in 2-3 key players to pose a real threat but even saying that the team as it stands isn't as awful as people make it out to be. It's going through a rough patch and hopefully VG can fix this.

As much as people like to say our team is absolutely terrible surely the players there are capable of getting fourth place if they can manage some form and stability under VG. Then look at adding 2-3 key players and they are back to title contenders.

IMO it's not the team that's terrible, it's the midfield.

If LVG manages 4th place with our current midfield then quite frankly he's a miracle worker.

We needed to invest heavily in the midfield department this summer and that has not happened yet and doesn't look like happening either.

kryogen · 22-08-2014 11:56PM

RobbingBandit wrote: »

WE are thinking of paying more than 3 times £16m (£50m for Di Maria) not Liverpool. Hope that is clear now as I am too sleepy now.

Yes, we are thinking of paying more then three times that for PLAYERS, that is plural

Don't worry about it we can just forget it, hardly that important.

5starpool · 22-08-2014 11:57PM

kryogen wrote: »

Pfft, injury concerns? Welcome to the Manchester United thread, where every player gets injured on a regular basis, some simply walking from the dressing room to the pitch!

Ye must have the wrong type of grass installed or something.

Adamocovic · 23-08-2014 12:01AM

JRant wrote: »

IMO it's not the team that's terrible, it's the midfield.

If LVG manages 4th place with our current midfield then quite frankly he's a miracle worker.

We needed to invest heavily in the midfield department this summer and that has not happened yet and doesn't look like happening either.

Yeah our midfield is very concerning. Hard to imagine us getting whats needed before this window is over though.

Herrera was a much needed inclusion but now he will be out (hopefully only 2 weeks), Fellaini looks set to be out for a good bit, Carrick injured, we are pretty much left with Cleverley and Fletcher. Jones might have to move up to CM.

Worrying alright.

twam2008 · 23-08-2014 12:01AM

Adamocovic wrote: »

I never said we were going to win the league. I've said many times I can't imagine us posing a threat until 2-3 key players are brought in.

What I have said is that this team in my mind is not nearly as terrible as people like to make out. Surely they have the capabilities of getting fourth.

I'm not comparing, I'm pointing out that most of the players we think are awful have won league titles before. Surely that would suggest they aren't as bad as people are saying and that they should be able to, with the right guidance, challenge for a top 4 and get it.

As it stands, I really cannot see us finishing within the top four, I'm not looking to have a go, but using this team won the league winds me up, there is so much work to be done. It's starting to look less likely that there will be significant changes. And signing 3 players is just a wide open get out clause, given our recent history there is no guarantee we will be able to get the necessary players have to judge the squad as it is for the upcoming season.

Hank Scorpio · 23-08-2014 12:05AM

If Rooney and RVP stay fit I still think there's a decent shot of getting 4th, the squad might be lacking but with those 2 and Mata behind there is real genuine class

v3ttel · 23-08-2014 12:05AM

Adamocovic wrote: »

I never said we were going to win the league. I've said many times I can't imagine us posing a threat until 2-3 key players are brought in.

What I have said is that this team in my mind is not nearly as terrible as people like to make out. Surely they have the capabilities of getting fourth.

I'm not comparing, I'm pointing out that most of the players we think are awful have won league titles before. Surely that would suggest they aren't as bad as people are saying and that they should be able to, with the right guidance, challenge for a top 4 and get it.

Adamocovic wrote: »

Well that's what I'm getting at. I just think people are taking our recent problems as players being awful rather than players not performing to their potential.

Hopefully VG can bring in confidence and structure and we can go back to seeing Old Trafford being a place teams are dreading to go to.

Adamocovic wrote: »

Yeah our midfield is very concerning. Hard to imagine us getting whats needed before this window is over though.

Herrera was a much needed inclusion but now he will be out (hopefully only 2 weeks), Fellaini looks set to be out for a good bit, Carrick injured, we are pretty much left with Cleverley and Fletcher. Jones might have to move up to CM.

Worrying alright.

+1 on all of this. A very realistic and balanced take on things. A lot more coherent and constructive than the constant whining about everything from our current squad to the way Marcos Rojo's shirt is printed.

At the end of the day, we all want United to win.

Adamocovic · 23-08-2014 12:07AM

twam2008 wrote: »

As it stands, I really cannot see us finishing within the top four, I'm not looking to have a go, but using this team won the league winds me up, there is so much work to be done. It's starting to look less likely that there will be significant changes. And signing 3 players is just a wide open get out clause, given our recent history there is no guarantee we will be able to get the necessary players have to judge the squad as it is for the upcoming season.

Fair enough, we both have different opinions on the quality of the players. Injuries will make this season even tougher. Hopefully the team can over perform while players our out.

Going to just take it one game at a time though and focus on the weekend. Hopefully a win and I can then show my face at the pub. Was stuck with three Liverpool fans last Saturday, wasn't ideal in the least :P

aligator_am · 23-08-2014 12:07AM

City should send Balotelli a giant box of fireworks as a "Welcome back to England" gift, with a bit of luck he'll burn down Anfield :P

Adamocovic · 23-08-2014 12:21AM

I know VG has said that RVP is fit for the weekend, but did he mention anything about Evans, Welbeck and Valencia? I know they all returned to first team training this week, but will they be fit enough for the match?

kryogen · 23-08-2014 12:23AM

Adamocovic wrote: »

I know VG has said that RVP is fit for the weekend, but did he mention anything about Evans, Welbeck and Valencia? I know they all returned to first team training this week, but will they be fit enough for the match?

Evans only returned today or yesterday he said so won't be available for selection, Valencia is back and I am not sure on Welbeck.

twam2008 · 23-08-2014 12:23AM

Adamocovic · 23-08-2014 12:26AM

Just found this provisional squad for the match:

Man United: De Gea, Lindegaard, Amos, Rafael, Valencia, Smalling, Jones, M Keane, Blackett, James, Fletcher, Cleverley, Anderson, Young, Mata, Kagawa, Zaha, Januzaj, Van Persie, Rooney, Welbeck, Hernandez, Powell, W Keane.

At least the likes of Rafael, Valencia, Welbeck and RVP are back.

kryogen · 23-08-2014 12:32AM

I see Sunderland being set up in a 442 given how relatively weak we will probably be in the middle and they will try to get Johnson and Larsson down the sides of the the 3 central defenders to get balls in to Wickham and Fletcher, Wickham being target man and Fletcher looking for the knock downs and also to drag one of the centre backs out of position.

Maximus Alexander · 23-08-2014 12:35AM

kryogen wrote: »

Good interview. How you could not have faith in that man would be beyond me!

I can already see myself being devastated in three years when he decides to move on after winning the PL and the CL. :pac:

Maximus Alexander · 23-08-2014 12:37AM

twam2008 wrote: »

Always feel I'm biased when I say it, but majority of people I talk to agree, even Liverpool supporters.

Aye, I know a Liverpool supporter who hates Neville for some reason, always did, but even he reluctantly admits he's a good pundit.

kryogen · 23-08-2014 12:38AM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I can already see myself being devastated in three years when he decides to move on after winning the PL and the CL. :pac:

Now that is the kind of devastation I could enjoy

2moreMinutes · 23-08-2014 12:39AM

Tbh, I don't see anything of any great note in Neville's article bar his great respect for LVG, LVG's fondness of the word philosophy and his self-belief is as high as it's always been over the years. All seems pretty standard for an interview.

JRant · 23-08-2014 12:41AM

Adamocovic wrote: »

Yeah our midfield is very concerning. Hard to imagine us getting whats needed before this window is over though.

Herrera was a much needed inclusion but now he will be out (hopefully only 2 weeks), Fellaini looks set to be out for a good bit, Carrick injured, we are pretty much left with Cleverley and Fletcher. Jones might have to move up to CM.

Worrying alright.

Fully agree, at the moment we are down to the barest of bones in midfield.

Injuries or not a combo of Fletcher and Cleverley hardly strikes fear into an opposing team.

Can we move Jones up though with so few fit defenders either?

aligator_am · 23-08-2014 12:55AM

2moreMinutes wrote: »

Tbh, I don't see anything of any great note in Neville's article bar his great respect for LVG, LVG's fondness of the word philosophy and his self-belief is as high as it's always been over the years. All seems pretty standard for an interview.

I liked how up front LVG was to be honest, also liked how he indicated the young players would get a chance and he will stamp in his mentality one way or the other.

Seems a far more definite / structured attitude than Moyes ever exuded, or maybe was ever allowed to.

Personally, I felt more upbeat after reading the article than I did for the vast majority of last season.

Son Of A Vidic · 23-08-2014 01:54AM

aligator_am wrote: »

City should send Balotelli a giant box of fireworks as a "Welcome back to England" gift, with a bit of luck he'll burn down Anfield :P

Mad when you think about it, they get rid of one fruit and bring in another.

aligator_am · 23-08-2014 02:03AM

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Mad when you think about it, they get rid of one fruit and bring in another.

Yup, both are gifted but also total loonballs.

One of the lads in work mentioned a statistic which showed that in all his games for City, Balotelli only had 1 assist (unfortunately the one that won them the league).

That seems crazy to me, but lad is that mental that he'll likely turn out as a prodigy for Liverpool, just to annoy everyone.

Kirby · 23-08-2014 02:10AM

Some strike on him though. He always used to embarrass Hart in training. Mario would give him nearly 40 yards and still score with most of his shots.

His shooting technique is, in my opinion, his biggest asset. Expect a few screamers this season from him.

Mitch Connor · 23-08-2014 06:12AM

Kirby wrote: »

Some strike on him though. He always used to embarrass Hart in training. Mario would give him nearly 40 yards and still score with most of his shots.

His shooting technique is, in my opinion, his biggest asset. Expect a few screamers this season from him.

No way is he scoring MOST of his shots from 40. no, none, zip, not having it.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

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