Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

Rubber_Soul · 21-08-2014 10:43AM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

not sure if ye read my post late last night, but the fact that we had two signings in the space of 24 hours, 3 days before our end of year finances were closed, makes me suspicious about how our business is being conducted. maybe and i stress maybe, LVG didnt have full control over those signings, he could have been told the money needed to be spent before the EOY closed and he agreed with Shaw and Herrera. now of course, it could just be a massive coincidence and just happened like that, but £22.4million worth of wage cuts kicked in 4 days later and then we didnt spend a penny for 7 weeks. Q1 finances will close end of September...are we spreading the cost of transfers across windows, or more to the point restriced in what we can pay up front, therefore deals are hard to close?

i guess thats the risk when a fund accountant is running out business, its going to be based towards financial goals, as opposed to football.

Transfer fees are spread out over the lifetime of the contract on the clubs accounts. This article explains it fairly well http://www.danielgeey.com/football-amortisation-chelseas-50m-luiz-profit/

Mitch Connor · 21-08-2014 10:43AM

Coat22 wrote: »

My understanding on how United recognise transfer fees is that they are ammortised over the contract life of the player. Thus the 16M spent on Rojo is recognised over the next 60 months etc - this would make it redundant from a finacials point of view in terms of when bought the players.

this is correct, and it is how every club accounts for their transfers.

RayCun · 21-08-2014 10:44AM

Paper runs completely uncorroborated story linking player X with club Y
People come on here to complain, "hey, how come the paper didn't run a completely uncorroborated story linking player X with United?!?!?"

Paper runs completely uncorroborated story linking player X with United
People come on here to complain, "FFS Woodward, why haven't you bought Player X yet? Is it that ****er Giggs telling you not to sign him?!?!"

Mitch Connor · 21-08-2014 10:46AM

RayCun wrote: »

uncorroborated [/IMG]

In your opinion.

homerjay2005 · 21-08-2014 10:48AM

intellectual dosser wrote: »

This time last year this thread was a awash with complaints that the club was so transparent in their transfer interests leading them to be scuppered and the club embarrassed, now this thread is awash with complaints that there is no evidence of negotiations in progress.

you do know/realise that both of those things, are not mutually exclusive?

we are 10 days away from end of window, maybe nothing has been reported in last 7 weeks, because nothing/very little has actually happened?

the club wasnt embarrased due to the media, it did a great job of doing it themselves. "flying home for urgent transfer business" and then disappearing for 2 months was not invented by the media, it came from our CE.

i cant even believe this is up for debate - keeping the media informed/uninformed about our transfer policy is nothing to slam or praise the club for but when the club starts becoming a laughing stock due to their actions, it then becomes an issue.

theres very little going on that the media dont find out.

paulbok · 21-08-2014 10:49AM

Coat22 wrote: »

Wit the season started (or about to start) across Europe the options for signing marquee players is gone though.

Really all thats left to sign is the "surplus" squad players at clubs like Madrid, which would appear to be Di Maria, maybe Khadeira and maybe Alonso - much like Ozil was the last pick of the bunch last summer.

Now I'd be happy with 2 out of those 3 but realistically if we got 1 we'd do well.

So we're then faced with the option to "upgrade" or wait. I don't know about you but give me upgrade in place of a repeat of last season or last weekend anyday.

Alonso is exactly the type of player we should be going for,
to improve the quality of the bench/squad.
However as many have mentioned it's the starting XI that is of most concern particularly in midfield with Fellani out for several months and Carrick still out. Last week it was the defence that had a gaping hole, now kinda plugged with Rojo, so the spotlight has swung again to midfield. Again it's now a numbers game, the center midfield currently consisting of;
AH, a new addition to the team & England, will have increasing pressure on him.
TC, not good enough,
DF, squad quality only & could have a relapse again
Ando, not rated by recent managers and no-one wants to buy him.
PJ, a defender at risk of "jack of all trades"

The time to get the players was the week following the teams return from the USA, now it's a desperate case of Winning Streak for any club selling to us. Lessons have obviously not been learned from last year. I do expect a further signing for midfield, but like Rojo it may well be underwhelming.
If we do get deMaria, I don't expect we will, it would be a great but low priority signing. At this stage Vidal should be forgotten about, so Kedheria should be the one we go for, available & good value at £20m but God only knows what Dudward will end up doing. I think at best it'll be a Rojo type singing, decent who may turn out really good, but not the midfielder we really need.

mufc1993 · 21-08-2014 10:50AM

Would love you see us throw Madrid 80-90 million and get Varane, Khedira and Di Maria. Even if we left out Di Maria and got the other 2 for 40-50 million! All of them want game time, we'd be able to offer it.

One can dream...

RayCun · 21-08-2014 10:50AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

In your opinion.

If the story has a quote from the selling club, or the buying club, or the player, saying an approach has been made, cool.
Otherwise it's nothing to get excited about.

intellectual dosser · 21-08-2014 10:54AM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

you do know/realise that both of those things, are not mutually exclusive?

we are 10 days away from end of window, maybe nothing has been reported in last 7 weeks, because nothing/very little has actually happened?

the club wasnt embarrased due to the media, it did a great job of doing it themselves. "flying home for urgent transfer business" and then disappearing for 2 months was not invented by the media, it came from our CE.

i cant even believe this is up for debate - keeping the media informed/uninformed about our transfer policy is nothing to slam or praise the club for but when the club starts becoming a laughing stock due to their actions, it then becomes an issue.

theres very little going on that the media dont find out.

I'm going beyond the clubs relationship with the media, just the general availability of information to every Tom, Dick and Harry. Its not how top clubs go about their business.

While there is no way of knowing for sure, maybe the club has returned to being shrewd and getting things done instead of providing water cooler gossip and ending up with egg on face (ie. Fabregas)

My underlying feeling is that we shouldnt be losing faith. I dont believe LVG would have taken the job had he not been given control and support in transfers. We lost to Swansea at home, not pretty, but its not grounds for a crisis.

xtal191 · 21-08-2014 10:57AM

mufc1993 wrote: »

Would love you see us throw Madrid 80-90 million and get Varane, Khedira and Di Maria. Even if we left out Di Maria and got the other 2 for 40-50 million! All of them want game time, we'd be able to offer it.

One can dream...

80-90m would prob only get Di Maria and Khedira

homerjay2005 · 21-08-2014 10:59AM

intellectual dosser wrote: »

We lost to Swansea at home, not pretty, but its not grounds for a crisis.

nothing has changed since Saturday to be honest. we were in crisis for the last 12 months - the only magnification of the crisis is a growing injury list and a shortening timeframe to deadline day - most peoples optimism was based as much on us signing top class players as much as it was based on us getting LVG.

for me the only things thats changed since last saturday is that our problems still have not been solved and another 5 days have passed, 5 days closer to sept 2nd.

Mitch Connor · 21-08-2014 11:00AM

intellectual dosser wrote: »

My underlying feeling is that we shouldnt be losing faith. I dont believe LVG would have taken the job had he not been given control and support in transfers. We lost to Swansea at home, not pretty, but its not grounds for a crisis.

My understanding/opinion is that United planned/expected to get deals done in a better manner this summer, it was expected to have stuff done early. LVG would have been assured of support because I genuinely believe the club felt confident we wouldn't repeat the failings of last summer.

That we haven't got deals done is not down to a lack of money, it is down to poor execution in the transfer market again.

I stand by my opinion that we moved (poorly) for Fabregas, Bale and Ronaldo last summer - again, the intent was there, just no good execution.

It is the execution at United that is the proble, not (imo) the intent.

mufc1993 · 21-08-2014 11:02AM

xtal191 wrote: »

80-90m would prob only get Di Maria and Khedira

Only approximate figures. Khedira 25 mil Varane 20 mil Di Maria 45 mil roughly.

bullvine · 21-08-2014 11:03AM

Was Scholes not saying a few weeks ago that United would be 20-30% better this season with Van Gaal, now after a defeat hes spewing stuff about being scared. Hes as bad as the rest of us, one defeat and we're all panicking!

Mitch Connor · 21-08-2014 11:04AM

bullvine wrote: »

Was Scholes not saying a few weeks ago that United would be 20-30% better this season with Van Gaal, now after a defeat hes spewing stuff about being scared. Hes as bad as the rest of us, one defeat and we're all panicking!

20% better would still have us stuggling for the CL.

Headshot · 21-08-2014 11:05AM

bullvine wrote: »

Was Scholes not saying a few weeks ago that United would be 20-30% better this season with Van Gaal, now after a defeat hes spewing stuff about being scared. Hes as bad as the rest of us, one defeat and we're all panicking!

Its not the manner of the defeat even thou it was quite hard to take. Its the debacle of the transfer window again. I think Paul like most of us saw a great summer of transfer business happening but overall its quite disappointing.

bucketybuck · 21-08-2014 11:06AM

intellectual dosser wrote: »

While there is no way of knowing for sure, maybe the club has returned to being shrewd and getting things done instead of providing water cooler gossip and ending up with egg on face (ie. Fabregas)

I have a very simple way of knowing for sure if they are getting things done. I just look at our midfield options and then ask "What has been done?".

At the minute the answer is "not nearly enough".

kippy · 21-08-2014 11:06AM

bullvine wrote: »

Was Scholes not saying a few weeks ago that United would be 20-30% better this season with Van Gaal, now after a defeat hes spewing stuff about being scared. Hes as bad as the rest of us, one defeat and we're all panicking!

It's not just the defeat thats had people "panicking" to be fair.
Its the glaring holes and lack of improvement in the squad less than 10 days from the end of the deadline.

TheTownie · 21-08-2014 11:07AM

Ancelotti says Di Maria wants out.

Sport Witness ‏@Sport_Witness 1m
A glum looking Carlo Ancelotti has said Di Maria wants out but if a deal isn't done by end of window he'll continue as normal.

Whatsisname · 21-08-2014 11:07AM

Ancelotti just said Di Maria wants to leave

Copper_pipe · 21-08-2014 11:07AM

Ancelotti: "Di Maria asked to leave and he refused an new contract offer but he's a Real Madrid player till we find a solution" @ManUtd

MagicIRL · 21-08-2014 11:07AM

QUICK, TO THE PRINTING PRESSES!!

homerjay2005 · 21-08-2014 11:09AM

bullvine wrote: »

Was Scholes not saying a few weeks ago that United would be 20-30% better this season with Van Gaal, now after a defeat hes spewing stuff about being scared. Hes as bad as the rest of us, one defeat and we're all panicking!

i am sure his optimism was based on the promise of new players, like everybody else.

look at it this way, would a win sunday change things as next week progresses? i dont think so. theres wider issues at play here than just one game.

the only thing that can lift this mess is 1 or 2 proper top class signings.

bullvine · 21-08-2014 11:09AM

kippy wrote: »

It's not just the defeat thats had people "panicking" to be fair.
Its the glaring holes and lack of improvement in the squad less than 10 days from the end of the deadline.

I agree, and when Sept 2nd comes, Woody will deserve all the abuse he gets, last summer can be excused as a settling in period but hes had 12 months to get this right and he appears to have fcked it up still!

twam2008 · 21-08-2014 11:09AM

Yeah, and Di Maria wants to double his salary. Will Van Gaal want to change the system to accommodate Di Maria?

homerjay2005 · 21-08-2014 11:10AM

how long now before we put a bid in? i guess its a straight fight now between us and PSG.

Mitch Connor · 21-08-2014 11:10AM

Di Maria wants to leave, and LVG specifically named him as the type of quality player we lack... you've got your fecking hint woodward!

IN saying that though, I think we are a backup choice (behind any side offering CL football) for Di Maria, and I exepct it will be PSG who find a 'solution' to his problems at Madrid.

I also don't think Di Maria would solve the two biggest issues with the squad - CM and CB, so I would worry about him being an ineffectual vanity signing.

Jules.Winnfield · 21-08-2014 11:11AM

Liam O wrote: »

A player who was deemed useful enough to come on at the weekend and actually looked bothered by the fact that United were losing? That alone disproves the fact he's not needed in the squad. Works well with Rooney too who doesn't seem to have a great understanding with a lot of the current crop.

I'll be very interested to see who Sporting get in the CL this season.

One sub appearance does not make him important to the club. Obviously if Van Gaal wanted him to stay and be part of the squad he wouldn't have gone anywhere.

I reckon he got the game down to injuries and a distinct lack of quality in the squad.

Van Gaal has said that our wingers aren't up to scratch and that we don't have the players to play his 4-3-3 so if Nani isn't good enough to be a part of a 4-3-3 he certainly isn't good enough to play as one of a front pair in the 5-3-2, not a wing back and we are deep enough at No.10 - that to me says he isn't needed in the squad.

Also I think most would agree on here that his performances over the last 2 (maybe more) seasons simply haven't been good enough so as for linking up well with Rooney...? hasn't happened in years so that would be an irrelevant point. He can't continually coast around a top club on performances well over 2 years ago.

I too will watch Sporting with some intrigue this season (though Benfica are my Portuguese team

). I wish Nani all the best for the future, but his time in Manchester would seem to be done.

Lord TSC · 21-08-2014 11:11AM

twam2008 wrote: »

Yeah, and Di Maria wants to double his salary. Will Van Gaal want to change the system to accommodate Di Maria?

If anything, I think it would suit the system he wants to play as opposed to the one he has to play right now....

Mitch Connor · 21-08-2014 11:11AM

twam2008 wrote: »

Yeah, and Di Maria wants to double his salary. Will Van Gaal want to change the system to accommodate Di Maria?

I suspect he wants to - to revert to his more favoured 433, but we don't have the central midfield to support a change to 433, Di Maria wouldn't solve that.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

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