Palestinaisn being slaughtered and a prick with a cowboy hat is on frint page

Tony EH · 29-07-2014 04:02PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

OK.

In the interests of clearing the air, I'm going to withdraw my statement that ISIS and Hamas are allies. I don't have written proof on the internet (the test for all opinions it seems) to prove it.

ISIS and Hamas are not, for the time being at least, allies.

They're just friendly with each other.

As pointed out to you before, ISIS is an affiliate of Al Qaeda. Hamas was fighting against Al Qaeda in Iraq in the 2000's.

There is NOTHING to suggest that they are allies, or even just friendly.

NOTHING.

LorMal · 29-07-2014 04:02PM

Cienciano wrote: »

No doubt that if boards.ie and After Hours was around during the holocaust, we'd have a few defending what the Nazi's did. Unbelievable that some people are actually defending Israel in this thread.

You are right, what Israel is doing in not in any way justified and I absolutely condemn it.
What does make me very ill at ease is the way many posters on here take the view that because Israel is wrong, then Hamas must be right.

I am old enough to remember widespread international support for the Mujaheddin in Afghanistan after the invasion by Russia, They were regarded as heroic freedom fighters. That didn't turn out well at all. (They are now the Taliban and al Queda).

My view is that Hamas is deliberately provoking Israel and that it welcomes the International outrage against Israels actions and are happy to sacrifice their own people. If this was not the case, surely they would stop firing the rockets.

We need to see this conflict with all it's nuances - this is a complex situation with many underlying factors.

Its not just the Goodies v the Baddies.

Tony EH · 29-07-2014 04:02PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

That's what this thread began as.

You're still not funny.

I Heart Internet · 29-07-2014 04:03PM

Tony EH wrote: »

As pointed out to you before, ISIS is an affiliate of Al Qaeda. Hamas was fighting against Al Qaeda in Iraq in the 2000's.

There is NOTHING to suggest that they are allies, or even just friendly.

NOTHING.

OK, not friendly, just shared pursuits.

hatrickpatrick · 29-07-2014 04:03PM

I fail to see how Isis and Hamas' alleged partnership is in any way relevant to what Israel is doing.

I'd go even further. Hamas in general is not in any way relevant to what Israel is doing. What Israel is now doing is effectively carpet bombing Gaza City. If anyone disputes that, pour yourself a stiff drink and try to stomach as much of last night's Gaza live feed as you can (I couldn't hack it myself after a few minutes) - the word "target" doesn't fit in with what's going on in any way, unless the word is applied simply to Gaza itself.

Israel has gone far beyond responding to any specific threat or organization in this current flare up of violence - they are simply bombing the f*ck out of Gaza City in as much as they think they can get away with without outright admitting to the same. This is not an operation to kill or disable terrorists, this is an operation to take IDF anger out on as many Palestinians as possible.

Again, if you dispute that I'll happily engage, but only after you've watched a little of last night's revolting video footage.

Tony EH · 29-07-2014 04:04PM

LorMal wrote: »

What does make me very ill at ease is the way many posters on here take the view that because Israel is wrong, then Hamas must be right.

Who the fuck has said that?

Tony EH · 29-07-2014 04:04PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

OK, not friendly, just shared pursuits.

You don't know this.

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:05PM

mad muffin wrote: »

Imagine. They hate each other. Who would have thought :rolleyes:

You don't have to look too far for the same kind of crap going on in Ireland's own backyard.

so you have nothing relevant to say as per usual, thought so

user2011 · 29-07-2014 04:07PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

OK, not friendly, just shared pursuits.

Like the US/ISIS/AL Nusra Front have a shard pursuit of getting Assad out of Syria?

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:08PM

jank wrote: »

Amazing that you don't agree with fundamental evidence put forward but then think with no evidence put forward that the IDF deliberately target children. Great moral leap there.

mountains of evidence proving israel deliberately targets civilians has been put forward, you however, have put forward little to no evidence that they don't deliberately target civilians, or that hamas use human shields

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:10PM

brimal wrote: »

ultimately it is a modern, highly-advanced state

no it isn't

brimal wrote: »

countries which are decades if not centuries behind in human rights, HDI, etc.

no, more or less the same

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:13PM

mad muffin wrote: »

Now you're just being facetious.

lol, you do know what an atheist is right?

LorMal · 29-07-2014 04:16PM

Tony EH wrote: »

Who the fuck has said that?

Is that necessary? Cool your jets.

Donkey Oaty · 29-07-2014 04:18PM

All sides have agreed to a ceasefire - BBC Radio 4, quoting Israeli TV report in last few minutes. No further details yet.

Let's hope for the best.

wretcheddomain · 29-07-2014 04:18PM

LorMal wrote: »

What does make me very ill at ease is the way many posters on here take the view that because Israel is wrong, then Hamas must be right.

Its not just the Goodies v the Baddies.

You've created this ugly straw man to attack, because as far as I can see, nobody here has endorsed the actions of Hamas.

What we are discussing, however, is the disproportionate indifference that Israel shows toward the Palestinian people. This is reflected in their chosen civilian-rich targets as well as the disturbing death toll of 1,150; a heavy proportion of which are children.

The frustrating thing about this debate, and it occurs over and over again, is the belief that:

If you criticise the Israeli side, then somehow you're an apologist for Hamas.

This is so far from the truth. Most intelligent and reasonable people side with the moderate Palestinian and Israeli civilians; their societies being torn apart politically and socially due to the governing extremists. However, we have to put both of their actions in the appropriate context. The disproportionate nature of the Israeli response will evidently foment a proportionate amount of attention from the public.

NewCorkLad · 29-07-2014 04:21PM

LorMal wrote: »

What does make me very ill at ease is the way many posters on here take the view that because Israel is wrong, then Hamas must be right.

Tony EH wrote: »

Who the fuck has said that?

It was this attitude that pissed me off and stopped me posting about this issue. Everytime you talk about your disgust at the actions of Israel, you get accused of supporting Hamas and of hating Jews & Israel.

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:23PM

jank wrote: »

So the end goal of Israel is to kill all the Palestinians....slowly.
That statement is just wrong on so many levels. Israel has the capability to commit genocide if it wanted to but choose not to. Hamas would commit genocide if it could. That is a key difference.

they are doing it, slowly, any other way would evapourate any support it has left

bboybaboy19 · 29-07-2014 04:23PM

Ultimately Hamas are scum terrorists, however how Israel are acting is completely wrong and terrorist like themselves.

They should be working to attack Hamas solely and intelligently instead of willingly attacking Hamas buildings knowing full well they've been filled with innocents or hostages.

Hamas are never going to give in and are only too willing to see innocents die as all it does is support their cause.
Israel are always going to come out on top in terms of firepower.

It's all a bit pointless.

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:24PM

jank wrote: »

Still not evidence of official policy....

no but evidence it is happening and its deliberate

LorMal · 29-07-2014 04:25PM

wretcheddomain wrote: »

You've created this ugly straw man to attack, because as far as I can see, nobody here has endorsed the actions of Hamas.

What we are discussing, however, is the disproportionate indifference that Israel shows toward the Palestinian people. This is reflected in their chosen civilian-rich targets as well as the disturbing death toll of 1,150; a heavy proportion of which are children.

The frustrating thing about this debate, and it occurs over and over again, is the belief that:

If you criticise the Israeli side, then somehow you're an apologist for Hamas.

This is so far from the truth. Most intelligent and reasonable people side with the moderate Palestinian and Israeli civilians; their societies being torn apart politically and socially due to the governing extremists. However, we have to put both of their actions in the appropriate context. The disproportionate nature of the Israeli response will evidently foment a proportionate amount of attention from the public.

No this is not a self created 'strawman'. There has been plenty of 'whataboutery' to justify the Hamas rocket strategy. Disproportion action from Israel does justify the Hamas strategy.
My argument is that we need to condemn both. I don't see much evidence of that here (with some exceptions).

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:27PM

mad muffin wrote: »

Get back to me when Travellers under Irish rule have their right respected.

do you believe they should have their rights respected? or are you just using that statement as what aboutery and a failed rebuttal to his post, and you infact don't believe their rights should be respected?

user2011 · 29-07-2014 04:27PM

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=797_1406644847

Why does the Israel need to lobby so bad with their allies?

It stinks, of needless deaths of innocent lives. Shame on governments to sit idle by with "we can't do anything they have to sort it out themselves" :mad:

Tony EH · 29-07-2014 04:27PM

LorMal wrote: »

Is that necessary? Cool your jets.

When somebody says something ridiculous like:

LorMal wrote: »

What does make me very ill at ease is the way many posters on here take the view that because Israel is wrong, then Hamas must be right.

Then an indignant response is only to be expected.

WakeUp · 29-07-2014 04:32PM

Israel has completely destroyed 5000 homes and damaged a further 26000:

"GAZA CITY (Ma'an) -- The Palestinian Ministry of Health said on Tuesday that nearly 5,000 homes had been destroyed in Gaza as of late Monday, a number expected to rise amid renewed bombardment."
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=716832

Judging by the video showing the levelling of an entire neighbourhood those figures are not hard to believe. and they can be verified quite easily. and still they claim they aren't targeting civilians or civilian infrastructure. Israel has crossed the line this time in the eyes of many I wonder do they realise it yet .the Palestinians must invoke their right to ICC jurisdiction regardless of the consequences or threats from the US and Israel they just have too.

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:35PM

mad muffin wrote: »

Any right thinking person can see your diatribe for what it is. The fact that you had to ad in a legal sense, of course. Just proves it.

what exactly are you talking about?

NotASheeple · 29-07-2014 04:35PM

mad muffin wrote: »

Get back to me when Travellers under Irish rule have their right respected.

Jesus H Christ, you're comparing the travellers to the Palestinians. I've seen it all now. Shame on us though, for heeding this nonsense.

KahBoom · 29-07-2014 04:35PM

LorMal wrote: »

No this is not a self created 'strawman'. There has been plenty of 'whataboutery' to justify the Hamas rocket strategy. Disproportion action from Israel does justify the Hamas strategy.
My argument is that we need to condemn both. I don't see much evidence of that here (with some exceptions).

Ok give us a quote to show that then.

end of the road · 29-07-2014 04:37PM

mad muffin wrote: »

In a sense. Yes.

Just look at what they did to that poor blonde Roma children.

oh for god sake, while what happened to the roma families shouldn't have, putting what happened to them on a par with murder of people is ridiculous and frankly stupid

LorMal · 29-07-2014 04:37PM

Tony EH wrote: »

When somebody says something ridiculous like:

Then an indignant response is only to be expected.

No, a polite response is to be expected. My point is my opinion and it was reasonably argued. No need to be a keyboard warrior. You are not under attack.

LorMal · 29-07-2014 04:37PM

KahBoom wrote: »

Ok give us a quote to show that then.

Have a look yourself.

Palestinaisn being slaughtered and a prick with a cowboy hat is on frint page

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