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Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

Saorview PVR Box has arrived.

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Comments

  • #332
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 40,036 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    I don't think the Freeview HD standard was out at the time though. We'd have ended up with SD simulcasting.

    I'm partial to your abracadabra
    I'm raptured by the joy of it all



  • #333
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    ninja900 wrote: »
    I don't think the Freeview HD standard was out at the time though. We'd have ended up with SD simulcasting.

    We didn't have to wait for UK FreeviewHD (aka DVB-T2/MPEG-4/MHEG-5), New Zealand's Freeview DTT receiver specification uses the UK D-Book standard with DVB-T/MPEG-4 SD & HD video and was published in late 2007. DTG Testing in the UK carries out receiver conformance testing.

    http://www.freeviewnz.tv/about-freeview/equipment-supply-chain
    http://www.freeviewnz.tv/media/9325/freeviewhd_dtt_receiver_specification_v2_0.pdf
    http://www.freeviewnz.tv/media/9348/freeview_dtt_transmission_rules_2_1.pdf

    The reason we're stuck with Nordig/MHEG-5 is down to the failed Boxer bid to run commercial DTT here.


  • #334
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Freeview HD (DVB-T2) didn't for practical purposes exist when the roll out started. Which had been delayed by 2 years due to stupidity.

    Nordig is better (open) as D book is "secret" and 100% UK controlled.

    Boxer is a contributing factor, but not the sole reason.

    Nordig DOES include MHEG5 as CI+ now has MHEG5 as mandatory. MHP is practically dead outside Italy. It was original RTE choice in 1999+ etc.

    We absolutely shouldn't be using D Book.


  • #335
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    Boxer is a contributing factor, but not the sole reason.

    What were the other reasons?

    We have the Nordig standard because the winning commercial bidder Boxer Ireland's main shareholder Teracom Sweden develop and use the standard on its DTT networks in Sweden and Denmark, they also sit on the Nordig Board.

    Boxer Ireland was to be the "digital champion" here to promote and develop digital terrestrial television including the STB standard to be used with the existing analogue broadcasters providing their channels using the same STB standard.

    RTÉ published their STB standard based on Boxer Ireland's (Teracom) established specification (minus the pay TV element) in Dec 2008. Boxer withdrew several months later but RTÉ continued with the Nordig spec for its FTA receiver.

    RTÉ's own bid for the commercial DTT contracts was based on the D Book standard.


  • #336
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    It was fantasy that Boxer would ever do anything. Companies bid and win licences often as part of corporate beautification with no intent to ever roll anything out.

    The RTE bid wasn't real either. So the D book proposal was only a fantasy. There was never any prospect of a commercial roll out. Unless someone with more money and ego than sense. I said that in 2006.

    Who else in Europe uses D Book? It's a proprietary UK only standard. If NZ has adopted it they are ill advised. The RTENL / 2RN folk thought Nordig was best standards option for a small country. DVB + MPEG4 on its own is too woolly (France). Even so France didn't have the horrendous product dumping of SD only DVB kit we suffered because they enacted legislation.

    The problem wasn't RTE or RTENL (2RN) but BCI, BAI, Comreg, Government doing nothing. For Government the "Digital Dividend" is the once off Cash from selling Mobile licences. They put a pittance into publicity, delayed the DSO & ASO by two years and refused to protect consumer.

    We had this discussion before. On the proposed time scale (before Government delays) and on actual roll out (started in 2007 though spec not published till Feb 2008) the DVB-T2 hadn't completed trials. It was unproven beta technology. In contrast I was testing MPEG4 TRANSMISSION on DVB-T in 2006 using off the shelf gear in a PC! The BT so called trials which was purely political to promote a commercial licence were not a technology trial ( 2006 - 2008).

    The R&D dept I was in was looking at Pay TV on 10.1GHz (co-channel to 10.2GHz Wireless Broadband) and MMDS 12GHz bands (the 10GHz originally discussed as early as 2005 as IPTV, but IPTV wasn't practical, too much bandwidth). We even briefly considered the UHF licence. But the revenue wouldn't have covered costs even if content all free to source. The innovation was to have no EPG or keys via broadcast, but via broadband and Conditional Access integrated via DOCSIS Broadband validation so no cards to share, because no CAM. Also no call centre, all interactive package changes via the broadband. So the TV would be tied to one particular Broadband supplier.

    I expect UPC will do this [no cards or CAM] eventually when MMDS is gone.


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  • #337
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    The RTENL / 2RN folk thought Nordig was best standards option for a small country. DVB + MPEG4 on its own is too woolly (France).

    Can you cite a reference for this?

    So it was just coincidence that they publised the same STB standard 6 months after Teracoms's Boxer was chosen as winning bidder for the commercial DTT licences eventhough the were the only bidders that were going to use this spec?

    Regarding France and most of the rest of Europe, their DTT spec is based on the E-Book standard with additional local requirements.


  • #338
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    The Cush wrote: »
    Can you cite a reference for this?
    Um ... I didn't have recording equipment running ... It was a senior person.
    The Cush wrote: »
    So it was just coincidence that they publised the same STB standard 6 months after Teracoms's Boxer was chosen as winning bidder for the commercial DTT licences eventhough the were the only bidders that were going to use this spec?

    No idea. Probably not. If boxer had not been involved would they have gone with D-Book or E-Book? I don't know and I doubt anyone outside of RTE/RTE NL would have been consulted.

    Possibly they decided it was a good idea after it was nearly "foisted" on them?

    It's easier to understand the Kremlin at times than RTE, they keep their own staff in the dark. The actual engineers I knew (two) working in Mid West knew less about what was happening with DTT & Sat that some of us here did, before it happened! They don't get told the "master plan" generally, just their own current tasks. Even if those it's in their contract they can be summarily dismissed if they communicate to a third party, so in the past I have been told stuff I couldn't post or pass on. Which was embarrassing.

    For a PSB / Semi state body the lack of Openness, accountability Consultation etc is appalling.


  • #339
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    So back to where we started, we have a single approved PVR on the market from an importer/distibutor and not a very good one at that. No major manufacturer or PVR supplier to the other Nordig countries see it worth their while to supply an MHEG-5 version to the small Irish market.


  • #340
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    The Irish Trade is dominated by UK multiples and Middle Men importing from UK.

    Walker are just the Irish buyout of Mitsubishi Ireland Distribution badging mostly (all?) Vestel gear.

    The problem goes far beyond lack of PVRs.


  • #341
    Mr Cumulonimbus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Mr Cumulonimbus


    watty wrote: »
    The Irish Trade is dominated by UK multiples and Middle Men importing from UK.

    Maybe thats one of reasons then as to why The Cush's suggestion that we should have gone with the UK's D Book standard is correct. The constant reply to people's complaints in this forum that your "digital TV or PVR doesn't work is because it has an MPEG2 tuner" would never have been seen here.

    In stead of being a negative, it could have been a positive. It would have allowed for a rapid saturation of the Irish market with readily available equipment, including a decent range of PVR's. If you don't have access to satellite & cable and you want an "official Saorview" PVR to record, the current situation is an absolute joke.

    Adopting the current technical standard has hindered the TV viewer if they want to record Saorview programming via a decent quality DTT only PVR.


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  • #342
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    No it wouldn't because the DVB-T2 MPEG4 HD gear didn't exist. Going with the MPEG2 version would have been stupidity.

    What we need is Consumer Protection done properly and regulatory and market reform. We are not a UK province.

    The non-HD UK freeview was obsolete.

    We have copied UK DAB which is stupidity, and not even done it properly. It should be turned off forthwith and all radios with DAB only banned or at least have a warning. Sets without LW should have a warning, most of those are for North America and and have wrong equalisation for VHF-FM.

    Also what use give the awkwardness of programming is only 10 FM and 10 DAB presets?

    What use are the Lidl and other radios with only up/down seek that lose all the presets every time the batteries are jiggled?

    Consumer Electronics is a mess in all of EU and especially Ireland. The solution isn't to let the UK Government or Agencies (D-Book and DAB) set the agenda or UK Wholesale and Retail control the market.


  • #343
    Mr Cumulonimbus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Mr Cumulonimbus


    watty wrote: »
    No it wouldn't because the DVB-T2 MPEG4 HD gear didn't exist. Going with the MPEG2 version would have been stupidity.

    Don’t agree. We shared PAL-I with the UK pre-DSO, fully so in regions of the country where transmitters provided an all UHF signal. (Clermont Carn, Three Rock & most relays). This allowed the trade to source a wide variety of equipment for Ireland without having to worry too much about different standards etc. Because of this, we should have continued this practice and adopted D-Book.
    We are not a UK province.

    Yes, but Mr & Mrs Average TV Viewer couldn’t care less with regards to have having a TV signal and crucially a wide variety of decently priced equipment to view with. As I’ve said already, it’s a joke we only have 1 officially Saorview approved PVR, because of us adapting DVB-T/MPEG4.
    The non-HD UK freeview was obsolete.

    Not in terms of effiency since we have only 8 channels on 2 muxes.
    The solution isn't to let the UK Government or Agencies (D-Book and DAB) set the agenda or UK Wholesale and Retail control the market.

    For pragmatic reasons, it happened when the UK & Ireland operated PAL-I. We should have continued the practice. Too much emphasis was put on the perceived advantage of one technical standard over another when planning DTT here and not enough on ease of delivery to the consumer, as well as not taking heed of how the existing Irish TV market operated in the era of PAL-I.


  • #344
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    There WAS NO HD on standard Freeview.
    Of course that would have be totally stupid to adopt.

    All of Europe except France was using 625, Roll out started in 1948! The UK out of EGO and Politics relaunched the 1935 405 TV in 1946 even though only Crystal Palace transmitter and maybe only 300 viewers.

    As a stupid sop to people that had bought 405 TVs before 1962 for UK television (31st Dec 1961) we had 405 on 3 transmitters. But many parts of Ireland never ever had 405, but only ever 625.

    The UK had to start changing to 625 in 1962. After Irish 625 launched. It was only a minor variation of the European system demonstrated in 1946 and rolling out since 1948.

    SD pre-DVB-T2 D-Book simply was absolutely not an option in 2008. It was a year too early at least for MPEG4 HD DVB-T2.

    The original Freeview non-DVB-T2 D book had NO HD or MPEG4 support. We would be running SIX mux today if we had gone with ordinary Freeview in 2007-2008 when rollout started. Even though "a" DVB-T2 HD spec existed in 2008 there was no domestic equipment for it for at least another 2 years!

    The Problem is that the Government decided we had to meet the 2012 ASO date. So roll out HAD to start before DVB-T2 products in the marketplace, but it was 10 years too late to adopt the non-HD Freeview.

    If like some other countries we had delayed ASO to 2014 (this year) we could have adopted HD DVB-T2.

    Only the Freeview HD version D book was remotely viable choice. Today in UK the ordinary Freeview boxes and TVs are obsolete. They have been since the end of 2012.


  • #345
    Mr Cumulonimbus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Mr Cumulonimbus


    watty wrote: »
    The Problem is that the Government decided we had to meet the 2012 ASO date. So roll out HAD to start before DVB-T2 products in the marketplace, but it was 10 years too late to adopt the non-HD Freeview.

    Looking back on it now it all reads like a series of unfortunate events doesn't it? Procrastination on the whole thing by the government seems to be key here, and then rushing to do something for the sake of doing it.
    If like some other countries we had delayed ASO to 2014 (this year) we could have adopted HD DVB-T2.

    Yes, would have been ideal. Could this be done say in 2024 since the Saorview spec now says equipment should be T2?


  • #346
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    SD pre-DVB-T2 D-Book simply was absolutely not an option in 2008. It was a year too early at least for MPEG4 HD DVB-T2.[/B]

    I assume you mean "HD pre-DVB-T2 D-Book simply was absolutely not an option in 2008".

    It was an option, the NZ receiver standard was finalised in late 2007 which was D-Book/DVB-T/MPEG-4. They started SD and HD terrestrial transmission in April 2008. New Zealand TVOne, TV2 and TV3, launched in HD. TVOne and TV2 broadcast in the 1280x720p format, while TV3 broadcast in the 1920x1080i format.

    This was before we announced our DTT standard and about the time the commercial DTT contracts went out to tender. Our network didn't go live until the end of Oct 2010 with RTÉ2 switching to 1080i in early Dec that year. DVB-T2 or Nordig wasn't required.

    My early 2008 Sony TV (purchased April 2008) was both Freeview approved and had MPEG-4 decoding and still working today with Saorview.

    Once Boxer withdrew RTÉ should've stalled on the receiver spec until the commercial DTT process had completed but I guess that would mean a lot of work wasted.


  • #347
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Then it wasn't actually D-Book.
    Because the UK regulator specifically forbade MPEG4 on DVB-T and there was no HD in D-Book even if Mpeg4 was in it in 2007.

    But since the D book is and always was secret and proprietary we can't be sure and any Country outside of UK adopting it is very very unwise to point of stupidly.

    It would be like Microsoft taking a licence to sell OS X or Apple deciding to licence Windows 8.1 for iPhone.

    Our roll out decisions may have been made in late 2006 or early, I don't know. Certainly it started in late 2007 before the spec was published in Feb 2008.

    It was unfortunately the wrong time to go with either UK spec, even if such an idea is sensible, which it isn't.

    We might have had Digital in 2000, but that didn't happen because of Government stupidity. It would have been MPEG2, DVB-T, MHP and DVB-RCT (for interactive, NEVER enough capacity for Internet). I know someone who was there in RTENL when they ran trials. I guess we are fortunate as it turns out MHP was a bad idea (though still in use) and I think NO-ONE has used DVB-RCT. The technical expertise though has been partly recycled in WiMax (now largely abandoned) and LTE. No-one sells DVB-RCT gear now.

    So we delayed. The whole commercial fixation dragged on nearly two years longer than it should have. The Government was anxious to raise revenue selling licence for 790MHz to 862MHz spectrum so then a last minute panic to make ASO happen.

    The ONLY reason whatsoever for 2012 ASO and Digital Terrestrial in Ireland is the revenue to Comreg & Treasury from the Mobile operators "selling off" part of TV spectrum. Comreg is committed to selling it ALL! But first another chunk. So no 100fps TV, no 2K or 4K TV, no 3D TV EVER on Terrestrial. People having to change aerials and then eventually no terrestrial at all.

    It's a bleak prospect caused by having the Civil Service and a "Captured Regulator" in control instead of the People and the Government.


  • #348
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    Then it wasn't actually D-Book.
    Because the UK regulator specifically forbade MPEG4 on DVB-T and there was no HD in D-Book even if Mpeg4 was in it in 2007.

    It was D-Book with added New Zealand requirements, I posted the spec earlier.

    Luckily for New Zealand the UK regulator had no say in how they implemented their receiver spec.
    The profile is based upon open standards predominantly Digital Video Broadcasting (DVB) standards and the UK DTG D-Book or includes open implementations which are in use on the UK DTT platform. Changes and additions have been made in this document to suit the required digital terrestrial platform in New Zealand. This most notably, includes requirements for H.264 AVC decoding (not MPEG-2) and high definition video resolution output.

    In 2007 DTG Testing was awarded the test and conformance contract for Freeview New Zealand - http://www.dtg.org.uk/publications/books/dtg_infopack_2012.pdf


  • #349
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    It was D-Book with added New Zealand requirements, I posted the spec earlier.
    So thus it wasn't actually D-Book. So no assurance equipment with Freeview Tick for UK market would work.

    I do understand your point and I know I'm being pedantic.

    It's annoying there is no decent PVR for Irish market and that some Freeview+ HD PVRs may actually work "better" than the Walker in some respects.

    So forgetting about "might have beens*" how do we move forward?



    (* It seems Digital TV is WORSE than Analogue for different standards, even an accidental purchase of PAL B/G set could be quickly fixed to work on PAL-I by swapping a €1 filter for a 6.0MHz part, or a UK UHF only TV have a cheap Labgear VHF to UHF converter added. Of course when I came to Midwest in 1983 my TV and VHS didn't receive anything. Fortunately a converter was a stock item in many Limerick TV shops then)


  • #350
    JonathonS
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 702 ✭✭✭JonathonS


    The Cush wrote: »
    My early 2008 Sony TV (purchased April 2008) was both Freeview approved and had MPEG-4 decoding and still working today with Saorview.

    That was because Sony were selling these sets in France, where sales of non-future-proofed sets had been banned. But the Sony office in Ireland refused at the time to confirm that they would work with Irish DTT, partly because the spec was not finalised, and partly because they could not have supplied the demand if the word got out.


  • #351
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    I think the demand and maybe they had not yet tested to the Irish / Nordig spec. The Spec was out Feb 2008.
    MPEG4 & HD isn't enough without further lab test to back up with claims.


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  • #352
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    So thus it wasn't actually D-Book. So no assurance equipment with Freeview Tick for UK market would work.

    D-Book based, in the same way our receiver spec is Nordig based with added Ireland requirements, so no receiver approved in the Nordic countries will work 100% with Saorview.

    How do we move forward? Look at the problems related to switching on of a second mux, basically we're stuck with the wrong receiver standard for PVRs that no one wants to support.


  • #353
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    I think the demand and maybe they had not yet tested to the Irish / Nordig spec. The Spec was out Feb 2008.

    The Feb 2008 receiver spec made no mention of Nordig, it was a basic receiver spec developed by the DTT Specification Working Group/Dept of Communications in preparation for the commercial DTT tender. The RTÉ FTA Nordig spec wasn't published until late Dec 2008.


  • #354
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    JonathonS wrote: »
    That was because Sony were selling these sets in France, where sales of non-future-proofed sets had been banned.

    That's correct - http://www.broadbandtvnews.com/2008/03/05/french-tv-sets-to-include-dtt-tuner/, http://www.digitag.org/WebLetters/2007/External-Feb2007.html

    ◾Since 5 April 2008, all television sets must include an MPEG-2 DTT decoder
    ◾Since 1 December 2008, all HD-ready television sets, regardless of their size, must include an MPEG-4 AVC HD decoder.
    ◾Since 1 December 2009, all television sets sized 66 cm (26 inches) and above must include an MPEG-4 AVC HD decoder.
    ◾By 1 December 2012, all television sets must include an HD DTT decoder. In addition, set-top boxes must be able to receive both standard-definition and HD content.


    Norway and Estonia launched their DTT networks in 2007 and 2006 with MPEG-4 video only.


  • #355
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    A few page back I mentioned that I had replaced my Walker Saorview approved PVR with a Freeview Panasonic DMR-PWT635 PVR.

    About a week ago I set several timers via series link to test it out, the 6 and 9 News, Nationwide, Primetime, Dragons Den on RTÉ1, Home and Away on RTÉ2, Vincent Browne on TV3. Other standalone timers were also set.

    All recorded OK.

    Vincent Browne on TV3 doesn't have series link data, so each programme must be set individually.

    Noticed earlier "Without a Trace" on TV3 following Vincent Browne, series link data for later tonight (Tue morning 00:05) and tomorrow (Wed morning 00:05) are series linked but the same programme for Thur, Fri and next Tue are series linked separately from tonight's and tomorrow night's episodes. Emmerdale and Coronation St appear to be series linked correctly.

    So far the PVR is working without problem but will continue to record the programmes I mentioned above for a week or 2 more and report back.


  • #356
    kooga
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭kooga


    The Cush wrote: »
    A few page back I mentioned that I had replaced my Walker Saorview approved PVR with a Freeview Panasonic DMR-PWT635 PVR.

    About a week ago I set several timers via series link to test it out, the 6 and 9 News, Nationwide, Primetime, Dragons Den on RTÉ1, Home and Away on RTÉ2, Vincent Browne on TV3. Other standalone timers were also set.

    All recorded OK.

    Vincent Browne on TV3 doesn't have series link data, so each programme must be set individually.

    Noticed earlier "Without a Trace" on TV3 following Vincent Browne, series link data for later tonight (Tue morning 00:05) and tomorrow (Wed morning 00:05) are series linked but the same programme for Thur, Fri and next Tue are series linked separately from tonight's and tomorrow night's episodes. Emmerdale and Coronation St appear to be series linked correctly.

    So far the PVR is working without problem but will continue to record the programmes I mentioned above for a week or 2 more and report back.

    cush, thanks for the updates, seriously thinking of getting a freeview hd box, pvr and blue ray.


  • #357
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 40,036 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Got (another) problem recently with my Walker PVR, sound via SCART is often very distorted when turned on. The first time this resolved itself after a few minutes, the last time it didn't even after an hour. Can't test the HDMI output on this box where it is located.

    Retuning, switching audio channel etc. make no difference and this affects playback of recordings made before this fault appeared as well as live TV on both muxes. Will try a full factory reset but I'm thinking it's actually a fault - bad capacitors??

    It still has the usual problems - randomly failing series links, annoying 'the service list has been updated' message when switched on, 'there is a problem with the current recording' message pops up randomly ever since one recording failed ages ago. Piece of crap.

    I'm partial to your abracadabra
    I'm raptured by the joy of it all



  • #358
    captain_boycott
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 540 ✭✭✭captain_boycott


    I've been looking for a dual tuner to replace sky+, and as we only watch the Irish channels, soarview would be fine, but series link and the ability to record one channel and record another was essential, as well as EPG functionality.

    Feedback on this thread has been fairly negative with respect to the WALKER 6500 box but as my local shop had one available, and promised to take it back if I had any issues, I decided to give it a go...

    2 weeks of use and so far so good! A lot of folk on here were complaining of failed recordings/series link issues with this reciever, but I've not had that experience. Have set up Fair city, Corry and some others and it never missed a show so far. Not only that but it is actually better than Sky because it shows you all the slots it is due to record for the week ahead, not just the next one, so its easy to check that it has scheduled for the week correctly. Having said that, for a while it insisted on skipping the midweek double shows of Corry and scheduled the daytime repeats the next day instead. But that sorted itself out this week - I wonder if that is an issue with the box or the incorrect data being sent from the network?.

    Only other issue I have had is RTE1 HD has disappeared from the channel list last Monday and the Monday before that - are there network changes still going on? Fortunately a rescan added it back in and all the scheduled recordings were still good. Will report back in another few weeks, but so far I am very happy with it. Picture quality is excellent. Channel changing is slower than Sky but I've gotten used to that now.


  • #359
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,389 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    captain_boycott wrote: »
    Only other issue I have had is RTE1 HD has disappeared from the channel list last Monday and the Monday before that - are there network changes still going on? Fortunately a rescan added it back in and all the scheduled recordings were still good. Will report back in another few weeks, but so far I am very happy with it. Picture quality is excellent. Channel changing is slower than Sky but I've gotten used to that now.

    Since the second Saorview multiplex/frequency launched late last year this has been an on going problem for my Walker PVR and my brother's Walker PVR, losing the Mux2 channels (RTÉ1 HD, RTÉjr, RTÉ1+1), requiring a rescan or factory reset then having to reset timers otherwise a recording would be missed/skipped.

    A related problem maybe, when retuning the Walker the multiplexes are mis-identified, Mux 2 (Mullaghanish UHF 24) is mainly identified as RTÉNL 1 and sometimes RTÉNL 2 and vice versa for Mux 1.

    No such problems with the Panasonic so far.


  • #360
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    I guess Walker didn't pay Vestel enough. Really EVERY walker PVR should be refunded or upgraded or replaced.
    Sale of Goods Act if under 2 years old. Not fit for purpose. Not meeting Saorview spec.


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  • #361
    fat-tony
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,713 ✭✭✭fat-tony


    TV3 (or Redbee) have been disastrous in the past with regard to the quality control of their EIT data (this is the programme now/next and schedule info). The CRID info is what the PVR uses to identify programme series info and unique programmes within a series. I looked at this info last year when people were having issues with series linking Vincent Browne on TV3 and I found that the series CRID and programme CRID were reversed in some cases. Despite emailing 2RN/Saorview/RTE at the time the responses coming back were that the data was ok, when it quite definitely was wrong. There was a real issue with the verification of data along the chain somewhere and I don't know if it is continuing.
    The TV channels here don't seem to have grasped fully the importance of this meta data and the absolute dependence PVRs have on on its accuracy.
    At the very least the EIT/CRID data needs to be correct for PVRs to function. After that, it is down to the PVR firmware etc. to function reliably.
    I've used a Humax Foxsat on Freesat for years. It's solid and dependable on BBC and ITV and more recently Channel 4, but still has occasional issues when Ch 5 messes up EIT info. The terrestrial equivalent from Humax seems to work quite well on Saorview but potentially would have compatibility issues and ultimately is dependent on solid EIT data.
    If there are specific issues with series repeats I can look at the EIT data and print it off if needed.


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