Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

redbaron_99 · 06-04-2014 11:54AM

Loved Moyes' joke about Fellaini in the post match interview.

Lord TSC · 06-04-2014 11:55AM

keane2097 wrote: »

Do you have any suggestions on how a United attacking line up at could be deployed at 100% with both Rooney and RVP in it?

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Do please tell us how to deploy our attacking line-up at 100%.

Listen, I can post up my personal opinion of a line up, but I'm not the United manager. I'm not claiming to know myself either, but then I'm not getting paid millions to work that out. And I know no matter what sort of line up I'd post, plenty would tear it apart.

Fergie managed to do it last year; he managed to win the league with the team, and RVP looked set to become a club legend, and then Moyes joins and it's suddenly a discussion of how we should be offloading RVP cause the team struggles with him and Rooney in the same squad.

How would I deploy? A lot less crosses, a lot more central play (like yesterday). Kagawa and Hernandez getting far more chances, Valencia and Young getting a whole lot less. A lot more positivity in the mindset, a lot less negative defensive ******* against poor teams.

But my point isn't that I could deploy the team at 100% of it's potential; it's that Moyes is being paid to do so, and it frustrates me that because Moyes isn't able to do his job, people are taking it out on the players in a way. It happens a lot this year; players get thrown under the bus in an attempt to cover the fact Moyes is failing at various aspects of his job...

spiralism · 06-04-2014 12:04PM

keane2097 wrote: »

Do you have any suggestions on how a United attacking line up at could be deployed at 100% with both Rooney and RVP in it?

Maybe he does or doesnt but the issue is that David Moyes doesn't know how to either and he's only the manager of Man United.

Anyone who's going on about selling RVP is out of their mind. Are people that indoctrinated into the lowering of standards that there's serious discussion about selling one of our best players? How about we offload the **** first, subtracting talent from a side that needs it is crazy talk. This is Man United for ****s sake.

Also, there's the simple prospect of playing Rooney with Kagawa and Mata behind Van Persie. Maybe Rooney would be out of position but he's versatile as hell and has played a variety of positions in his Utd career, is it only now that we've to be rigid with him? Fergie would have thought outside the box here as would any top manager.

GSPfan · 06-04-2014 12:07PM

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Listen, I can post up my personal opinion of a line up, but I'm not the United manager. I'm not claiming to know myself either, but then I'm not getting paid millions to work that out. And I know no matter what sort of line up I'd post, plenty would tear it apart.

Fergie managed to do it last year; he managed to win the league with the team, and RVP looked set to become a club legend, and then Moyes joins and it's suddenly a discussion of how we should be offloading RVP cause the team struggles with him and Rooney in the same squad.

How would I deploy? A lot less crosses, a lot more central play (like yesterday). Kagawa and Hernandez getting far more chances, Valencia and Young getting a whole lot less. A lot more positivity in the mindset, a lot less negative defensive ******* against poor teams.

But my point isn't that I could deploy the team at 100% of it's potential; it's that Moyes is being paid to do so, and it frustrates me that because Moyes isn't able to do his job, people are taking it out on the players in a way. It happens a lot this year; players get thrown under the bus in an attempt to cover the fact Moyes is failing at various aspects of his job...

Phew. Thank god someone feels the same. I was beginning to wonder if it was still April Fools day in here. Great point about Fergie playing them both last year.

And great way to respond to awful questions.

redbaron_99 · 06-04-2014 12:07PM

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Listen, I can post up my personal opinion of a line up, but I'm not the United manager. I'm not claiming to know myself either, but then I'm not getting paid millions to work that out. And I know no matter what sort of line up I'd post, plenty would tear it apart.

Fergie managed to do it last year; he managed to win the league with the team, and RVP looked set to become a club legend, and then Moyes joins and it's suddenly a discussion of how we should be offloading RVP cause the team struggles with him and Rooney in the same squad.

How would I deploy? A lot less crosses, a lot more central play (like yesterday). Kagawa and Hernandez getting far more chances, Valencia and Young getting a whole lot less. A lot more positivity in the mindset, a lot less negative defensive ******* against poor teams.

But my point isn't that I could deploy the team at 100% of it's potential; it's that Moyes is being paid to do so, and it frustrates me that because Moyes isn't able to do his job, people are taking it out on the players in a way. It happens a lot this year; players get thrown under the bus in an attempt to cover the fact Moyes is failing at various aspects of his job...

Yes, Fergie did shoehorn Rooney and VanPersie into the same team last season, and our play was pretty poor. Van Persie's goals masked that to a certain degree. Also, there was no Mata last season, and Fergie only used Kagawa sparingly. So, he didn't really know how to utilize our full attacking line-up either.
My opinion, for what it's worth, is that the overall play suffers when we have both Rooney and RVP in the same side. Playing RVP, Rooney, Mata, Kagawa and Januzaj would be suicide (especially with our meagre midfield options and a leaky defence).

Guardiola, Mourinho and Klopp like to play with one up front. It's likely that they would leave RVP or Rooney out of the side if they were in the united job.

keane2097 · 06-04-2014 12:09PM

Seems a bit rich to say Moyes is a chump for not being able to get Rooney and RVP into the same attacking line and then using the cop out of not being aanager yourself or paid to do it yourself so you don't need to have a Cogent suggestion.

By that argument you might as well accept Moyes knows a lot better than you and if he's doing it a particular way who are you to argue with him?

keane2097 · 06-04-2014 12:11PM

Ferguson had Rooney ready to leave because he was unwilling to play on the wing. Hardly a master class of management to drive one of your best players to handing a transfer request. Might work for one season, but is that really what people would suggest?

jane82 · 06-04-2014 12:12PM

I dont think its moyes tactics that the problem with rvp. He just doesnt seem fully into it. Last year he was at both ends half the corners against he was heading out he was always moving looking for the ball at the other end. He looks like a shell of that this year. On match of the day he looks great popping up scoring goals but over the 90 minutes he seems to just want to play his own game.
I have a good feeling(just a feeling) some of the players think they should have better than moyes and when games go to crap its because they individually do their own thing.
Thats why it scares me if moyes were to be sacked we could be looking at a rot set in where players have more power than the manager. If he wants rvp out Im behind him.

GSPfan · 06-04-2014 12:13PM

Why are you people wanting to sell RVP only thinking about a 1 game scenario?

You do realise there's 50+ matches a season where inevitably Rooney or RVP or both will be injured or suspended.

I'm fine with benching RVP for tactical reasons in certain games but selling him is beyond ridiculous. Sure if Rooney misses this game on Wednesday through injury who would you rather be up top instead of him? There's no doubt it's RVP.

Also... How come its vital to keep Mata and Kagawa when they both play the same position. How come the logic of selling one of them doesnt apply?

spiralism · 06-04-2014 12:13PM

Nobody's saying play Rooney out of position every game. But it's an idea. Look how well we played yesterday with two 10s...how about with three? Forget the idea of conventional wingers and have three 10s interchanging, all of whom are very different players and bring something different to the table. Think outside the box.

Son Of A Vidic · 06-04-2014 12:14PM

Keno wrote: »

Is he moonwalking? I bet he's moonwalking.

Thanks, I've just sprayed a mouthful of coffee over my keyboard after reading that.:(:D

Blatter · 06-04-2014 12:14PM

I'd attempt to convert Rooney into a deep lying playmaker before considering selling RvP.

I think he has all the attributes to play there. Might take a while to get truly used to the position but I think he could be quality there in the long run.

jane82 · 06-04-2014 12:17PM

Blatter wrote: »

I'd attempt to convert Rooney into a deep lying playmaker before considering selling RvP.

I think he has all the attributes to play there. Might take a while to get truly used to the position but I think he could be quality there in the long run.

Id sell rvp and use the wages to pay a deep lying midfielder.

redbaron_99 · 06-04-2014 12:20PM

GSPfan wrote: »

Why are you people wanting to sell RVP only thinking about a 1 game scenario?

You do realise there's 50+ matches a season where inevitably Rooney or RVP or both will be injured or suspended.

I'm fine with benching RVP for tactical reasons in certain games but selling him is beyond ridiculous. Sure if Rooney misses this game on Wednesday through injury who would you rather be up top instead of him? There's no doubt it's RVP.

Also... How come its vital to keep Mata and Kagawa when they both play the same position. How come the logic of selling one of them doesnt apply?

Because RVP would kick up a stink if he was to be rotated.

Lord TSC · 06-04-2014 12:20PM

keane2097 wrote: »

Seems a bit rich to say Moyes is a chump for not being able to get Rooney and RVP into the same attacking line and then using the cop out of not being aanager yourself or paid to do it yourself so you don't need to have a Cogent suggestion.

Call it a cop out if you want, but I know a loaded question when I see one and have no plans on engaging it; no matter what answer I offered to that question, it was going to result in people launching an attack on it.

I can't sing. I can recognise who is and isn't a good singer.
I can't run. I can tell Usain Bolt is one of the greatest alive and Ricky Gervais isn't.
I could offer up a line up if you want, but I'm not a manager. I can still recognize Moyes is failing in his job.

Though...

spiralism wrote: »

Nobody's saying play Rooney out of position every game. But it's an idea. Look how well we played yesterday with two 10s...how about with three? Forget the idea of conventional wingers and have three 10s interchanging, all of whom are very different players and bring something different to the table. Think outside the box.

This is what I'd like to see as well.

RVP
Mata - Rooney - Kagawa

Not with wingers but three central attacking mids who drift out if need to. And then Januzaj, Hernandez and Welbeck as back ups.

adox · 06-04-2014 12:20PM

jane82 wrote: »

Id sell rvp and use the wages to pay a deep lying midfielder.

Or how about just buying a midfielder?

spiralism · 06-04-2014 12:23PM

jane82 wrote: »

Id sell rvp and use the wages to pay a deep lying midfielder.

You'd sell him to pay the wages? We're the third richest club in the world, wages aren't a problem.

Why is it that after 9 months people all of a sudden think like we're Spurs or Everton? It's a ****ing travesty we are where we are because it's not the level the club aspires to. We're not a selling club that one day aspires to make it into the Champions League, we're the reigning champions. It was only some 8 months ago we were able to basically tell Chelsea to **** off when they came looking for Rooney and we didn't budge. The lowering of standards is unreal, it seems every other post im saying that "This is Man United". Jesus.

redbaron_99 · 06-04-2014 12:24PM

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Call it a cop out if you want

It's a cop out.

Blatter · 06-04-2014 12:25PM

RvP

Mata----Kagawa---Nani/New winger
----Rooney----Fellaini/New CM---

Give that front 6 a run of games together and get the defense sorted under a quality manager and they challenge for the league imo.

adox · 06-04-2014 12:25PM

David De Gea must be the only first team player who hasn't been put forward on this thread this season, as a candidate to be sold.

Truly bizarre.

redbaron_99 · 06-04-2014 12:26PM

spiralism wrote: »

You'd sell him to pay the wages? We're the third richest club in the world, wages aren't a problem.

Why is it that after 9 months people all of a sudden think like we're Spurs or Everton? It's a ****ing travesty we are where we are because it's not the level the club aspires to. We're not a selling club that one day aspires to make it into the Champions League, we're the reigning champions. The lowering of standards is unreal, it seems every other post im saying that "This is Man United". Jesus.

Who is saying we're Spurs or Everton? We're not talking about moving on RVP for money. We're talking about developing a team for the future. Because the current team has been slowly falling apart for a number of years. The sh*t hit the fan this season. It's time for a change.

jane82 · 06-04-2014 12:27PM

adox wrote: »

Or how about just buying a midfielder?

In an ideal world but paying a chap that much to be second choice isnt really sustainable when nearly half a team needs to be bought.

adox · 06-04-2014 12:29PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Because the current team has been slowly falling apart for a number of years. The sh*t hit the fan this season. It's time for a change.

Which team is that? The one that won the league last season, lost it on goal difference the season before?

The **** certainly didn't hit the fan this season as regards to the squad.

The new manager arrived and wasn't up to the job.

spiralism · 06-04-2014 12:29PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Who is saying we're Spurs or Everton? We're not talking about moving on RVP for money. We're talking about developing a team for the future. Because the current team has been slowly falling apart for a number of years. The sh*t hit the fan this season. It's time for a change.

Team in decline...Van Persie has been with us for two seasons ffs. First one he played a huge part in winning the title, this one he's been injured yet contributed, his goals/game is excellent and that hattrick a month ago is the sole reason we're still playing for anything this season right now.

How about we sell the declining or not up to standard players first, instead of throwing the baby out with the bathwater like many are suggesting? Total madness.

Lord TSC · 06-04-2014 12:29PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Who is saying we're Spurs or Everton? We're not talking about moving on RVP for money. We're talking about developing a team for the future. Because the current team has been slowly falling apart for a number of years. The sh*t hit the fan this season. It's time for a change.

Yeah. So let's change the aspects of the team causing problems. How bout we don't change the thing that everyone agrees dragged us through to a league title win last season!

adox wrote: »

David De Gea must be the only first team player who hasn't been put forward on this thread this season, as a candidate to be sold.

The thing is he's the one I'd be surprised if there wasn't some bigger teams sniffing round him over the summer too.

adox · 06-04-2014 12:30PM

jane82 wrote: »

In an ideal world but paying a chap that much to be second choice isnt really sustainable when nearly half a team needs to be bought.

Who's saying he's going to be second choice?

Seriously people, RVP is among our top three players. Why of why do you want to sell him?

jane82 · 06-04-2014 12:33PM

spiralism wrote: »

You'd sell him to pay the wages? We're the third richest club in the world, wages aren't a problem.

Why is it that after 9 months people all of a sudden think like we're Spurs or Everton? It's a ****ing travesty we are where we are because it's not the level the club aspires to. We're not a selling club that one day aspires to make it into the Champions League, we're the reigning champions. It was only some 8 months ago we were able to basically tell Chelsea to **** off when they came looking for Rooney and we didn't budge. The lowering of standards is unreal, it seems every other post im saying that "This is Man United". Jesus.

We sold darren gibson if rvp is not needed or causeing trouble or not performing he should be treated the same. Ferguson looked at them like racehorses theres no room for sentimentality. The club will have a wage structure and budget. If you could cut a bit from rvp you could add a bit to centre midfield. If you cut evras wage you could get a good lb in that does what hes told too.

redbaron_99 · 06-04-2014 12:33PM

adox wrote: »

Which team is that? The one that won the league last season, lost it on goal difference the season before?

The **** certainly didn't hit the fan this season as regards to the squad.

The new manager arrived and wasn't up to the job.

I'll tell you exactly what team I'm referring to.

the team that has five injury prone centre halves.
The team with an injury prone right full, with no back up right full
the team with a left full who is well past it.

the team with a centre midfield that is so weak, that Giggs and Jones were regularly getting games in there.

the team with Nani, Young and Valencia as its main options in wide areas.

That's the team that has been in decline for quite some time. It was inevitable that the sh*t would hit the fan at some point.

Quandary · 06-04-2014 12:35PM

Blatter wrote: »

RvP
Mata----Kagawa---Nani/New winger
----Rooney----Fellaini/New CM---

Give that front 6 a run of games together and get the defense sorted under a quality manager and they challenge for the league imo.

I love the look of that team and the thinking behind it, but what do you do if Rooney hates the idea of his new role?

Lord TSC · 06-04-2014 12:35PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

I'll tell you exactly what team I'm referring to.

the team that has five injury prone centre halves.
The team with an injury prone right full, with no back up right full
the team with a left full who is well past it.

the team with a centre midfield that is so weak, that Giggs and Jones were regularly getting games in there.

the team with Nani, Young and Valencia as its main options in wide areas.

That's the team that has been in decline for quite some time. It was inevitable that the sh*t would hit the fan at some point.

Luckily though, all that suggests our attacking options up front are our strongest point right now. So why are you arguing we should weaken it

How does any of that lead us to "We should sell RVP!"

Seriously, out striker and number 10 options should not be touched this summer.

Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

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