Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

Jimmy Iovine · 20-03-2014 07:40AM

titan18 wrote: »

From corners, Moyes always drops everyone back though, there's never anyone high up the pitch to be an outlet and for the opposing team to worry about.

Even if there was, Young would still hoof it to no one.

Lovely Bloke · 20-03-2014 07:55AM

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

Even if there was, Young would still hoof it to no one.

haha twice last night young played what looked to be decent balls to the corner from near the united box - balls into space he himself should have been in

kstand · 20-03-2014 08:03AM

If there was ever a case of "kicking the can down the road" at United then last nights result was it. Don't know what Moyes had to be smug about nor do I know what drugs he is on after reading - "I suppose we will be underdogs - but I genuinely believe this club is capable of doing it. If we show our capabilities, which we haven't done too often this season, we can be a match for any team".
Lets just strip this bare and put last nights game in perspective - a 40 year old man in midfield played a key role in 2 goals - if he hadn't been playing and Feillaini had instead, would we have scored at all? We have a right winger who works hard but his so slow now he cant get past his man - and a left back who got raped from start to finish and was found out of position time and again. On top of that we were very lucky not to concede and De Gea has made a few great stops at crucial times, especially the double save at 1-0. The stats after the game showed they had 51% possession and to cap it all off, we spent the last half an hour after the third goal more or less camped out in our half of the pitch nervously holding on to what we had. Against a team from Greece.

IamtheWalrus · 20-03-2014 08:15AM

Not sure how a team that walked the 'best league in the world' last season should necessarily be labelled underdogs in the CL.

keeponhurling · 20-03-2014 08:20AM

United pressed the ball much better, everyone was busting a gut. Even in the opposition half.

In recent performances they have been very static, immobile and easy for the opposition to pass the ball around. Not least the 1st leg in Greece.

Like Mourinho's sides, working harder than the opposition takes you a long way.

Giggs & Welbeck's introduction definitely seemed to add energy, and it was a great performance by Valencia too.
If Giggs can perform like that after no games for over a month, he may well be put into storage for the quater finals now!

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 08:54AM

I'll hold my hands up and say I was wrong about the game last night. I'm glad to be wrong about it but it still doesn't change my opinion.

We were lucky they were so awful on the nite. Scraped the win thanks to an easy penalty and terrible goal keeping on their behalf.

We looked a bit better with solid performances from the likes of Valencia and some good + bad passing from giggs. That's as far as we'll get though. I fear serious embarrassment if we draw one of the top dogs in the next round.

bucketybuck · 20-03-2014 09:00AM

Does anybody want to take a shot at explaining the Felliani issue?

We have well documented midfield problems. £27.5m was spent on Felliani and nobody else for the position in two transfer windows, but when it comes to the crunch a fully fit Felliani is benched in favour of 40 year old Ryan Giggs and a woefully out of form Carrick.

That Giggs played relatively well doesn't change the fact that our £27.5m midfield signing seemingly cannot cement a place in the team. Whats the reason behind this? Is he just not good enough? Is he good enough but Moyes just doesn't trust him? Is he like Mata, expensive but doesn't actually fit into the systems Moyes wants to use?

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 09:04AM

He's meant to be taking Carricks Defensive Midfield role. The 2 of them can't play together as they have the same weaknesses. Both are slow and don't have the vision or skill to pick off long passes.

We don't have anybody in the team who can do that. Giggs seems to be the closest thing for now until we can buy a proper fast box to box creative mid who makes up for his and Carricks weaknesses.

Ideally they should stick Rooney in that role for now until we can buy the likes of Kroos, Vidal, Pjanic or Gundogan in the summer.

He already spends half the game there. Might as well stick him there permanently until reinforcements are got.

bucketybuck · 20-03-2014 09:12AM

BloodBath wrote: »

Both are slow and don't have the vision or skill to pick off long passes.

Then what the fcuk did we spend £27.5m on him for?

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 09:16AM

It was an obvious deadline day panic buy. He's equally as mediocre as Carrick though. Definitely not worth near 30m. 20m would have been a fair price tag but it's early days. He might turn out to be great for us when we have someone decent to play beside him.

He is Carricks replacement though so get used to it. I seriously doubt another defensive mid will be bought until carrick leaves/retires.

kstand · 20-03-2014 09:22AM

BloodBath wrote: »

It was an obvious deadline day panic buy. He's equally as mediocre as Carrick though. Definitely not worth near 30m. 20m would have been a fair price tag but it's early days. He might turn out to be great for us when we have someone decent to play beside him.

He is Carricks replacement though so get used to it.

Says who?
He isn't capable of holding a pint let alone holding a midfield. Easily the worst pound for pound purchase I have ever seen at the club.
And as for this statement:
"Both are slow and don't have the vision or skill to pick off long passes."
Carrick is one of the best passers in the league but because of his role he is rarely in a position to prove that. Slow I'll grant you but to say Carrick cant pass, no way.

Maximus Alexander · 20-03-2014 09:24AM

kstand wrote: »

Lets just strip this bare and put last nights game in perspective - a 40 year old man in midfield played a key role in 2 goals - if he hadn't been playing and Feillaini had instead, would we have scored at all?

I don't understand who this is a criticism of, or how it is. He was playing. It's akin to saying "A 30 year old striker played up front and scored all 3 goals - if he had not been playing and Hernandez had instead, would we have scored at all?"

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 09:26AM

kstand wrote: »

Says who?
He isn't capable of holding a pint let alone holding a midfield. Easily the worst pound for pound purchase I have ever seen at the club.
And as for this statement:
"Both are slow and don't have the vision or skill to pick off long passes."
Carrick is one of the best passers in the league but because of his role he is rarely in a position to prove that. Slow I'll grant you but to say Carrick cant pass, no way.

Biting my lip. Stop listening to the English media. Carrick has never been anything other than mediocre during his entire career.

Carrick can pass short yes, he doesn't pick out long passes to the forwards or wingers too often though. He barely attempts it as the failure rate is high. He had Scholes to do that for him. Win the ball, pass it to Scholesy, job done.

Lord TSC · 20-03-2014 09:27AM

Fel, a bit like Mata, was bought for the tactics and formation the fans want to see, not the ones Moyes wants to play. When we play 4231, Fel will be the second man along side Carrick, and will be the long term replacement for him. But Moyes prefers the negative 442, which only needs one holding midfielder (Carrick) and one attack minded midfielder. Last night, he chose Giggs over, say, Cleverly or even Kagawa (who I have no doubt could have done the exact same job) and Carrick over Fel.

I still believe Giggs was picked to "prove a point"; that he got his first start in months days after that story broke is too big a coincidence. He also fits more in with Moyes' "Hit it up the field and see what happens" mentality.

Furthermore, Fel offers a physical pressence that, for one reason or another, United don't have at the moment. We aren't pressuring for the ball, we aren't chasing the ball. We wait until the other team passes badly and steal it then. Otherwise, it's sit back and wait to see what happens again.

I don't buy the idea that Moyes was screaming for the team to get forward; not, mind, to say he wasn't on the touchlines screaming, but that it would go against everything else that happened; the negative teamsheet, the negative formation, the negative substitutions, the negative but rigid structure the team held as a defensive unit after the third goal.

If, though, the team were doing all of that, ALL of it, without Moyes' consent, then he isn't doing his job either, cause a manager at that level should not be ignored.

bucketybuck · 20-03-2014 09:30AM

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Fel, a bit like Mata, was bought for the tactics and formation the fans want to see, not the ones Moyes wants to play

Strange, considering it was Moyes that bought him, not the fans.

fatherted1969 · 20-03-2014 09:33AM

What's the story with Nani these days. He's basically signed a contract and has hardly kicked a ball since

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 09:35AM

Looks like himself and Kags are on the way out the door. Must have been a fall out behind the scenes and/or not risking injury so they can be sold in the summer.

Iused2likebusts · 20-03-2014 09:41AM

BloodBath wrote: »

He's meant to be taking Carricks Defensive Midfield role. The 2 of them can't play together as they have the same weaknesses. Both are slow and don't have the vision or skill to pick off long passes.

We don't have anybody in the team who can do that. Giggs seems to be the closest thing for now until we can buy a proper fast box to box creative mid who makes up for his and Carricks weaknesses.

Ideally they should stick Rooney in that role for now until we can buy the likes of Kroos, Vidal, Pjanic or Gundogan in the summer.

He already spends half the game there. Might as well stick him there permanently until reinforcements are got.

spot on there carrick and fellani dont compliment each other at all neither can drive forward with the ball to add to the issues you highlighted. If rooney was played alongside one of them utd would also be able to solve the mata issue aswell until the summer.
carrick fellani
mata rooney janujaz
rvp
Has 3 main problems 1 two Cms with the same strengths and weaknesses.2 A no.10 thats not creative enough 3 no pace out wide so easy to defend against.
I think there is far more balance to the following front 6
carrick rooney
valencia mata wellbeck
rvp
IMO moyes has spent nearly 70 million but due to the way he is setting up the team neither signing has failed to improve the team. Mata is a brilliant player and should turn out to be a great signing for you's, Fellani I personally dont think will ever be good enough to be a regular starter for a team hoping to be top 4 minimum.

bangkok · 20-03-2014 09:43AM

never seen so many negative comments in my life when that starting 11 was named last night... "fans" just hoping united lose so moyes gets the sack....

even seen on the match thread "fans" giving out when moyes celebrated the 2nd goal "as if they just found a cure for aids"

welbeck was immense last night its about time some people finally give him the credit he truly deserves

beno619 · 20-03-2014 09:45AM

Strange comments about Fellaini this morning. He's a good player. We paid over the odds but so did city for Fernandinho who I dont think is any better. He's been great since his return from injury and was far from our worst performer vs Pool. He can only get better from hear on in imo.

Someone pointed out its very difficult to judge players under the current Moyes regime when you look at how poor players like RVP and Mata have performed in the last month.

Maximus Alexander · 20-03-2014 09:49AM

bangkok wrote: »

welbeck was immense last night its about time some people finally give him the credit he truly deserves

I think this is the first time I've ever agreed with you. Welbeck and Rooney looked like men possessed for large chunks of the game.

Giruilla · 20-03-2014 09:50AM

Replacing Evra should now be priority number one for United. Been an absolutely fantastic player for the club, but last night was frightening.

The penalty was a lucky break united needed.

I'm in the give Moyes more time camp for various reasons. But I still think on this current path, Moyes will be out of the job some time next year. There's only one thing he can do to keep his job in my opinion, and thats to start playing some good football.

United are just playing a numbers game at the moment... flipping a coin... and last night was an example of the coin landing the right way up for Moyes.

Kerrydude1981 · 20-03-2014 09:50AM

bucketybuck · 20-03-2014 09:54AM

beno619 wrote: »

He's been great since his return from injury and was far from our worst performer vs Pool.

So good that he was dropped for last nights game?

bangkok · 20-03-2014 09:54AM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I think this is the first time I've ever agreed with you. Welbeck and Rooney looked like men possessed for large chunks of the game.

he played well loads of times this season and in big games over the last few years...

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 09:57AM

The problem will disappear when/if we can buy a world class playmaker in midfield. There is nothing remotely close to what Scholes was on the team.

Lord TSC · 20-03-2014 09:59AM

bangkok wrote: »

never seen so many negative comments in my life when that starting 11 was named last night... "fans" just hoping united lose so moyes gets the sack....

even seen on the match thread "fans" giving out when moyes celebrated the 2nd goal "as if they just found a cure for aids"

Back to the "Ye aren't real fans" nonsense, are we? :rolleyes:

BloodBath · 20-03-2014 10:01AM

Has anybody seen this guy in action yet?

Has Evra replacement written all over him and he's only 21. Not many vids of him on youtube though.

5 goals and 4 assists in 21 starts this season. Supposed to be solid defensively as well.

bangkok · 20-03-2014 10:01AM

Pudsy33 wrote: »

Giggs versatile? Nope.

giggs MOTM yes....

bangkok · 20-03-2014 10:02AM

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Back to the "Ye aren't real fans" nonsense, are we? :rolleyes:

no but it was a great line up last night, loads of pace in the team and most people couldn't see here last night when the team was named.... I was just quiet shocked

Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

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