Feb 9th Protest - will you be joining?

bleg · 02-02-2013 12:03AM

I'm going to go watch the rugby and enjoy myself with friends rather than go shouting and raising my blood pressure.

Now if there was a protest where you wouldn't have siptu ictu sinn fein or whoever, claiming that everybody is there to support their cause then I might consider contemplating joining. Until then, you're all a pack of pawns for them in my view.

Johro · 02-02-2013 12:06AM

bleg wrote: »

I'm going to go watch the rugby and enjoy myself with friends rather than go shouting and raising my blood pressure.

Now if there was a protest where you wouldn't have siptu ictu sinn fein or whoever, claiming that everybody is there to support their cause then I might consider contemplating joining. Until then, you're all a pack of pawns for them in my view.

I've always seen the 'well I'm not going if so and so is gonna be there' as a convenient excuse tbh. You're not there for them. You're there for you and the rest of the Irish people.

Hootanany · 02-02-2013 12:09AM

bleg wrote: »

I'm going to go watch the rugby and enjoy myself with friends rather than go shouting and raising my blood pressure.

Now if there was a protest where you wouldn't have siptu ictu sinn fein or whoever, claiming that everybody is there to support their cause then I might consider contemplating joining. Until then, you're all a pack of pawns for them in my view.

Sheep

bleg · 02-02-2013 12:11AM

Johro wrote: »

Many Irish people don't go to demonstrations because they are either plain lazy, apathetic or just don't believe demonstrating will make any difference. Mostly the latter to be fair. But if the alternative is sitting at home watching telly and saying 'look at those eejits out there marching' I'd rather be one of 'those eejits' than be one of you, because at least they're willing to go out and show their anger at the way people are being pissed on and sold out by their government. You are all well able to complain about the state of the education services, the health service, empty housing estates, shitty roads, taxes on this and that, bank bailouts and cronyism, but when you get a chance to voice your frustration you go 'meh.....' .

I thought the chance to voice your frustration was at an election rather than at a trade union organised event. Hmm...

You see this is the thing. People can go along to the protest next weekend and the trade unions will claim some sort of victory in their name. If you go along, your individual act of protest will be lumped in with people who you might not necessarily agree with. This it is not really a forum to voice your frustration, the only time to do that is at the ballot box when you're the one in charge.

Am Chile · 02-02-2013 12:13AM

If its a small turnout nationwide on the 9th of february-in my view it will make if even harder to get any sort of deal on the bank debt, I can picture a scene with gilmore and kenny trying to negotiate a deal on the bank debt at the negotiating table and then being hearing the words there were nationwide protests organised in your country over the bank debt/austerity and only a handful of people turned up to protest-if its a small turnout on the 9th february its gonna send out the wrong message bu giving an Impression to other EU leaders that Irish people aren,t unhappy about the bank debt/austerity-and ordinary working people in other EU countries will reach a similar conclusion-in years to come future generations burdoned with the bank debt will look and say the older generation tried to do nothing about the crippling bank debt.

GalwayGuy2 · 02-02-2013 12:14AM

Many Irish people don't go to demonstrations because they are either plain lazy, apathetic or just don't believe demonstrating will make any difference.

Or they don't agree with the views held at the demonstration.

I've always seen the 'well I'm not going if so and so is gonna be there' as a convenient excuse tbh. You're not there for them. You're there for you and the rest of the Irish people.

Tbf, I'm going to disagree with you there. If you're not the one talking to the cameras, or shouting from the stage, or waving a placard, then you will be lumped together with the "leader's" views.

And on the social welfare, yeah there is quite a large kink within the system. They are quite a lot of people, while not happy on the dole, know, or think, that it's more when they'd make if they starting working. Maybe it's the high cost of living, cost of childcare, the minimum wage, or a hundred other reasons, but there is a problem.

Stained Class · 02-02-2013 12:14AM

Johro wrote: »

As for the 'Shinners', at least they don't mind nailing their colours to the mast. They are consistent in their ideals and I can't fault them for it, especially when the current and previous governments are in the pockets of the banks.

This doesn't help much.

Nor does calling people like me lazy and apothetic.

People like me work hard, pay taxes & are too hard pressed to take a day off to run along side Shinners & Skangers.

I don't spend my days sitting by the fire eating crisps y'know.

Fulton Crown · 02-02-2013 12:15AM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Yes again I believe in evidence based realities. Marching and protests have achieved some measure of success in the past. The least they have done is to bring awareness to an issue. A large number of people in Europe are under the impression that Irish people are happy with the cuts imposed on them ect. Are you seriously giving out about a protest being on a Saturday?

"A large number of people in Europe are under the impression that Irish people are happy with the cuts imposed on them ect." ?

Have you a study that backs this up my friend ?

Are Happy with the cuts......are you for real compadre ?

bleg · 02-02-2013 12:16AM

Johro wrote: »

I've always seen the 'well I'm not going if so and so is gonna be there' as a convenient excuse tbh. You're not there for them. You're there for you and the rest of the Irish people.

Grand. Why can't everybody else do the same. Get rid of the banners and the chants and I might go along.

A union circle jerk against the 'establishment' doesn't entice me to be honest.

Hilly Bill · 02-02-2013 12:19AM

Johro wrote: »

I've always seen the 'well I'm not going if so and so is gonna be there' as a convenient excuse tbh. You're not there for them. You're there for you and the rest of the Irish people.

If people are there for themselves then they would be outside the Dail 24/7 in huge numbers rather than wait until some group organises a protest march so that they can join in.
Until people raise up in the same vein as the people of Egypt /Greece etc ( minus the killings and bloodshed ) it will be just another protest that the government have to put up with for a few ours on a saturday.

Pete M. · 02-02-2013 12:20AM

Essentially this is a protest against the debt imposed on all of us here.
If you don't want to go, that's fine.

But if you are opposed to what has happened and want this madness to end, then you could help in some small way by showing up.

Big numbers will mean a lot more to the Eurocrats & bankers and the rest of Europe looking at us during the presidency of the whole charade.

Every individual or group should turn up because this is the root of the problem.

Drop the Debt!!! Let them suited b@stards pay for their own mess.

It has thus far been a great excuse for driving down our general standard of living while a few f@t fcuks at the top get rich quicker.

Apathy is great if you don't care...

Doc Ruby · 02-02-2013 12:20AM

bleg wrote: »

Now if there was a protest where you wouldn't have siptu ictu sinn fein or whoever, claiming that everybody is there to support their cause then I might consider contemplating joining. Until then, you're all a pack of pawns for them in my view.

The actual reason nobody goes to protests.

Yes, we hate you people that much.

bleg · 02-02-2013 12:21AM

Hootanany wrote: »

Sheep

What if the people attending the protest are the sheep?

Johro · 02-02-2013 12:23AM

bleg wrote: »

I thought the chance to voice your frustration was at an election rather than at a trade union organised event. Hmm...

You see this is the thing. People can go along to the protest next weekend and the trade unions will claim some sort of victory in their name. If you go along, your individual act of protest will be lumped in with people who you might not necessarily agree with. This it is not really a forum to voice your frustration, the only time to do that is at the ballot box when you're the one in charge.

Well, this is the thing about our so-called democracy. We are never really in charge, since whoever gets voted in has to do the banks' bidding anyway, unless you're willing to forego the main parties and vote for an alternative. Then you're up against that 'well what's the point, they'll never get in anyway' crowd. And they won't if everyone has the same defeatist attitude.
The whole political system needs a serious shake up, and we need to stop the big financial institutions dictating policy.
As for the unions claiming victory, if it's victory I'm happy to share it. If you're that bothered about not being lumped in with the unions, make a banner that makes it clear.

Am Chile · 02-02-2013 12:27AM

Fulton Crown wrote: »

"A large number of people in Europe are under the impression that Irish people are happy with the cuts imposed on them ect." ?

Have you a study that backs this up my friend ?

Are Happy with the cuts......are you for real compadre ?

When other people in Europe in Spain,Portugal, Greece, Italy take to the streets in large numbers over austerity measures imposed on them-but see no similar large scale protests in Ireland, what other conclusion would they reach other that Irish people don,t mind all the austerity measures imposed on them, in late 2011 I remember watching one discussion on euronews about large scale protests in other EU countries over Austerity measures, on the show it was pointed out there is also similar measures in Ireland, I recall one guest saying the words Irish people don,t protest, what sort of a conclusion would people in europe think when they hear the words Irish people don,t protest ?

Pete M. · 02-02-2013 12:27AM

bleg wrote: »

What if the people attending the protest are the sheep?

Yes sir, yes sir, three bags full.

No.

That definitely sounds like the people who won't be at the march :cool:

and let it be the start of something...

Johro · 02-02-2013 12:29AM

Stained Class wrote: »

This doesn't help much.

Nor does calling people like me lazy and apothetic.

People like me work hard, pay taxes & are too hard pressed to take a day off to run along side Shinners & Skangers.

I don't spend my days sitting by the fire eating crisps y'know.

If you read my post, you'll see that I also said ''or (people who) just don't think demonstrating will make any difference'', so don't pretend I called you anything. Your 'shinners and skangers' speaks volumes though.

Hilly Bill · 02-02-2013 12:31AM

What gets me is that a lot at the protest will actually owe money to the banks and want a way to not pay it and are in turn part of the problem for which they are protesting against "Its not our debt" Yes it is, pay back what you owe and maybe the rest of us wont get hit as hard.

Doc Ruby · 02-02-2013 12:33AM

Pete M. wrote: »

Yes sir, yes sir, three bags full.

No.

That definitely sounds like the people who won't be at the march :cool:

and let it be the start of something...

The problem with the approach of the socialist worker's party is that they're trying to start a cult of personality without a personality between them.

Anyone with the charisma to make a difference has the good sense to steer well clear of an ideology that was dated a century ago.

Meanwhile from the perspective of this prole, it looks like two gangs of fatcats fighting it out for the cheese, the unions and the bankers, and I'm only too delighted to let them have at it then go after whoever comes out on top.

Defiler Of The Coffin · 02-02-2013 12:33AM

Most Irish people have accepted that current government policy is the quickest way out of the mire. If there is a better alternative then let's hear it. Otherwise the people will just put their heads down and get on with it. In retrospect the bank bailout was a terrible deal but that ship has sailed. What alternatives do the protesters have?

Fulton Crown · 02-02-2013 12:33AM

Johro wrote: »

Well, this is the thing about our so-called democracy. We are never really in charge, since whoever gets voted in has to do the banks' bidding anyway, unless you're willing to forego the main parties and vote for an alternative. Then you're up against that 'well what's the point, they'll never get in anyway' crowd. And they won't if everyone has the same defeatist attitude.
The whole political system needs a serious shake up, and we need to stop the big financial institutions dictating policy.
As for the unions claiming victory, if it's victory I'm happy to share it. If you're that bothered about not being lumped in with the unions, make a banner that makes it clear.

"unless you're willing to forego the main parties and vote for an alternative."

Whats that then pilgrim ?....Gerry and fat Mary "champions of the dissapeared" ?

Trumpeting about health service equality and then goes to NY for private treatment ?

Yeah pal..I would trust people like that...honest !

Annasopra · 02-02-2013 12:34AM

bleg wrote: »

This it is not really a forum to voice your frustration, the only time to do that is at the ballot box when you're the one in charge.

I completely and hugely disagree with this - democracy means that much more than a vote once every five years

Annasopra · 02-02-2013 12:36AM

Stained Class wrote: »

This doesn't help much.

Nor does calling people like me lazy and apothetic.

People like me work hard, pay taxes & are too hard pressed to take a day off to run along side Shinners & Skangers.

I don't spend my days sitting by the fire eating crisps y'know.

Oh FFS - I'm neither shinner nor skanger :rolleyes: and many others are like me

Am Chile · 02-02-2013 12:37AM

bleg wrote: »

Grand. Why can't everybody else do the same. Get rid of the banners and the chants and I might go along.

A union circle jerk against the 'establishment' doesn't entice me to be honest.

Two months ago in waterford a large scale march took place over proposed plans to downgrade the waterford hospital, while a big crowd turned up to it, the march itself was a load of siht, a silent funeral march took place, there was a labour td for waterford in attendence at the march that afternoon, I spotted her grinning and laughing walking along and I thought no wonder shes laughing to herself its a silent march shes attending, where as if there had of being a chant going among the crowd save our hospital or labour out- I don, think she would of being grinning and laughing then.

SEPT 23 1989 · 02-02-2013 12:39AM

Hopefully someday soon we can get behind a group or a person who will bring together the non union private sector,the self employed,the unemployed and the students of Ireland

This would be a real revolution

Stained Class · 02-02-2013 12:43AM

mango salsa wrote: »

Oh FFS - I'm neither shinner nor skanger :rolleyes: and many others are like me

I never said that.

The point I'm making is that 'shinners & skangers' hijack pretty much any protest that's made by anybody in this country.

And nobody decent wants to run with them.

That's one of the big reasons I wouldn't go to this protest or any other.

bleg · 02-02-2013 12:44AM

mango salsa wrote: »

There is a large protest in Dublin, Cork, Sligo, Waterford and Limerick against the bank debt on Saturday February 9th

Will you join?

How large is a large protest? What constitutes a medium or small sized one?

What if people think they're going to a large sized protest but it actually end up being medium or extra large? Will their travel fees be refunded?

Red6 · 02-02-2013 12:47AM

Thanks for your post hightlighting this demonstration. I will be attending on 9th February along with three others. It's important to show the government how the decisions they are making are effecting people's lives now and the futures of our children.

Fulton Crown · 02-02-2013 12:47AM

Stained Class wrote: »

I never said that.

The point I'm making is that 'shinners & skangers' hijack pretty much any protest that's made by anybody in this country.

And nobody decent wants to run with them.

That's one of the big reasons I wouldn't go to this protest or any other.

Well said pal......and absolutely true.

The sad fact is these these are the "alternatives".

Bang of crusties and sharp faced skangers / shinners at these affaires is disgusting

Annasopra · 02-02-2013 12:48AM

Stained Class wrote: »

I never said that.

The point I'm making is that 'shinners & skangers' hijack pretty much any protest that's made by anybody in this country.

And nobody decent wants to run with them.

That's one of the big reasons I wouldn't go to this protest or any other.

But if you have never been to any protest - how do you actually know what happens? - I've been at many that have included shinners but they haven't hijacked it, just been part of it, I've been at lots of other protests where shinners didn't attend

Feb 9th Protest - will you be joining?

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