Rangers FC lodge papers to go into administration

Zebra3 wrote: »

Can you provide any links for the above?

Here's Chester's Club site claiming history dating back to 1885:
http://www.chester-city.co.uk/

And their honours list, proudly claiming their three Cheshire Premier Cup and Cambridgeshire Professional Cup success:
http://www.chester-city.co.uk/honours.asp

AFC Telford claiming a club history and honours back to 1872:
http://www.afctelfordunited.co.uk/a/club-history-24498.html

As of 2007, Wimbledon FC's club history were officially transferred from MK Dons to AFC Wimbledon

http://www.afcwimbledon.co.uk/honours.php?Psection_id=4&Psub_section_id=7&squad=

Aldershot's site gives a mixed message to be fair, and their club records do only specifically reference the club from their 1992 re-birth onwards although the 1926-92 club has it's own bio and records page on the site, including referencing that 10-1 1990 defeat to Southend United in the Leyland Daf Trophy which I'm sure that you all remember every bit as well as I do

As I said, if this was my club's rival I'd be loving every second of it and would be revelling in it. As a football supporter though I just think the whole thing is desperately sad. I know that from my perspective that I'll be considering the new club to be a continuation of the old club. I don't believe that to be deluded, I believe it to be an acknowledgement that we as football fans support football clubs and not limited companies or PLCs.

bren2001 wrote: »

Financially over one season that may be the difference between Rangers being in the league and not being in the league. If you look to the short term its not a huge issue as the clubs will get by.

Whats worrying is the long term. Like it or like it not the Old Firm derby kept interest in the SPL. Rangers not being in the league makes it far less competitive for the next few years. What is interesting is that the league has the chance to reform itself to be more competitive in a few years time. This could be a blessing in disguise but with the state the SFA is in I think things will just get worse.

Who said one season?

No Rangers doesnt make the SPL less competitive. Removing a club that has cheated for over a decade can only improve competition and sporting integrity.

Jelle1880 wrote: »

The way Green is behaving I doubt we'll be allowed in any league.

What I find weird though is why Celtic are so quiet...
It's not like anybody expects them to vote 'Yes', is it ?

Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.

If Celtic make a statement about abstaining or voting no then you see several articles about Celtic sowing it into Sevco and its just bad publicity

bren2001 wrote: »

How can you forecast the effect of not having Rangers in the league past one season? Next season the effect is 300, I expect it will be more at the end of next season if Celtic walk the league.

Celtic will decide how competitive the league is going to be, none of the other teams have the financial strength they do (which isn't a lot). Their aim will be to push on in Europe so youd expect them to try and buy good players. Its hard to see what team can stand up to them and push for the title. Saying that, the competitiveness for 2nd place is now extremely high. I suppose the league is more AND less competitive, depends which way you look at it.

You seem to be able to do it no bother! :rolleyes:

Aberdeen fans did some number crunching, they asked the club chairman, an accountant to validate the information and he did. 300 season tickets offsets Rangers for them.

bren2001 wrote: »

How can you forecast the effect of not having Rangers in the league past one season? Next season the effect is 300, I expect it will be more at the end of next season if Celtic walk the league.

Celtic will decide how competitive the league is going to be, none of the other teams have the financial strength they do (which isn't a lot). Their aim will be to push on in Europe so youd expect them to try and buy good players. Its hard to see what team can stand up to them and push for the title. Saying that, the competitiveness for 2nd place is now extremely high. I suppose the league is more AND less competitive, depends which way you look at it.

Won't Celtics place in europe come under serious threat in the next few years?

Dempsey wrote: »

You seem to be able to do it no bother! :rolleyes:

Aberdeen fans did some number crunching, they asked the club chairman, an accountant to validate the information and he did. 300 season tickets offsets Rangers for them.

A season ticket is £293, to keep is simple call is £300, 300 * 300 = £90,000. So the net effect of Rangers leaving the SPL is about £1.1 million a year (to all the clubs). I cannot see the figure being that low. TV rights for next season will go down by more than that if Celtic walk the league. The Accountant at Aberdeen needs to check those figures again and reforecast them. Rangers are worth more than that to the SPL.

Dempsey wrote: »

Champions of Scotland go through 2 rounds of qualifiers, how can it get much worse? Another round against the likes of champions of Iceland etc? I dont think it can get much more difficult tbh just shorten players holidays is all.



Why dont you ring Greig Ingram & Duncan Fraser and tell them about your startling discovery! You clearly know Aberdeens finances and how to forecast future income better that their own chief executive and accountant!

Even I can see that you have ignored certain considerations

I assume that is two rounds of qualifiers to the CL?
What happens if they lose that automatic right to CL qualification? *I don't know whether that is possible or not.

Dempsey wrote: »

Automatic CL qualification was lost years ago. The champions of every country under UEFA are entitled to enter the champions qualifier route, coefficients dictate what stage you have to start in. Currently Celtic have 2 rounds to negotiate and we are seeded for the 3rd round.

Would having a weaker team (ie not ranger as they have been for the past decade) effect the co-efficients? (in the medium to long term)

kippy wrote: »

Would having a weaker team (ie not ranger as they have been for the past decade) effect the co-efficients? (in the medium to long term)

As said we'd probably drop into the 2nd round of qualifiers. How does our place in Europe 'come under serious threat'?

bren2001 wrote: »

I'm clearly not an accountant, I took directly what they said, multiplied it by the amount of a season ticket got the figure, thats what they are saying it will take to fill the gap. Clearly there are more considerations! All Im doing is pointing out that the effect of Rangers is more than £90,000. The accountant looked over the figures, I'm sure Aberdeen know exactly how much it is going to cost them, I don't believe for a second its 300 season tickets. Even if it is, thats a lot of extra season tickets to shift.

If the fans group was wrong, im pretty sure the accountant would have told them why they were wrong. He didnt

kippy wrote: »

Would having a weaker team (ie not ranger as they have been for the past decade) effect the co-efficients? (in the medium to long term)

Scotland are currently sitting 18th, however this is mainly due to the fact that the points from the year of rangers UEFA Cup run are still included.
As of next year, they won't be.

Currently Scotland has 2 qualifying places in the CL, although realistically only Celtic have a chance.
Scotland also have Dundee Utd, Hearts and St Johnstone all facing qualifiers for the Europa League - given recent history it will be a surprise if more than one of them qualify for the groups, if indeed any at all.

Without those points (10.25) Scotland's average over the past 4 years is around 2.5 so in effect the loss will equate to around 7.75.
As things stand, that will drop Scotland to 28th, below Bulgaria, Hungary, Serbia and the likes of Romania, all countries who are having more success on the European stage than Scotland have for years. (N.B it will leave them 5 places above Ireland)

That will leave Scotland with 1 CL Place (The same route as Celtic have at the moment) and 3 Europa League places.

Celtic will have to hold Scottish football in that position single handedly, unless the other clubs seriously buck up their act.

As Dempsey says, the only thing that can happen if things drop further is an extra qualifying round - but i think he's got the blinkers on slightly if he thinks that won't affect the players that Celtic can attract, or the sponsorship money that the club brought in.

Basically, unless Celtic can make themselves into a Rosenberg style team and become a mainstay in the group stages and are supported by a Motherwell or a Hearts in the Europa league - Scottish Football is in big trouble when it comes to Europe, and will be seen on a par with ireland & finland before long.

(Also, this was happening prior to Rangers troubles - now it's simply a matter that is in Celtic's hands imo)

kippy wrote: »

Isn't the co-efficient worked out by the countries clubs performances in Europe? The higher the co-efficient, the more chance another club from that country can try gain european qualification and indeed the less rounds they have to go through?
Having only one team "barely" compete in Europe (celtic) and the next best team (who knows - but they wont be getting too far in europe) have a direct knock on effect to the co-efficient and over time this will result in either less teams playing top european football and them finding an ever more difficult route to get there?
Isn't that a serious threat?

Thats the theory but if you check up how the coefficients actually work, what is most likely is that the SPL drops to 1 club in the 2nd round of the UCL qualifiers and 3 clubs in the EL qualifiers. To get worse than that, Scottish Football would need to contract to the size of NI football. That isnt likely to happen at all.

EDIT

Kyle Lafferty refuses to join Sevco