Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

marienbad · 18-05-2012 04:49PM

Fireball07 wrote: »

I think it's ****ing stupid. Stopped the Barcelona friendly before and now this. It'd be good for Limerick to have big teams playing here...Thomond Park is a great venue.

Just because it clashes with the Dublin Super Cup :rolleyes: what a load of crap.

Surely the more tournaments that we can host in Ireland, the better?

And whats more , as far as I know , the Dublin tournament has no sponsors and so is not a certainty.

Bit like the Barcelona debacle , first they tried to have it moved to Dublin and when that did'nt work they banned it.

Seems like a case of - if we can't have it, no one can ''

marienbad · 18-05-2012 04:52PM

P.S. and what is more annoying I remember back in the dim distant past when Limerick qualified for Europe the games were always played in Thomond - Torino in the 60's if memory serves.

No problem obliging the FAI in those days . Of course we were both comrades in arms in dem days being ''foreign games'' and all that - how times change

Cpt_Blackbeard · 18-05-2012 04:55PM

And we wonder why rugby is so popular in Limerick...

.ak · 18-05-2012 05:06PM

Typical FAI. Just another reason I find it hard to get excited about the Euros.

marienbad · 18-05-2012 05:16PM

And looking to the future - the Celtic nations have advised UEFA that they are interested in bidding for Euro 2020 ( or so the soccer heads in the family tell me) . Now that is going to be expanded to a 24 team tournament. That requires at least 8 stadiums and Thomond Park might have fit the bill nicely - talkg about building bridges for the future !

But we really do need to get more events for the venue .

phog · 18-05-2012 05:23PM

The FAI held two international soccer games there in the last few years, so I think they know the venue. I've no idea what's going on between the FAI and Limerick FC. Limerick FC brought a European cup game against Real Madrid to Lansdowne in the 80's.

ambid · 18-05-2012 05:43PM

I think what's happening is that the Limerick event is being organised by a promoter unconnected to the FAI. The FAI want to have a monopoly on the only pre season tournament in Ireland, and they want to host it in the Aviva.

It is disappointing, but I'm pretty sure that is the FAI logic (if I can use that term and FAI in the same sentence).

profitius · 18-05-2012 05:52PM

Its bad for soccer.

phog · 18-05-2012 05:54PM

Munster rugby have posted some photos of their season here, unfortunately cut short this season.

CatFromHue · 18-05-2012 06:07PM

I see Ul Bohs are looking for a Director of Rugby. Did Barry Murphy do this for a period of time or am I mistaken?

http://www.ulbohs.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1332:director-of-rugby-season-2012-13&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=53

ormond lad · 18-05-2012 06:17PM

CatFromHue wrote: »

I see Ul Bohs are looking for a Director of Rugby. Did Barry Murphy do this for a period of time or am I mistaken?

http://www.ulbohs.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1332:director-of-rugby-season-2012-13&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=53

Thats a surprise Murphys gone as he only started this time last year and has only 1 season done in the role

CatFromHue · 18-05-2012 06:21PM

A bit of a weird one all right, especially as Bohs got promoted.

Stephen Keogh will be player coach at Shannon next season too.
http://www.irishrugby.ie/ulsterbankleague/26541.php

CIARAN_BOYLE · 18-05-2012 06:27PM

ambid wrote: »

I think what's happening is that the Limerick event is being organised by a promoter unconnected to the FAI. The FAI want to have a monopoly on the only pre season tournament in Ireland, and they want to host it in the Aviva.

It is disappointing, but I'm pretty sure that is the FAI logic (if I can use that term and FAI in the same sentence).

The FAI have a deal with their promoter (who is paying extra for the clause) that the FAI will block any friendlies that their guys aren't promoting that could happen in a stadium over 20,000.

I think its a real pity for Limerick FC and for Munster rugby who could probably charge a six figure sum in rent for an event like this

castie · 18-05-2012 06:31PM

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

The FAI have a deal with their promoter (who is paying extra for the clause) that the FAI will block any friendlies that their guys aren't promoting that could happen in a stadium over 20,000.

I think its a real pity for Limerick FC and for Munster rugby who could probably charge a six figure sum in rent for an event like this

Surely this breaches some sort of competition law if true.

ormond lad · 18-05-2012 06:31PM

CatFromHue wrote: »

A bit of a weird one all right, especially as Bohs got promoted.

Stephen Keogh will be player coach at Shannon next season too.
http://www.irishrugby.ie/ulsterbankleague/26541.php

Keogh did all right with Shannon this season, used plenty of young players which along with the Shannon-Saints u19 all ireland win bodes well for the future

Amazotheamazing · 18-05-2012 06:42PM

ambid wrote: »

I think what's happening is that the Limerick event is being organised by a promoter unconnected to the FAI. The FAI want to have a monopoly on the only pre season tournament in Ireland, and they want to host it in the Aviva.

It is disappointing, but I'm pretty sure that is the FAI logic (if I can use that term and FAI in the same sentence).

Afaik, the FAI signed some sort of third party deal to ensure the Aviva got all these kind of matches. Crazy stuff tbh.

KJY · 18-05-2012 07:51PM

ormond lad wrote: »

Munster Rugby U20 Squad
Niall Horan (Crescent Comprehensive College)
Brian Scott (UCC)
David Hartnett (PBC)
Gavin Ryan (St. Munchin’s College)
Cian O’ Donnell (UCC)
Max Abbott (PBC)
Will Foley (PBC)
Ultan Dillane (Tralee RFC)
Sean McCarthy (Rockwell College)
David O’ Connell (UCC/Old Christians RFC)
Jamie Kind (Dolphin RFC)
John Fitzgerald (PBC)
Darren Ryan (St. Munchin’s College)
Jack O’ Donoghue (Waterpark RFC)
Brian Haugh (Young Munster RFC)
Charlie O’ Regan (CBC)
Tom Kiersey (Waterpark RFC)
Darren Sweetnam (Bandon Grammar School)
Rory Scannell (PBC)
James McInerney (Garryowen FC)
Harry McNulty (Dublin University)
Alex Lynch (Rockwell College)
Seamus Glynn (PBC)
Conor Kearns (Dublin University)
Darragh McNamara (UCC)
Rob Jermyn (Rockwell College)
Munster U20 Management Team
Head Coach - Greig Oliver
Assistant Coaches - Steve Ford & Brendan O’Connor
Strength & Conditioning - Joe McGinley
Physiotherapist - Damien Mordan
Doctor - Dr Adrian Murphy
Video Analyst - Paul O’Brien
Kit Manager - Alan Hickey
Manager - Graham Burns
http://www.munsterrugby.ie/domestic/news/10498.php
Presume that Brendan O Connor the assistant coach is the cashel player

Good squad, hopefully they can do better at 20s than munster have done the past few years

Are Sweetnam and Keirsey the only out halves?

ormond lad · 18-05-2012 08:05PM

KJY wrote: »

Are Sweetnam and Keirsey the only out halves?

No, Scannell from PBC is also a 10

Amazotheamazing · 18-05-2012 08:22PM

What's Sweetnam like as a player? Can't see Cork being happy to give him up.

CatFromHue · 19-05-2012 12:41AM

One thing that has confused me about Munster is the two bases situation. For the most part this has no bearing on the fans so if Munster were to switch to having the players based in Limerick/Cork the whole time it would have little effect on them. The games could still be alternated between Thomond and Musgrave Park.

As in I don't understand why this is such a big problem.

Of course the players may not be too keen on being based in Cork or Limerick full time but unfortunately that's life. Certainly come contract renewal time it could be a point to get an increase.

Amazotheamazing · 19-05-2012 06:51PM

CatFromHue wrote: »

One thing that has confused me about Munster is the two bases situation. For the most part this has no bearing on the fans so if Munster were to switch to having the players based in Limerick/Cork the whole time it would have little effect on them. The games could still be alternated between Thomond and Musgrave Park.

As in I don't understand why this is such a big problem.

Of course the players may not be too keen on being based in Cork or Limerick full time but unfortunately that's life. Certainly come contract renewal time it could be a point to get an increase.

The only downside would be the clubs in the non-training city might lose out on some players but i'd still expect a decent number of players to commute regardless of where the training base is.

Munster seem content to wait until a motorway is built between Limerick and Cork before deciding, could be waiting a while....

bamboozle · 20-05-2012 11:37AM

ormond lad wrote: »

Keogh did all right with Shannon this season, used plenty of young players which along with the Shannon-Saints u19 all ireland win bodes well for the future

cant understand him being given another year, 12 months ago he was signing lots of players from other clubs and shannon were very poor throughout, saw them twice and couldnt believe how abject they were then again i think limerick & cork clubs are suffering badly from players moving abroad or to dublin for work.

Flincher · 20-05-2012 08:16PM

bamboozle wrote: »

cant understand him being given another year, 12 months ago he was signing lots of players from other clubs and shannon were very poor throughout, saw them twice and couldnt believe how abject they were then again i think limerick & cork clubs are suffering badly from players moving abroad or to dublin for work.

Agree. There's very little fight in that team. They are heavily reliant on the likes of Luke O'Dea and Richie Mullane to create stuff out of nothing. Case in point being their loss to Young Munster in Thomond. They scored 2 excellent tries and built up a lead.

In the second half, their pack was pushed around the park and Munsters walked them over the line to win it. As a Munsters man it was beautiful, but I can't imagine any Shannon supporters being too impressed, given the forward traditions of the club.

You're right about players moving, Off the top of my head Richie Lane, Barry O'Mahony, Evan Ryan are with Clontarf. David Toomey and Cian Aherne are with Lansdowne. Young Munster lost 2 players to emigration during the season as well.

whenever · 20-05-2012 09:29PM

CatFromHue wrote: »

One thing that has confused me about Munster is the two bases situation. For the most part this has no bearing on the fans so if Munster were to switch to having the players based in Limerick/Cork the whole time it would have little effect on them. The games could still be alternated between Thomond and Musgrave Park.

As in I don't understand why this is such a big problem.

Of course the players may not be too keen on being based in Cork or Limerick full time but unfortunately that's life. Certainly come contract renewal time it could be a point to get an increase.

Why would that be the case? It must be difficult to operate fitness and academy operations across two locations? How divisive would be the choice of Limerick with the main stadium and UL's strength and conditioning centre?

ormond lad · 20-05-2012 10:03PM

whenever wrote: »

Why would that be the case? It must be difficult to operate fitness and academy operations across two locations? How divisive would be the choice of Limerick with the main stadium and UL's strength and conditioning centre?

It would be pretty divisive. Cork is the bigger market for munster and growth and we cant move to base all the academy, fitness etc to Limerick.
I dont see what the problem of 2 bases is, it wasnt a problem when we were the best side in europe and won 2 european cups so why should it be changed now but if it were to be changed my opinion is that we should change to having 1 base in somewhere like Fermoy and this base could cover the needs of all munster sides from u17 youths/schools development squads to u18/19/20 provincial squads to the pro set up

ambid · 20-05-2012 10:57PM

ormond lad wrote: »

It would be pretty divisive. Cork is the bigger market for munster and growth and we cant move to base all the academy, fitness etc to Limerick.
I dont see what the problem of 2 bases is, it wasnt a problem when we were the best side in europe and won 2 european cups so why should it be changed now but if it were to be changed my opinion is that we should change to having 1 base in somewhere like Fermoy and this base could cover the needs of all munster sides from u17 youths/schools development squads to u18/19/20 provincial squads to the pro set up

I don't know much about the two bases issue, but I know Jim Williams is on record from years ago with his opinion that two bases was a big problem. McGahan stated again just a few weeks ago that it is a problem. Williams and Francis have also regularly raised the same point.

Anyone who wants to be best in a competitive sport needs to maximise everything in their favour. Munster seem to have problems with bi-location, poor links with schools, poor recruitment, poor fitness & conditioning, and poor back play. I'm no expert but these criticisms have been raised in the media and in this forum and, if some or all are true, then they can't hope to be the very best in their sport.

Sometimes great teams develop by freak of nature and that can obscure some weaknesses in an organisation. Bernard Jackman spoke today about how Leinster are champions not by accident but how every single aspect of their preparation is as professional as they can make it, and how they are constantly striving to improve every single aspect of their organisation. I've heard the same criticisms about Munster's organisation for many years from many knowledgeable sources, but I don't see much changing. Instead I see Munster's slow decline continuing, and probably gathering pace this year.

I'm not criticising Munster and I hate the provincial rubbish on this forum. I'm far from an expert on Munster rugby and I'm only repeating things said by people who know much more than I do. But if Munster have structural problems they really need the vision to correct them. I hope Munster don't just hope another great generation is going to arrive or a new coach will fix everything.

At the very least I'd hope a fundamental review is undertaken so these questions, which have been raised by Munster coaches for many years now, can be answered for once and for all.

ormond lad · 20-05-2012 11:19PM

ambid wrote: »

I don't know much about the two bases issue, but I know Jim Williams is on record from years ago with his opinion that two bases was a big problem. McGahan stated again just a few weeks ago that it is a problem. Williams and Francis have also regularly raised the same point.
Yes some players/management have complained about the 2 centres but it isnt really that big a deal. There is much more important issues to solve than the 2 training bases issue
Anyone who wants to be best in a competitive sport needs to maximise everything in their favour. Munster seem to have problems with bi-location, poor links with schools, poor recruitment, poor fitness & conditioning, and poor back play. I'm no expert but these criticisms have been raised in the media and in this forum and, if some or all are true, then they can't hope to be the very best in their sport.
The problems with the schools is as much if not more the schools fault. There was a great set up a few years ago where the best 15-18 year olds, youths and schools, trained together as 1 group but it was got rid of after 1 summer as the schools didnt like the set up.
WRT back play the coaching virtually everywhere from underage to adult rugby to pro rugby just is not good.
Sometimes great teams develop by freak of nature and that can obscure some weaknesses in an organisation. Bernard Jackman spoke today about how Leinster are champions not by accident but how every single aspect of their preparation is as professional as they can make it, and how they are constantly striving to improve every single aspect of their organisation. I've heard the same criticisms about Munster's organisation for many years from many knowledgeable sources, but I don't see much changing. Instead I see Munster's slow decline continuing, and probably gathering pace this year.
There is plenty of problems that will not be solved for quite a while. I dont see some of our problems being solved soon but i do see others that will. There is good signs ahead, we havent produced any backrows in recent years but the academy has signed a couple of backrows from what i hear
I'm not criticising Munster and I hate the provincial rubbish on this forum. I'm far from an expert on Munster rugby and I'm only repeating things said by people who know much more than I do. But if Munster have structural problems they really need the vision to correct them. I hope Munster don't just hope another great generation is going to arrive or a new coach will fix everything.
I know you are not criticising Munster, you actually are making some very valid points but in my view there seems to be big problems that will not be solved until we get a couple of total outsiders ala Penney involved in the amatuer and academy levels
At the very least I'd hope a fundamental review is undertaken so these questions, which have been raised by Munster coaches for many years now, can be answered for once and for all.

You would hope that Munster take a good hard look at everything from underage development to the top and what needs to be done to help the pro side but being honest i dont see many changes if any at all in many areas where we need changes

Amazotheamazing · 20-05-2012 11:29PM

ormond lad wrote: »

There is plenty of problems that will not be solved for quite a while. I dont see some of our problems being solved soon but i do see others that will. There is good signs ahead, we havent produced any backrows in recent years but the academy has signed a couple of backrows from what i hear

Tbf, more backrowers are starting to come through. POM was probably our forward of the season, and DOCv2.0, TOD and Butler all improved to one degree or another. Question marks over all of them still but they are coming through.

Teferi · 20-05-2012 11:31PM

Ronan had a pretty good season too until injury.

I wrote him off last year but I felt he took his game up a notch this season.

Amazotheamazing · 20-05-2012 11:39PM

Teferi wrote: »

Ronan had a pretty good season too until injury.

I wrote him off last year but I felt he took his game up a notch this season.

He did, and our season really started to creak without him, Saints game away being the only exception that comes to mind, but he's not one of the younger Academy guys.

The thing I like about Butler and POM is you can see they have the same aggression that guys like Foley had. I'm not so sure TOD and DOCv2.0 do.

Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

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