Children's Hospital on hold after planning refusal. New idea

ABP's rejection reads remarkably like an Aircraft accident investigation, they don't look to establish blame for what happened, just look at the facts and report accordingly.

The most damning and accurate comment they made was that the Children's hospital would be "an overdevelopment" of the area. That's polite speak for saying, too many people, too many cars and other vehicles, too much congestion, too little services around it to get people and things in and out, too intrusive on the skyscape, etc etc.

It wasn't just high rise, it was 16 floors, 70 something metres, which is almost the height of Liberty building, but on the top of the hills, so overpowering the skyline from places like O'Connell Street.

Now, and this is where you'll have to take my word for it. Not that many years ago, in a city much smaller than Dublin, the relevant authorities decided to build a new hospital to replace the very old and no longer fit for purpose buildings they'd been operating from for close on a century. Accordingly, a new hospital was indeed built, about 9 floors high, if memory serves, and it was a smart and good facility. However there was a problem, it was discovered before too long that it was one of the first UK buildings to suffer from Concrete cancer, which meant a massive problem. They dealt with it by building a newer hospital around the new one, but this time, based on operational experience, they built low level, then demolished the tower block, and rebuilt the final pieces they needed where that had been. What became clear was that the day to day operation of a hospital 9 floors high was a problem, so they didn't do the same again. Now, they're talking 16 floors here. Not clever in my book. Even more worrying is that the one I'm talking about had near enough the same number of beds as the new Mater, but was a fraction of the size.

Just been glancing over the ABP report, and looking for the real reasons for rejection. How about the shortfall in parking, the figure estimated for the NCH is that it will need about 2500 parking spaces, it has under 1000 in the present plan, so that's 1500 people a day that will either spend (waste) time searching for somewhere to abandon their vehicle, which will put massive pressure onto an area that's already under pressure. There are issues with public transport, and worries about access now that Metro North has been put on the long finger. All sorts of other issues, like congestion management, overshadowing.

It's clear that the Gov't were not expecting it to be rejected so solidly, I guess they were hoping for a yes with lots of conditions, but now, they have to find an acceptable way forward for a project that's already mired in controversy. Hopefully, not too many people were financially depending on this project starting any time soon, as they may be about to get a nasty shock.

This is for sure going to roll for a while!

bleg wrote: »

It's a pity it's going to delay the decision. A greenfield site would obviously be the best choice but that would involve building a huge new adult hospital to try to replace the big three and all the headaches that would bring.

Hence the not altogether tongue in cheek suggestion of Thornton Hall.. Site already landscaped and ready to go, already bought and paid for, water and other services already in or well on the way, dedicated access road off the old N2, no ruch hour congestion, no impact on city scapes, easy access from the M50, even at peak times, easy to set up transport to the place from Dublin, no restrictions on space for staff parking or visitor parking, no problems of the place becoming a default park and ride for city centre. Cheaper construction cos it won't need to be 16 floors high, much easier build as it's green field, and no basement that has to be waterproofed, the list just goes on. The additional costs of the Mater site are incredible, because of the limitations, and complications of a very cramped and difficult site. A green field even with an adult hospital could still come out cheaper, with the advantage of a brand new adult facility. That has to be worth looking at

Even if it meant a new adult hospital on the same site, is that so bad, given that the North East is going to need something like that before too long.

Forget Tallaght, it's already overcrowded space wise, fitting another hospital on that site would be a nightmare. Even gettting short term parking to make a delivery is a nightmare.