Breaking news in the IWC

drayme · 21-07-2011 07:23AM #1

Dave Meltzer has given Punk-Cena *****

Cena has had a five star match ladies and gents.

Lord TSC · 21-07-2011 07:47AM

Well deserved tbqh...

CMpunked · 21-07-2011 09:36AM

Fcuk meltzer. I dont need him to confirm something I already knew.
That's some breaking news! :P

gimmick · 21-07-2011 09:42AM

No surprises really. Had everything needed for the 5 snowflakes.

rossie1977 · 21-07-2011 10:03AM

first wwe/f match to achieve that honour since taker/hbk hiac way back in 1997

have to say a few matches since then have deserved 5 stars though

gimmick · 21-07-2011 10:04AM

The only others WWE since 1997, in my mind, which should have gotten the 5 stars is HBK Vs HHH last man standing at the Royal Rumble 2003 and Rock Austin WM17.

rossie1977 · 21-07-2011 10:07AM

gimmick wrote: »

The only others WWE since 1997, in my mind, which should have gotten the 5 stars is HBK Vs HHH last man standing at the Royal Rumble 2003 and Rock Austin WM17.

hbk vs taker at mania25 and triple threat at mania 20 were 5 stars imo

gimmick · 21-07-2011 10:13AM

I thought of those as well, but I wouldn't go all out for them.

There was something about the triple threat which seemed laboured and it was still more about HHH and HBK than Benoit. Great match and I love it, just not 5 stars for me.

HBK Taker again was brilliant, but it was more of a "challenge/special attraction" that a great blow off to a feud, therefore, for me, lacked an intensity which is needed for the 5 stars.

Vince135792003 · 21-07-2011 10:23AM

gimmick wrote: »

in my mind, which should have gotten the 5 stars is HBK Vs HHH last man standing at the Royal Rumble 2003 .

I was never a big fan of that match. I really loved their Summerslam match.

Dave Meltzers article on the match was enjoyable making paralells between Punk and Pillman.

As for star ratings, I do respect Meltzers opinion and have often used his ratings as a way of checking out old matches that I haven't seen from the past.

As regards modern day matches, everyone is entitled to their opinion and Meltzer is just giving his.

rovert · 21-07-2011 10:26AM

Credit: DVDR board

Only five WWF/E matches were rated as ***** by Meltzer:

Razor Ramon vs. Shawn Michaels, WrestleMania X
Bret Hart vs. Owen Hart, SummerSlam 1994
Bret Hart vs. Stone Cold Steve Austin, WrestleMania 13
Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker, In Your House 18: Badd Blood
John Cena vs. CM Punk, Money in the Bank 2011

If anyone's interested Wade Keller and James Caldwell gave Cena/Punk *****, Bryan Alvarez gave it ****3/4.

People rip into Dave for the Summerslam 1994 match (rightfully :pac:). He thought Owen and Bret having a dramatic Cage match when WWF banned blood was ***** worthy.

Cant wait to read the various meltdowns online on the various forums tonight.

MELTZER ISNT THE GOSPEL ARGH!!! etc :P

Vince135792003 wrote: »

I was never a big fan of that match.

Dave Meltzers article on the match was enjoyable making paralells between Punk and Pillman.

As for star ratings, I do respect Meltzers opinion and have often used his ratings as a way of checking out old matches that I haven't seen from the past.

As regards modern day matches, everyone is entitled to their opinion and Meltzer is just giving his.

Yeah it is just a reference point that's all.

Rjd2 · 21-07-2011 10:31AM

Wait, Drayme isn't Rovert?????:eek::o:eek

:p

rovert · 21-07-2011 10:36AM

Rjd2 wrote: »

Wait, Drayme isn't Rovert?????:eek::o:eek:p

Im Laura Samson

CMpunked · 21-07-2011 10:50AM

Holy F***!

jaykhunter · 21-07-2011 10:53AM

As much as i loved the MITB main-event, if that's 5* then surely Rock/Hogan @ WMX8 is also 5 stars. Or is it because the crowd were smarking out rather than a nostalgia divide? Like it was a fantastic emotional match - one of the best ever, but c'mon it had a lot of sloppy points/obvious having a chat moments; what i mean is that 5* means it has absolutely no room for improvement! Also Cena/RVD i'd give the same rating.

Cherry_Cola · 21-07-2011 11:00AM

I think this thread is more about the Rovert reveal than the match :pac:

Vince135792003 · 21-07-2011 11:07AM

jaykhunter wrote: »

As much as i loved the MITB main-event, if that's 5* then surely Rock/Hogan @ WMX8 is also 5 stars. .

The Cena/Punk match wasn't perfect in terms of hitting all the moves but there were alot more things that looked weak in the Hogan/Rock match. Plus it was obviously not as athletic, the build up was hit and miss and it didn't have the ending I wanted to see. I still like the match but I like it less each time I watch it.

I don't do ratings but the Punk/Cena match was great because of the build up and storyline, the crowd and the way they ended the match.

The match itself was a long, compelling one that wasn't move for move perfect but it didn't take away my enjoyment at all from it, although I can see why it might for others.

The only thing that took away my enjoyment was the commentary. Jerry Lawler is the only 1 I can tolerate.

grames_bond · 21-07-2011 11:35AM

He's BAAAAAAACK!! :eek:

rossie1977 · 21-07-2011 11:50AM

jaykhunter wrote: »

As much as i loved the MITB main-event, if that's 5* then surely Rock/Hogan @ WMX8 is also 5 stars. Or is it because the crowd were smarking out rather than a nostalgia divide? Like it was a fantastic emotional match - one of the best ever, but c'mon it had a lot of sloppy points/obvious having a chat moments; what i mean is that 5* means it has absolutely no room for improvement! Also Cena/RVD i'd give the same rating.

the amount of subplots and themes leading into punk and cena made it better overall (punks last night, cena getting fired, vinces involvement), also it was for the title, a title we have been told is pretty much meaningless last couple of years, but the punk and cena match made it meaningful and more for that one night, there was also the home town factor coupled with the fact that p]nk made cenas hometown turn on him week previous, there was the underdog factor, the common man going in against the corporate juggernaut

in terms of overall storyline, build and indeed in-ring cena and punk is far superior to either rock/hogan or cena/rvd, at least for me anyway

i don't agree either that if a match is voted 5 stars that means there is no room for improvement, no match is perfect, in fact the perfect match will never happen

2ndcoming · 21-07-2011 11:53AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNgxyL5zEAk

thebostoncrab · 21-07-2011 11:55AM

What gives this match over other debateable efforts like Hogan/Rock or Taker/HBK I is that noone knew before how the match would end. The others I enjoyed but honestly you knew how it would end, thus taking a small bit away from them.

Benoit/Angle from Royal Rumble however deserved the full five stars.

Diabhal Beag · 21-07-2011 12:11PM

Glad Meltzer has seen sense.

WELCOME BACK ROVEY!!!!!!!!!!!!

GTR63 · 21-07-2011 12:24PM

I genuinely thought that Smackdowns MITB match was the best match on the show it didn't have the heat of the Main Event but the Corre couldn't even get the crickets excited.

flahavaj · 21-07-2011 12:55PM

CM Punk vs John Cena = ****1/4

Drayme unmasking to reveal rovert = *****. Worked the audience beautifully and timed the big pay off to perfection.

Bounty Hunter · 21-07-2011 01:26PM

Punk/Cena does equal 5* for me but I can understand why it wont for others. Some think 5*'s = perfect or 100% but even if you think in those terms its not like you see 4 and 4/5* matches for example so you gotta think that 5* matches are usually rounded up to 5*

There were some non perfect aspects of the match from a purely wrestling/athletic standpoint but from a PW point of view it was perfrect imo because as many said at the time it is an example of why we are all PW fans. It was one of those moments we wait for and keep watching in the hope of. Professional Wrestling is far more than just what happens in the ring and that match had everything else from the awesome storyline and antics of CM Punk to the awesome crowd or the suggested swerves (MITB/Screwjob) which kept us on the edge of our seats throughout.

starviewadams · 21-07-2011 02:06PM

Metzler's a tool,as is that Maffew guy who does Botchomania.

Have been ****loads of 5star matches since 97,the fact that Metzler thinks that there haven't been confirms his tooldom.

Off the top of my head I'd call these 5 stars:

HHH v Rock-Backlash 2000
Rock v Austin-Mania-17
Angle v Austin-Unforgiven 01
Rock v Hogan-Mania 18
HHH v HBK- Summerslam 02
Rock v Brock- Summerslam 02
Edge/Mysterio v Chavo/Eddie v Angle/Benoit -No Mercy 02
Benoit v Angle -Royal Rumble 03

rossie1977 · 21-07-2011 02:09PM

starviewadams wrote: »

Metzler's a tool,as is that Maffew guy who does Botchomania.

Have been ****loads of 5star matches since 97,the fact that Metzler thinks that there haven't been confirms his tooldom.

Off the top of my head I'd call these 5 stars:

HHH v Rock-Backlash 2000
Rock v Austin-Mania-17
Angle v Austin-Unforgiven 01
Rock v Hogan-Mania 18
HHH v HBK- Summerslam 02
Rock v Brock- Summerslam 02
Edge/Mysterio v Chavo/Eddie v Angle/Benoit -No Mercy 02
Benoit v Angle -Royal Rumble 03

really?? i was ringside at summerslam 2002 and while the crowd reaction was great for that brock and rock match, hbk and hhh was match of the night followed by angle and mysterio

rovert · 21-07-2011 02:12PM

starviewadams wrote: »

Metzler's a tool,as is that Maffew guy who does Botchomania.

Who else do you want to randomly call out? Scott Keith he is a bit of a dick.

starviewadams · 21-07-2011 02:19PM

rossie1977 wrote: »

really?? i was ringside at summerslam 2002 and while the crowd reaction was great for that brock and rock match, hbk and hhh was match of the night followed by angle and mysterio

I thought the whole build up to it and the match itself had an almost real sport feel to it,which put it over the top for me anyways.

gimmick · 21-07-2011 02:24PM

As mentioned, the who 5 star thing is completely down to the opinion of the watcher.

For example, the Samoa Joe Vs Brian Danielson match from ROH Fight Of The Century in 2006 to me is an easy call. 5 all the way. Pro wrestling perfection.

On the other side of it Samoa Joe Vs Kenta Kobashi has been called a 5 star effort, and while I enjoyed it immensely, it was not a 5 star match.

It depends on your tastes and how you view a storyline/angle.

The only people who are wrong are those who would put a New Jack match as a 5 star. Which we all know is impossible.

GTR63 · 21-07-2011 02:24PM

starviewadams wrote: »

Metzler's a tool,as is that Maffew guy who does Botchomania.

Have been ****loads of 5star matches since 97,the fact that Metzler thinks that there haven't been confirms his tooldom.

Off the top of my head I'd call these 5 stars:

HHH v Rock-Backlash 2000
Rock v Austin-Mania-17
Angle v Austin-Unforgiven 01
Rock v Hogan-Mania 18
HHH v HBK- Summerslam 02
Rock v Brock- Summerslam 02
Edge/Mysterio v Chavo/Eddie v Angle/Benoit -No Mercy 02
Benoit v Angle -Royal Rumble 03

tbh starvie who cares who he gives 5* matches to Meltzer is just a guy who writes for dirtsheets its not as if his opinion matters.

Lord TSC · 21-07-2011 02:25PM

As I see it, I guess the star rating depends on if you add up all the positives, hit the max of five stars, and THEN discuss the negatives in which case you subtract from the rating. For me though, weighing up the pros and cons at the same time, the pros WAY out weight the cons and the cons just dont take away enough to warrent anything less than five stars...

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