Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 23-05-2011 08:51PM

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

While that's true, we badly need some homegrown backrowers. Lot of guys with potential but very few of them delivering on it yet.

Is it even a huge issue if none of them manage to fulfill their potential? If worst comes to worst we can sign NIQ and rob IQ backrows off the other provinces. Leinster aren't doing too badly for themselves even though they have/have had a lot of trouble producing quality frontrows, locks and scrumhalves.

GerM · 23-05-2011 08:54PM

Munster have the talent there. They have young players on the books that are more than capable of being HEC starters. The issue for them is the management of their introduction to the side. In previous seasons, Sherry or Barnes could be eased in alongside the older heads and over the course of a year or two and could fairly seamlessly become first choice players. However, due to the delay in bringing a sufficient number of them through in recent years they're facing the prospect of having to bring through 4 or 5 in a short period alongside a few new NIQ players. It's not beyond comprehension that in the next 18 months they could have to enter a big game with youngsters at hooker, openside, scrum half, centre and wing and with 5 NIQ players on the pitch also. They'll need to use the WC matches to give some significant game time to those who will be taking a more prominent role in the future. The players are there though.

finatron · 23-05-2011 09:07PM

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

If worst comes to worst we can sign NIQ and rob IQ backrows off the other provinces.

BJ Botha should really help with scurm and i would love too see a world class center join after the world cup

Amazotheamazing · 23-05-2011 09:08PM

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Is it even a huge issue if none of them manage to fulfill their potential? If worst comes to worst we can sign NIQ and rob IQ backrows off the other provinces. Leinster aren't doing too badly for themselves even though they have/have had a lot of trouble producing quality frontrows, locks and scrumhalves.

I think it's a massive problem tbh. It's all well and good saying we can buy in players but that doesn't answer why we can't produce them anymore. We used to produce high quality backrowers.

pajunior · 23-05-2011 09:15PM

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I think it's a massive problem tbh. It's all well and good saying we can buy in players but that doesn't answer why we can't produce them anymore. We used to produce high quality backrowers.

I was think about this the other day. 10 years ago everyone was saying how amazing Ireland are at producing locks we had POC, DOC, Cullen, Bob Casey, MOK, MOD, Trevor Brennan and a couple of others that don't come to mind all at more or less the same time. For years these guys had all the Irish positions to themselves and it was hard for youngsters to get a look in and hence we haven't seen any top young locks in a while.

Something similar is happening to Munster at the back row and may happen to Leinster in a couple of years in their back row.

When the old guard clear out you might see a drop in performance but as guys get more game time and more youngsters get more looks the standard will get back up.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 23-05-2011 09:43PM

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I think it's a massive problem tbh. It's all well and good saying we can buy in players but that doesn't answer why we can't produce them anymore. We used to produce high quality backrowers.

Well it is a problem but, it won't stop us winning trophies.

We have some backrows with loads of potential, all we need is a coaching staff who can help them realise it. One of the main issues is the size of the young forwards we have coming through; Sherry is the only forward under 24 who looks like he is able to deal with the physicality of the HC. Its also unfair that we are comparing our lads to physical freaks like Ruddock (who is a product of the Welsh system).

POM would, probably, be involved in matchday squads if he didn't suffer a neck injury earlier in the year. TOD hasn't been given a chance to show that he is a better player than Ronan.

Amazotheamazing · 23-05-2011 10:21PM

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Well it is a problem but, it won't stop us winning trophies.

We have some backrows with loads of potential, all we need is a coaching staff who can help them realise it. One of the main issues is the size of the young forwards we have coming through; Sherry is the only forward under 24 who looks like he is able to deal with the physicality of the HC. Its also unfair that we are comparing our lads to physical freaks like Ruddock (who is a product of the Welsh system).

POM would, probably, be involved in matchday squads if he didn't suffer a neck injury earlier in the year. TOD hasn't been given a chance to show that he is a better player than Ronan.

I disagree tbh, you can't buy in your entire backrow, which is what we're facing into if guys like POM don't step up. No team with a weak backrow has won a HEC in the last decade.

I'm reasonably hopeful that the AIL props we've been looking at can do the business, I think we're covered in the second row and scrumhalves. We have cover at 10 with Keatley coming in. We need a 12 and ideally we'd find another 13 too, imo. (Barnes could be the guy)

24-05-2011 01:47AM

LET THEM PLAY

touts · 24-05-2011 10:12AM

Gavin Henson is available again. He has lost all his talent and no opposition fears him any more so he'll be a perfect fit with our other centres.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/henson-to-leave-toulon-2655412.html

Amazotheamazing · 24-05-2011 10:33AM

Deleted User wrote: »

LET THEM PLAY

Not quite as easy as that. No amount of games will compensate for the lack of power POM and Butler currently have.

thomond2006 · 24-05-2011 10:41AM

touts wrote: »

Gavin Henson is available again. He has lost all his talent and no opposition fears him any more so he'll be a perfect fit with our other centres.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/henson-to-leave-toulon-2655412.html

You're kidding right?!

profitius · 24-05-2011 10:56AM

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Not quite as easy as that. No amount of games will compensate for the lack of power POM and Butler currently have.

POM has the power from what I've seen. He always makes ground with players hanging off him. He does need to put on more weight though. I'm not sure about Butler.

The new Munster fitness coach could have a big impact on things. At the moment there are too many players who are underweight.

touts · 24-05-2011 11:33AM

thomond2006 wrote: »

You're kidding right?!

I wish I was. But the McGahanites will probably tell you their man can make Henson into the greatest player in the history of the game just as he will turned Munster into the most feared team in European rugby. Have faith!

irishbucsfan · 24-05-2011 11:37AM

I wouldn't put any money on it, but I could forsee a situation where Henson joins Munster on a pay-per-play contract then gets his head sorted by POC and goes on to become a Munster legend, helping to develop young Scott Deasy (aka Heaslip with Rocky) all ending with Henson being celebrated as one of the best Munster players of all time and being given the freedom of Cork and Limerick.

1000-1, taking bets now.

TheHighRoad · 24-05-2011 11:43AM

I honestly don't see whats so crazy about Henson joining Munster. If you add a provision in his contract that he if he misses training, is caught drinking alcohol or causing disruptions to the team enviroment that his contract will be terminated without severance pay then it may be worth a gamble. O'Connell and co. could really get his head together. Henson's problems have always been off the field, hes still capable of being the world class centre that he was and you could get him for a very cheap right now. I'd say add a stipulation and sign him. If hes caught mucking about once tell him to ship off.

24-05-2011 11:43AM

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Not quite as easy as that. No amount of games will compensate for the lack of power POM and Butler currently have.

It genuinely is as easy as letting them play.

Regardless if they lack strength, or height, or experience, these guys are the players who are going to have to bring Munster back with a bang, and leaving them warming benches, or cleaning boots while the older guys play out their twilight years would be a huge mistake.

At what stage will the managers get the bit between the teeth and figure out it is time to get these guys playing? Quinlan is gone, others will follow, leaving deep gaps in the team. It couldn't be more essential to get these guys playing, get them involved and showcasing themselves, putting their hands up for inclusion on merit, not just because the guy they're replacing is 34.

All the chat will come to nothing, the only thing we can do to test these guys is to let them play. It will work for some, and it won't work for others, but that's life!

thomond2006 · 24-05-2011 12:04PM

TheHighRoad wrote: »

I honestly don't see whats so crazy about Henson joining Munster. If you add a provision in his contract that he if he misses training, is caught drinking alcohol or causing disruptions to the team enviroment that his contract will be terminated without severance pay then it may be worth a gamble. O'Connell and co. could really get his head together. Henson's problems have always been off the field, hes still capable of being the world class centre that he was and you could get him for a very cheap right now. I'd say add a stipulation and sign him. If hes caught mucking about once tell him to ship off.

You forget the fact that he's an average player whose 'talents' have been completely blown out of proportion. This move will never happen.

Your point on the contract is well made though.

onlyrocknroll · 24-05-2011 12:14PM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I wouldn't put any money on it, but I could forsee a situation where Henson joins Munster on a pay-per-play contract then gets his head sorted by POC and goes on to become a Munster legend, helping to develop young Scott Deasy (aka Heaslip with Rocky) all ending with Henson being celebrated as one of the best Munster players of all time and being given the freedom of Cork and Limerick.

1000-1, taking bets now.

Make it 1000000-1 and I might take it.

PhatPiggins · 24-05-2011 12:18PM

thomond2006 wrote: »

You forget the fact that he's an average player whose 'talents' have been completely blown out of proportion.

Your point on the contract is well made though.

He's not average by any stretch of the imagination and he's streets ahead of what we have now. I still wouldn't sign him though.

He's a basket case and on the mental side of it he's gone. No point in being talented if you don't care anymore.

castie · 24-05-2011 12:28PM

Sure if he pulls some of his crap around Limerick the locals will deal with him!

That should deter him

Stev_o · 24-05-2011 12:30PM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

He's not average by any stretch of the imagination and he's streets ahead of what we have now. I still wouldn't sign him though.

He's a basket case and on the mental side of it he's gone. No point in being talented if you don't care anymore.

When was his last good game though? Late 2004? The guy is fairly muck tbh. All the talent none of the desire.

PhatPiggins · 24-05-2011 03:50PM

Stev_o wrote: »

When was his last good game though? Late 2004? The guy is fairly muck tbh. All the talent none of the desire.

No offense but thats not true. He was instrumental in both of Wales recent Grand slams. He was creator in chief in 05 and was their defensive lynch pin in 08.

He is very hateable and he is/was over hyped but I think a lot of punters say he's gash just because they can't stand him.

Amazotheamazing · 24-05-2011 05:41PM

If Munster could get Henson's head right i'd love to see him here. Actually the family ethos of any of the Irish provinces would suit him, imo. In general, the provinces take good care of the players and keep the outside pressures off them.

PhatPiggins · 24-05-2011 11:35PM

What would people think about Munster giving Leinster a guard of honour onto the pitch on Saturday?

I think it would be appropriate + it would fire the Munster lads up even more

Amazotheamazing · 24-05-2011 11:44PM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

What would people think about Munster giving Leinster a guard of honour onto the pitch on Saturday?

I think it would be appropriate + it would fire the Munster lads up even more

It wouldn't bother me but I don't see that it's necessary.

Teferi · 25-05-2011 01:16AM

Ah you can do that as we walk off the pitch with the two trophies lads

phog · 25-05-2011 06:33AM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

What would people think about Munster giving Leinster a guard of honour onto the pitch on Saturday?

I think it would be appropriate + it would fire the Munster lads up even more

Wouldn't bother me but I dont think it'll happen, this a ML final and they orgainse it, both teams will walk onto the field at the same time, side by side, at least that's what happened at the semis.

Judgement Day · 25-05-2011 08:08AM

Would some body please start the match thread! I'm really looking forward to this one and can't wait to see the European champions handed their ass on a platter.

Munster by more than 7 @ 11/4 looks tempting. Fatigue has to kick in at Leinster soon.

onlyrocknroll · 25-05-2011 08:15AM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

What would people think about Munster giving Leinster a guard of honour onto the pitch on Saturday?

I think it would be appropriate + it would fire the Munster lads up even more

I'd be against that, not out of begrudgery or anything but it would be too deferential a way to begin a game of rugby. It is after all a physical and confrontational game.

PhatPiggins · 25-05-2011 08:33AM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Would some body please start the match thread! I'm really looking forward to this one and can't wait to see the European champions handed their ass on a platter.

Munster by more than 7 @ 11/4 looks tempting. Fatigue has to kick in at Leinster soon.

For our sakes you'd really hope so but their squad is so strong they could rest BOD,Healy,Ross,SOB,Readan and still have realictic expectations of beating us.

Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

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