[Feedback wanted] Changes to Airsoft adverts

Steve · 20-04-2011 10:27pm #1

Hi Folks,

We're thinking of making some changes to the adverts forum and I'd like your thoughts on it.

The main proposed change is going to be to restrict posting there to approved users. By that I mean users who meet a minimum criteria.

The minimum requirements we're proposing will be to have been a member of boards for at least a month and to have had a minimum 'x' number of posts in the Airsoft category.

We have had to deal with an unprecedented number of dupe accounts lately and this the main reason for having to suggest going this way. There is also an issue of some underage users that needs to be addressed.

Your thoughts, questions, criticism and suggestions as always are welcome.

Puding · 20-04-2011 10:33pm

i see no problem with what your proposing, it is the way adverts normally work on other forums as well

it is a little unfair on a few people who do not post and may want to sell something but the number of dodge accounts it would cut out is far higher so the benefit would defiantly out-way the negative on this one

just my 2 cents

richieffff · 20-04-2011 10:34pm

I'd be in favor of a minimum post requirement so long as its not too high, somewhere around the 50 post mark as I think this would be a fairly reachable amount of posts. If it were much higher there could be a lot of "spam" posts from people only looking to buy or sell something.

DeBurca · 20-04-2011 10:42pm

Sounds like a good idea in principle and I assume that you mean 1 Month and X number of posts before they can start a thread in the adverts section as opposed to answering or making an offer to an Add
But if people have to have X number of posts then I think that there will be a lot of stuff and nonsense posted just to boost peoples post count

Steve · 20-04-2011 10:44pm

Yeah, was thinking of somewhere between 10 and 50 posts to qualify. From the mods point of view, more is better but if you (and I) think back to when we first joined, it seemed like an age before we got to 50

Steve · 20-04-2011 10:48pm

DeBurca wrote: »

Sounds like a good idea in principle and I assume that you mean 1 Month and X number of posts before they can start a thread in the adverts section as opposed to answering or making an offer to an Add
But if people have to have X number of posts then I think that there will be a lot of stuff and nonsense posted just to boost peoples post count

No, I was thinking 'x' posts before they get access to post anything there. It'll be the mods job to determine if they have just posted meaningless crap in order to qualify, that won't be allowed.

Firekitten · 20-04-2011 11:02pm

A lot of sites use this method. Arnies in the uk uses 100 posts minimum before sales is even Visible, nevermind postable. And that doesnt seem to aquire much random crap to qualify...

Granted, its a theory now, rather than a solution, but I think it will be good.

Decoy · 20-04-2011 11:23pm

I think this would benefit the user population as a whole as it would cut out a lot of the cráp that has been happening of late. The obvious criteria to use is post count but even that isn't perfect. The post count has to be high enough to ensure they are a genuine boards user but no so high as to deter people from using the section. I see 50 as being a bit low to allow users to post, maybe 50 just to be able to view the ads section. 100 is probably too high, 75 in the middle seems about right to have the right to post ads.

Without wishing to over-complicate the process unnecessarily another possible notion would be to have separate FOR SALE and WANTED sections with users able to post wanted ads with a lower post count with for sale ads needing a higher count to post??

Gray · 21-04-2011 12:42am

I think having to have been a member for a certain length of time would be a better option as this would stop people setting up dup accounts, some of us have low post counts 10 years membership & less than 200 posts:o

Stercus Accidit · 21-04-2011 12:51am

There should also be a mechanism for posting requests to gain permission with an alternative vouching method. Not everyone wants to spend time racking up a post count or on forums, but if a member they know in the real world with say X amount of posts could vouch for them, other wise you get spam and/or deals through 3rd parties which could cause trouble.

cdev · 21-04-2011 1:36am

Stercus Accidit wrote: »

There should also be a mechanism for posting requests to gain permission with an alternative vouching method. Not everyone wants to spend time racking up a post count or on forums, but if a member they know in the real world with say X amount of posts could vouch for them, other wise you get spam and/or deals through 3rd parties which could cause trouble.

+1 to that suggestion. I don't post much on boards. But I've previously bought a few things from Airsoft Adverts and asked a few questions in the retailer's threads. I'd hate to have to start posting stupid questions (which I'd normally find answers to with a simple thread search). I'd happily supply mods with paypal receipts for online purchases I've completed with reputable Irish airsoft retailers or any other measures deemed necessary to prove I'm not a messer. I'd rather avoid cluttering up the Airsoft forums with lame comments and previously answered questions to rack up a post count of 50 or 100

I appreciate that you are possibly looking for a more automated way of controlling access to adverts though.

MagicIRL · 21-04-2011 9:26am

It should also cut down on the amount threads being spammed up there daily.

Is there any method to restrict users to 1 open/active thread per time on the Adverts section? To stop multiple threads for the same item or multiple threads for multiple items from 1 user?

Firekitten · 21-04-2011 10:37am

There needs to be a strict enforcement of the rules in Adverts too. I'm sure we all remember the days of the Lemming... and how tightly the ship was ran. Jokes aside, This is financial matters at the end of the day. Money is changing hands. We have to keep it absolutely spotless...

Steve · 21-04-2011 9:14pm

Gray wrote: »

I think having to have been a member for a certain length of time would be a better option as this would stop people setting up dup accounts, some of us have low post counts 10 years membership & less than 200 posts:o

Entry will be personally vetted by the mods so we can make exceptions where it's justified. In your and similar cases, length of membership would certainly be taken into account.

Stercus Accidit wrote: »

There should also be a mechanism for posting requests to gain permission with an alternative vouching method. Not everyone wants to spend time racking up a post count or on forums, but if a member they know in the real world with say X amount of posts could vouch for them, other wise you get spam and/or deals through 3rd parties which could cause trouble.

Interesting idea. Personally, I'd agree provided that the voucher also took responsibility for the vouchee.
i.e. if the vouched-for person did something bannable then whoever vouched for them would also be sanctioned. It would have to be that way to ensure vouching for someone is not done lightly. We'd also have to define somewhat at what point the vouched for person becomes a member in their own right - it wouldn't be fair to make the aforementioned caveat last indefinitely.

Firekitten wrote: »

There needs to be a strict enforcement of the rules in Adverts too. I'm sure we all remember the days of the Lemming... and how tightly the ship was ran. Jokes aside, This is financial matters at the end of the day. Money is changing hands. We have to keep it absolutely spotless...

I disagree there - the old school adverts moderation had a time and place in boards history but it's no longer the case. I know how the old way worked and what the flaws were, I was there on adverts.ie when Lemming was and I too followed the 'ban from orbit' approach that was in place then. It atually ended up causing more resentment and problems than it solved and the new approach imo is accomodating a lot more useds and not making them feel unwelcome because they get a ban for the simplest mistake.

As far as I'm concerned, and I agree that peoples hard earned wodge and kit are at stake here, the cardinal rule will be honesty. Anyone found to be dishonest in any way will be booted out in due course.
That includes stuff like misrepresenting what they are selling, attempting to deal off thread, wasting peoples time after agreeing to meet somewhere etc..

Gray · 21-04-2011 9:31pm

It might be helpfull to have 2 entry levels to adverts, a lower one to reply to threads & a higher one to start threads.

This could work as new users would be mainly looking to buy kit as they are just starting; where as people looking to sell kit would have been around a while even if they dont have a high post count.

Steve · 21-04-2011 9:40pm

Good idea Gray but the current available framework can only support access or not so we'll have to work within that.

Arkslippy · 23-04-2011 1:07am

Another suggestion.

Stop people starting threads on adverts called "clearout" and "a few bits and bobs" ect. Lots of threads with same or similar names is annoying

Decoy · 23-04-2011 3:09pm

Good suggestion, there are too many vague/generic titles in the adverts section. The title should specify exactly what is for sale/wanted.

In the same vein, if a user has multiple items to sell they should each have their own thread, too many multi-item sales go to several pages and it's a nightmare to keep track of what offers have been made/accepted.

Steve · 23-04-2011 5:48pm

I've also got a rules revamp on the back burner, the above two issues are on the list

.

TheDoc · 24-04-2011 9:10pm

Great idea. Tbh I'm sick of dealing with time wasters and mongs. For every one good dealing there is five terrible ones.

I'm not dealing with adverts anymore but will keep an eye to see how things changes things

Kwaska · 24-04-2011 10:59pm

Steve wrote: »

...The minimum requirements we're proposing will be to have been a member of boards for at least a month and to have had a minimum 'x' number of posts in the Airsoft category...

I don't think it is a good idea.
For example I want to buy something what can be bought only here. I'm new to this forum and there is a chance for me to buy something what I was looking for last 3 months.
Now I have to wrote "x" posts somewhere here just to post here. People will write anything just to boost post count.
Some people are shy or don't like to post, some of them have problems with writing in here. I think this forum will be more inaccessible for them.

andy_g · 24-04-2011 11:54pm

Kwaska wrote: »

I don't think it is a good idea.
For example I want to buy something what can be bought only here. I'm new to this forum and there is a chance for me to buy something what I was looking for last 3 months.
Now I have to wrote "x" posts somewhere here just to post here. People will write anything just to boost post count.
Some people are shy or don't like to post, some of them have problems with writing in here. I think this forum will be more inaccessible for them.

Not really as the pro's out weigh the cons on this one.

Your a member over a year on boards.ie so we would look at previous posts as in have they been spam and the likes. The pro's: Cuts down on the amount of re-reg accounts to circumvent current/excisting adverts bans.

As for people posting crap to boost their post count will have their post count reset. (not too sure on this yet but works elsewhere on boards.) Thats just some of the ideas.

Steve · 25-04-2011 8:23pm

As Andy said, the membership time will be more important in this - the minimum post count will enable us to check out anyone we think may be dodgy but at the end of the day it'll be down to common sense.

We're not going to try and restrict the regulars here, just cut out some on the known spanners and make it a bit harder for new accounts that we haven't a clue about to potentially rip off anyone in the community.

Case in point - say we decided on 100 posts as the guideline:

Kwaska wrote: »

Some people are shy or don't like to post, some of them have problems with writing in here. I think this forum will be more inaccessible for them.

I just ran what checks are available to me on your account and would have no problem giving access even though you didn't meet the minimum. However, if the checks had linked you to anyone that was previously banned or if they were in any way inconclusive (hard to explain without giving away mod secrets) then I would have denied it. From the mods point of view, the more posts you have here, the better.

Kwaska · 25-04-2011 9:33pm

Steve wrote: »

However, if the checks had linked you to anyone that was previously banned or if they were in any way inconclusive (hard to explain without giving away mod secrets) then I would have denied it.

I know much more mod secrets than you think

I'm mod on another vb forum where we have 50k users.

Steve · 25-04-2011 9:40pm

Kwaska wrote: »

I know much more mod secrets than you think
I'm mod on another vb forum where we have 50k users.

Boards is far from a standard vB Forum at this point, there's a lot of custom stuff in the backend that gives us a bit more to go on.

We've about 400k users here at present.

Decoy · 25-04-2011 10:37pm

Question: If we are looking at possibly restricting access to the adverts area based on length of membership and/or the standing of an individual member would it not then also make sense to remove that access if a user loses their good standing e.g. by receiving negative feedback multiple times??

J.D.R · 26-04-2011 11:40am

Steve wrote: »

Boards is far from a standard vB Forum at this point, there's a lot of custom stuff in the backend that gives us a bit more to go on.

We've about 400k users here at present.

It's not a competition lads :P

But, I think this is a great idea, and will really cut down on the junk posts in the adverts

TheDoc · 26-04-2011 3:18pm

Decoy wrote: »

Question: If we are looking at possibly restricting access to the adverts area based on length of membership and/or the standing of an individual member would it not then also make sense to remove that access if a user loses their good standing e.g. by receiving negative feedback multiple times??

How do you find out the actual " negative feedback" is genuine.

I've had instances where people would have a negative experience of something I sold them,. because they made a mess of it or using it.

I'll never forget the G36c I sold few years back to a guy who came back to the house going mad cause the gun shat itself, after he horsed loads of yellow BB's through it.

Decoy · 26-04-2011 3:33pm

TheDoc wrote:

How do you find out the actual " negative feedback" is genuine.

That would be a judgement call by the mods responsible for airsoft adverts. One negative feedback is an opinion, 2-3 is a trend, any more than that you can almost take it as fact but it would still be up to the mods to interpret what has been posted.

ricka · 27-04-2011 8:02pm

Maybe another reason to make the changes Steve's looking at.

The M4 Stubby robbed from MIA in February and on crimecall last night...

Where was it sold................... according to the perpetrator who gave himself up shortly after crimecall..................our very own........... Airsoft Adverts!

1man3letters · 27-04-2011 8:54pm

ricka wrote: »

Maybe another reason to make the changes Steve's looking at.

The M4 Stubby robbed from MIA in February and on crimecall last night...

Where was it sold................... according to the perpetrator who gave himself up shortly after crimecall..................our very own........... Airsoft Adverts!

wered ya get that info from??
so if its been bought,someone just spent there cash on evidence, 4shame

[Feedback wanted] Changes to Airsoft adverts

Should Adverts have restricted access? 57 votes

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