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Sabbath Mode?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,433 ✭✭✭witchgirl26


    Coz there are no Jewish people at all in Ireland or the UK, that might want to use that mode. Completely forgot that.

    At least I'm respecting that while I don't believe something, I'm not going to call someone else's belief systems irrational or fantastical. Because at the end of the day, that's not up to me to judge. You can answer a question about the cooker without descending into slagging off a religion. And I say that as someone who is not religious in any way at all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 28,232 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Mate, you started off by telling us that you didn't even know what religion was involved, and six hours later you've made an exhaustive study of the religion concerned, and formed extremely trenchant views about the "religious logic" underpinning its observances, that you're apparently now completely conversant with?

    I'm impressed by the zeal of your faith, but sceptical that it is rationally defensible or supported by much in the way of research.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 54,379 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    I'm not going to call someone else's belief systems irrational or fantastical.

    surely a religious belief system is, almost by definition, irrational and fantastical?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,433 ✭✭✭witchgirl26


    You may think that but it could be really offensive to someone who holds those beliefs to call it that. Doesn't hurt me not to call it that. I might not agree with them but doesn't mean I need to insult them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 28,232 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Only if you have some very unusual definition of "religion" that you're not sharing with the rest of us. There's nothing in the commonly-used definitions of "religion" that require religion to be either irrational or fantastical.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,205 ✭✭✭deezell


    There's nothing that prevents a religion having irrational or fantastical belief structures either, they evolve them over time as a distraction, and a measure to control their victims behaviours.

    As very small kids some of us would query religious vocabulary and innocently ask the nuns what unknown words in prayers and hymns meant. What was this 'virgin' that Mary was. If we were told she was made of smoke inside, we'd have believed it. It was all magic after all. Someone asked the meaning of 'conceived (without sin)' in the hymn. The answer was that Mary didn't know any men. Except poor old Joe, but she didn't 'know' him either. Mad stuff when you're six or seven, and with much more to follow and swallow as the years went by. Only the children and gullible were innocent believers though, the masters of these religious arts were as guilty as sin, to use a popular expression of that era.

    You need military equipment nowadays to impose religious practice it seems. Nuns with guns in Iran, or maybe they're blokes under the burkas. In the more moderate west, with fridgligion, it's just a software option, which is so of our time.

    Can you receive a sacrament (sister, sister, what's a 'sacrament'?) over the phone these days? Like confessing your sins, or maybe 'making' your confirmation. What was that about?, apart from a cash cow and a first pair of long trousers for some? We'd had jeans sent from England by aunties since we were small, but some rural lads were in shorts until confirmation day. Held only every three years in the sticks, I can recall walking down to the church with my best friend at the time, he was six months shy of thirteen, and a strong hulk of a lad. He'd stop every few yards to look down at his now covered long legs, almost in disbelief. 'Confirmation is great' he declared, his short pants embarrassment finally over.

    Footnote. Once over pints with a long deceased 'English' uncle, we discussed this short pants thing. He smiled and remarked cryptically, in his lifetime acquired cockney, 'Coo, the old fiddlers back then, they liked the old shorts, din'n they?'. Amen.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 28,232 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    A long and rambling post, the first paragraph of which is . . .

    There's nothing that prevents a religion having irrational or fantastical belief structures either, they evolve them over time as a distraction, and a measure to control their victims behaviours.

    That's true, but so what? There's equally nothing to prevent non-religious people having irrational or fantastical belief, structures, either as a distraction, or as a control measure, or for any other reason at all.

    That's not what you said before. What you said before is . . .

    . . . surely a religious belief system is, almost by definition, irrational and fantastical?

    As you're making no attempt to defend this claim, do I take it that you withdraw it? And perhaps even concede that it's itself a bit irrational and fantastical? 😉



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 54,379 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    it was me who said that, FWIW, not deezell.

    i would have argued that belief in the supernatural is by definition, irrational. we possibly have differing ideas of what 'rational' means, but belief in supernatural entities, the existence of which cannot be proven, stumbles against what i would think of as rational.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 28,232 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    it was me who said that, FWIW, not deezell.

    Sorry, deezell!

    i would have argued that belief in the supernatural is by definition, irrational. we possibly have differing ideas of what 'rational' means, but belief in supernatural entities, the existence of which cannot be proven, stumbles against what i would think of as rational.

    I think we both probably share the same idea of what "irrational" means — contrary to reason.

    So it's irrational to believe in, say, a woman's right to choose, because the existence of rights cannot be proven?

    It's a bit off topic for the thread, but there's no principle of reason which holds that it's irrational to be believe in somethign which can't be proven.

    Unless, of course, you're a philosophical materalist, who holds that only material things (which can be emperically observed, and whose existence can therefore be proven by observation) exist. But that proposition itself cannot be proven. Is it irrational to be a materialist, then?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 54,379 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i think that's a discussion for another thread!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,205 ✭✭✭deezell


    Haha, its not irrational to believe in, Aliens say, but it's irrational to make bold statements of fact about them. Funny. That's reminded me of, I think, an old quote in the catechism (which I could recite by heart as a kid), originally from the bible, Corinthians according to Fr. Google.

    "Eyes cannot see, nor ear [have] heard, nor have entered into the heart of man the things which God has prepared for those who love Him:

    I remember it as this;

    Eyes cannot see, nor ears have heard, nor has it entered into the heart of man, what things God has prepared for those who love Him.

    Subtle differences, but its quite rational, until you realise God's world is portrayed as being substantially accessible to human senses, which of course, is irrational. 'Things', being 'prepared', by 'him'. Remember 'purgatory' and ,'limbo'? The vivid imaginations of those ancient theologians.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 28,232 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    It's a potentially fascinating discussion, deezell, but as magicbastarder says it's not really one for this thread.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,205 ✭✭✭deezell


    True. This was just meant to be 'a bit of a larf'.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 663 ✭✭✭jjmcclure


    The entire sabbath mode concept just points to religious fanaticism, which is not a great trait to be passing on to the next generation. Telling your kids that if they switch a light on during a certain day of the week it's a sin, seriously people need to grow up.

    Until humanity moves on from its infancy and stops fighting over who's imaginary friend, with the strangest rules for life, is the best… we will just keep slaughtering each other. Instead of indoctrinating kids with unprovable fairy stories we should be showing them the beauty of physics, chemistry and the universe as a whole etc.

    So in conclusion, "Down with this sort of thing"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,081 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Fair enough you can't work on the Sabbath but if you think flicking a light switch is work you are one seriously lazy fuk.



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