Does activism achieve anything?

littlefeet · 15-04-2025 04:33PM #1

I'd say in some situations, yes, there are issues in Ireland that would never have been sorted or come to light, only for activism on the other hand, it's often a cult and lifestyle in Ireland.

Ubbquittious · 15-04-2025 04:36PM

Water charges would have gone ahead if it wasnt for activism

eightieschewbaccy · 15-04-2025 05:08PM

I'd say activism were pretty meaningful for repeal and the marriage referendum. That includes calling for the referendums.

SuperBowserWorld · 15-04-2025 05:17PM

Most of our rights and benefits come from activism in other countries. Divorce, contraception, abortion, womens rights, workers rights, maternal/paternal/parental rights, annual leave, minimum wage, social benefits, animal welfare, … thank God we live near the UK, Western Europe and not elsewhere.

littlefeet · 15-04-2025 05:37PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360121#Comment_123360121

There is no such thing as free water, so it just pushed the cost somewhere else. I was thinking more of things like the mother and baby homes activism brought that to light.

littlefeet · 15-04-2025 05:40PM

You think we'd never achieve anything without outside influences on Irish society.

LambshankRedemption · 15-04-2025 05:41PM

I wonder if perhaps the OP is asking do protests achieve anything.

Charlo30 · 15-04-2025 05:43PM

Normally gets me a bit more active. If that counts for anything

Mattyonthepatty · 15-04-2025 05:51PM

It's a very broad question to ask, activism has changed many things in Ireland, whether the right issues are being raised, right decisions being made along with the question are the right kind of people drawn towards activism in the first places is a different story.

littlefeet · 15-04-2025 05:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360317#Comment_123360317

Protests do work for some issues, but when it becomes protest and activism as a lifestyle, does that ever achieve anything

littlefeet · 15-04-2025 05:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360254#Comment_123360254

That's very insulting to Irish society, you saying we have no soul, no passion, no culture, Irish society was sloshing around waiting for someone else to tell us what to do?

SupaCat95 · 15-04-2025 06:03PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360309#Comment_123360309

You are right, it was paid for as part of the road tax, universal service charge and 2% vat hike but they still want to charge again for the same thing.

EmmetSpiceland · 15-04-2025 06:41PM

It’s certainly not liked by a certain online “cohort”, along with NGOs, charity and, general, compassion.

SuperBowserWorld · 15-04-2025 07:13PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360350#Comment_123360350

Soul, culture and passion exists independently of activism.

Now you mention it ... yes, we let the British Empire, the Catholic Church, the EU, the US, the markets ... tell us what to do. It's mostly driven by greed and selfishness. Witness the current property "crisis". I can't see any passion, culture or soul here, apart from people passionately milking the property circus. People will side with the money and the power.

Now, back to activism, .…I'm saying a lot of things we take for granted come from activism in other countries. So, yes, it achieves a lot. There isn't much activism here as people wait for other countries to sort **** out.

Example: Kids still waiting for back operations or getting the most terrible treatments. Not a sinner on the streets protesting.

Social networks spreading fear, lies, hate, ... no one protesting.

We've been bought and sold.

15-04-2025 07:39PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360121#Comment_123360121

More complex than that.

What got rid of water charges was FF suddenly being against them when things were not going well in the 2016 GE, even though they were the ones who agreed them with the Trioka.

And the people jumped for it, giving them so much of a boost that they managed to hold the balance of power in the next Dail.

But up to that point no one in FF were against water charges, no high level FF people ever protested against them, there was never a high profile FF person on the protest line, matching etc against water charges.

It was a piece of typical political expediency that got rid of water charges.

El_Duderino 09 · 15-04-2025 08:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360342#Comment_123360342

This is the language of the status quo / establishment.

Passive resistance, activism, protest and violent resistance aren't different things. They're on a continuum. Movements that continue to grow can escalate from one to the next if their demands for change aren't met. It goes for Movements you agree with and those you don't agree with. See any revolution in history for examples but our own revolutions, including the successful war of independence is a good example.

Activism certainly can work.

Hamsterchops · 15-04-2025 10:13PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123360959#Comment_123360959

"The war of independence is a good example ..

Activism certainly can work,"

I guess from today's perspective, as the country prospers and the coffers are full, the activism in the 1920s worked, but only after a lot of hardship. I mean let's not forget the island split and then the civil war, then to seventy+ years of deeply depressing recession (before the positive outcome that we see today).

El_Duderino 09 · 16-04-2025 05:59AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123361131#Comment_123361131

Not debating the merits of the war of independence. I covered that with "it It goes for Movements you agree with and those you don't agree with".

It sure as sh1t changed things.

Peregrinus · 16-04-2025 06:27AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123361131#Comment_123361131

Well, you're implicitly measuring the success of activism purely or largely in terms of prosperity. But if, in fact, the goal of Irish nationalist activism was primarily independence then, while it has yielded only partial results, it did yield them from the 1920s; we didn't have to wait until the 1990s to enjoy any degree of independence.

But, going back to the OP, would the better question to ask be: Is anything acheived without activism?

El_Duderino 09 · 16-04-2025 07:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123361353#Comment_123361353

The question is giving "What have the Romans ever done for us?"

Flaneur OBrien · 16-04-2025 07:57AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058406299/does-activism-achieve-anything

"Often a cult or a lifestyle in Ireland."

I don't get this. If you have had success with activism; like the recent history of water charges, marriage equality or repeal, do you expect people to just clap your hands and say, "that's that so" and stop?

Activism is addictive as it often opens your eyes to other hardships happening in Ireland and elsewhere. If you're off the back of a "win", all the more so.

I don't think the housing crisis or the health crisis or the mental health crisis has garnered such mass mobilisation because there is no obvious answer to these systemic problems.

Look at the recent wins for activism:

Privatisation of water? Clear answer, keep it owned by the public.

Gay people not allowed to be married? Clear answer, let them marry.

People aren't allowed get abortions in Ireland? Clear answer, let them have abortions.

Then try that with the housing crisis.

Homes too expensive? Bring the prices down! What about the negative equity that would bring? Will people be happy with lower standard of housing, using cheaper materials etc.

Health and mental health crisis: Where do you even start with that one?

I'm not saying the general public are thick, but it's a lot easier to unite behind an answer that it is a riddle.

whisky_galore · 16-04-2025 08:00AM

It depends. The public saw the Irish water setup on shaky ground, only took a bit of pressure to get government to roll over, most coming from the "never paying for anything" sector of society. Didn't see the same with property tax.

On the other hand I'd say the Israeli government are shítting themselves over a bunch of crusties and reds protesting over Palestine here.

Flaneur OBrien · 16-04-2025 08:04AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123361521#Comment_123361521

I'd say the public protests about the Palestinian genocide are more for OUR government than the Israeli.

I don't think our government would have recognised the state of Palestine without those protests.

Peregrinus · 16-04-2025 08:15AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123361521#Comment_123361521

A bit OT for this thread, perhaps, but if the Israeli government are indifferent to Irish views about the war in Gaza, why have they reacted so strongly?

I think the answer is: they don't see the Irish protests in isolation; they see them as part of a transnational phenomenon that they do take seriously. (And, spoiler alert, the Irish protestors see them that way too.)

Ireland isn't the only country to have announced its intention of making submissions in the ICJ proceedings against Israel alleging genocide; scores of countries have done the same. Ireland isn't the only government to have recognised Palestine. In fact, the great majority of governments around the world favour the recognition of Palestine. Ireland isn't the only country to be considering sanctions against goods from the occupied territories; there's an international movement at work there too.

So far, Israel has been shielded from severe impact from these efforts by the protection of the US, and in particular by the US veto at the UN Security Council. But where your support base in the international community is getting narrower and narrower, and that narrow support base increasingly depends on the current whim of Donald Trump, you'd have to be very stupid not to feel some degree of existential insecurity.

So, yeah, pro-Palestine activism is something that bothers the Israeli government a lot. It may not have achieved very much yet, but it's not difficult to envisage circumstances where quite a lot could change in that regard quite quickly.

Bogey Lowenstein · 16-04-2025 08:33AM

I think activism can make a difference sometimes but if it is something that a government or big business are determined to do it will happen no matter how much opposition there is. The invasion of Iraq and Shell Corrib gas pipeline are two examples.

littlefeet · 16-04-2025 08:33AM

As I said activism has brought about change for the better. The mother and baby homes were a very complex and defuse issue yet activism worked, so it's not about activism being about issues with solutions,

They were huge protests about housing a few years ago the protesters took over some building in Dublin what happened to that?

There is no getting away from the fact the some activism and issues are more fashionable than others why is that.

ledwithhedwith · 16-04-2025 08:36AM

Basically has achieved everything

16-04-2025 09:21AM

Activism brought about the Eight Amendment to the Constitution back in the early 1980s.

_Brian · 16-04-2025 10:08AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058406299/does-activism-achieve-anything

It really depends on how real the cause is. It worked great to get women recognised and moved towards equal rights as men. To get blacks equal rights. But they were genuine good causes that better society.

Bit look at vegans or just stop oil, that’s just protesting to be heard. That gets nowhere.

Wezz · 16-04-2025 10:15AM

Activism takes many forms. Its not just marching or handing out leaflets, its the small acts that have the biggest impact, sharing stories, engaging in debate, often just living your life is the greatest form of activism there is.

RoyalCelt · 16-04-2025 10:20AM

It has achieved a lot including the big victory in the latest referendum. It's just a way of spreading awareness or initiating change.

Does activism achieve anything?

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