What does the future hold for Donald Trump? - threadbans in OP

Leroy42 · 03-10-2023 11:52AM

Isn't the issue that he undervalued the assets on his tax returns and used higher values for the bank loans?

So NY state is alleging he paid too little taxes based on his own valuation of his assets?

Burty330 · 03-10-2023 12:22PM

lol @ thinking the banks just took his word for it before approving loans wort millions of Dollars. The banks own appraisers valued the properties and never had any complaints. Trump’s valuations never defrauded anybody. There hasn't been a single entity that filed suit claiming they were damaged by the valuations.

You can't have a defraud case if no one claimed to be defrauded. Nobody give a rats ass whether these charges are wrong or right. Anyone with eyes and common sense can see what’s happening after the judge made , according to real estate experts , the decisional claim that maga lago was worth $18m. The takeaway here is Corrupt political persecution and election interference is fine and dandy if its being perpetrated against other side.

“Eighteen million dollars? That’s totally stupid. That’s ridiculous. You could sell it for $250 million tomorrow,” Jeff Greene, a Palm Beach billionaire and real estate developer who lives nearby and was once a Mar-a-Lago Club member, told The Messenger. Greene ran for Senate in 2010 and governor in 2018 when he attacked Trump in a major ad buy.

Penn · 03-10-2023 12:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188649#Comment_121188649

The Judge didn't make the claim that Mar-a-Lago was valued at 18m, a property valuer hired by Trump valued it as between 18m-28m, and Trump used that valuation in order to calculate taxes because it meant paying less tax.

That's the crux of the case, it's an important detail to get right.

Leroy42 · 03-10-2023 12:30PM

Again, he used different valuations - lower - to reduce his tax payable. That is the core of the fraud.

But, it is also illegal to knowingly lie on bank documents. Yes, the banks certainly take some blame for failing to adequately audit the valuations, but that doesn't absolve Trump of his legal responsibility.

If you value your house at 100x to get some loans, but then state your property is only worth 1x for property tax purposes that is fraud.

This is, roughly, what Trump has done.

Quin_Dub · 03-10-2023 12:35PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188649#Comment_121188649

The $18M valuation for Mar-a-Lago came from Trumps own accountants , not anybody else!!

The issue with Mar-a-Lago is down to whether or not you can sell it as a "residence".

The terms under which Trump bought that place was that it was NOT a Residence and no one could live there permanently.

It's a Members club, not a home.

Valued as a members club and accounting for all the other limitations placed on it in terms of future development etc. the Palm Beach County Tax assessor valued it in the $18M to $26M range and Trumps people pushed to get the $18M valuation for Property tax purposes.

However , Trump now wants to value it as a home and ignore all the other covenants and stipulations that exist for the place.

IF it was a house and land with no limitations in terms of development etc. then yes , it probably is worth ~$250M based on the prices paid for other places in the area.

But it isn't.

The Mar-A-Lago property is encumbered with a “trust for historical preservation” in a 2002 deed where Trump agreed “to forever extinguish his right to develop or use the Property for any purpose other than club use.”

The 2002 Deed also specifically "limits changes to the Property including, without limitation, the division or subdivision of the Property for any purpose, including use as single family homes, the interior renovation of the mansion, which may be necessary and desirable for the sale of the Property as a single family residential estate, the construction of new buildings and the obstruction of open vistas."

So - If you bought it , you wouldn't be able to live in it , you wouldn't be able to make any major changes to the buildings and you couldn't build any more homes on the property, hence its real-world valuation of ~$25M.

Trump is a liar and a bullshitter.

And he's a Rapist.

Cody montana · 03-10-2023 12:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188679#Comment_121188679

That they don’t even know the basics says it all.

eightieschewbaccy · 03-10-2023 12:50PM

Slightly amusing to watch the usual types blow in, make claim and then run away.

amandstu · 03-10-2023 12:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188688#Comment_121188688

"Yes, the banks certainly take some blame for failing to adequately audit the valuations, but that doesn't absolve Trump of his legal responsibility"

You don't suppose the banks were in on the scheme?

They weren't given a backhander to look the other way (or maybe it was their idea in the first place?)

Don't these people think that laws are just creative obstacles to be circumvented in the first place?

Like the drugs trade If it was boringly legal there would be hardly any money to be made off the transactions.

"Only little people suffer" (Orson Welles /Harry Lime was it?)

everlast75 · 03-10-2023 12:58PM

Well damn.. can't argue with this.

General Kelly on Trump...

Tony EH · 03-10-2023 01:09PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188814#Comment_121188814

The usual fact free cobblers, easily dismantled within seconds.

It must be a terrible affliction to be a Trump Supporter in 2023.

Quin_Dub · 03-10-2023 01:09PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188883#Comment_121188883

Too little far too late from Kelly tbh.

The time to say all this was when Trump was doing it not years later.

ohnonotgmail · 03-10-2023 01:11PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188862#Comment_121188862

You don't suppose the banks were in on the scheme?

that doesn't make Trump any less guilty. It probably makes him guilty of a conspiracy charge on top of the fraud charge

pixelburp · 03-10-2023 01:15PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188883#Comment_121188883

The Road to Damascus cuts thin when as with a lot of these kind of hindsight inflected comments, they come too little too late.

VinLieger · 03-10-2023 01:15PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188862#Comment_121188862

Well there has always been questions about his relationship with Deutsche bank and their continued willingness to loan him money despite defaulting on prior loans with them, they have historically laundered money for the Russian Mob and Oligarchs.....

PropJoe10 · 03-10-2023 01:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188956#Comment_121188956

"I love the poorly educated" - Donald J. Trump.

amandstu · 03-10-2023 01:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188969#Comment_121188969

I agree but it would also mean someone at the bank should be facing charges(but they didn't get caught)

I know from personal experience(and from what I read in the newspapers) that the banks facilitate(d) customer's extracurricural activities.

No secrets there.

amandstu · 03-10-2023 01:20PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188957#Comment_121188957

I remember at the time wishing that Kelly take Trump to a corner of the room and "put manners on him"

Might have saved us all a lot of time.

Quin_Dub · 03-10-2023 01:20PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188969#Comment_121188969

100% - The Banks clearly deliberately chose to turn a blind eye , probably ensuring a nice commission for the loan officers for closing such big loan deals etc.

Trump has been playing this game for decades - Mar-a-Lago is a very high profile example , but ignoring stipulations and legal limitations on properties has been a Trump specialty for years.

He ignores the impact of a building being rent controlled for example when he's valuing it for Loans but makes sure to mention it when valuing it for tax purposes.

A rent controlled building is going to be worth a whole lot less than one that isn't as the revenue is permanently restricted.

I'd say that in most cases the "tax valuations" are likely pretty close to the true values and all the Loan valuations and Insurance claim ones are grossly inflated.

Quin_Dub · 03-10-2023 01:25PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121189020#Comment_121189020

The Banks would kick to touch and say that they relied on the accounts from "trusted" people like Mazars and accepted the information at face value.

amandstu · 03-10-2023 01:56PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121189070#Comment_121189070

A bit like rape prosecutions(he said/she said)

Or the soldier in Mash who was "voluteered" for assignment.

?

ancapailldorcha · 03-10-2023 02:37PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188883#Comment_121188883

The same Kelly who was more than happy to take a job in Trump's administration? Pretending to have principles now doesn't cut it.

Overheal · 03-10-2023 04:24PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121188456#Comment_121188456

His comments trying to explain how this was legit were truly baffling. Timestamped:

https://youtu.be/XB2W_kw62u8?si=0s4IsGc6odK8OopI&t=346

"We have a clause in the contract which tells essentially buyer beware [...] when you take a look at the financial statement don't believe anything you read this is upfront don't believe anything you read some people call it a 'worthless' clause because it makes the statement and anything you read in the statement worthless, it says go out and do your own research, go out and do your own due diligence, you have to study the statement carefully, do not believe anything"

Quin_Dub · 03-10-2023 04:47PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121189813#Comment_121189813

He's basically saying "But I had my fingers crossed behind my back so none of this counts!!!"

He truly believes that he should be able to do whatever he wants and no one should be allowed to question him.

Overheal · 03-10-2023 04:50PM

The judge reminding Trump today that he already ruled last week that Trump has committed fraud, that this is not a bench trial to dispute that finding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hL6mCOX50nw

amandstu · 03-10-2023 05:04PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121189813#Comment_121189813

Might apply to his life in general?

nachouser · 03-10-2023 05:18PM

https://twitter.com/therecount/status/1709243728639013076?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1709243728639013076%7Ctwgr%5Ecdd0a4e39ddc64d5635de90066048cb3fa02fc31%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fus-news%2Flive%2F2023%2Foct%2F03%2Fmccarthy-speaker-republicans-trump-trial-biden-live-updates

This is gas. Basically, I did not do those things I'm accused of but even if I did do those things they should have known I would do those things so it's really their own fault.

pixelburp · 03-10-2023 05:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121189915#Comment_121189915

Presumably because for much of his life, that's precisely how he got by. If you live a life of privilege where you can lie through your teeth and see no consequence, stands to reason he only knows that way

Agent Coulson · 03-10-2023 05:30PM

I really hope he takes the stand under oath he would be so easy to goad into losing the plot and completely incriminating himself.

Quin_Dub · 03-10-2023 05:32PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121190083#Comment_121190083

Not a chance in hell he takes the stand.

He'll say he will and then a the last minute "something will come up" so he can't be there.

Just like the E Jean Carroll case.

Penn · 03-10-2023 05:38PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121190092#Comment_121190092

"I could easily go up on the stand and testify why everything I did is completely legal, but it's clear that I'm not going to get a fair trial from this biased judge and his election interference so I won't, and will instead just dispute the findings of the court, fundraise off the back of it and run appeals up the courts as much as possible."

What does the future hold for Donald Trump? - threadbans in OP

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