Philosophical dilemma

I suppose to give you a clearer picture of my lifestyle, I work from home, I'm a software engineer, my wife is in full time employment.

I've two kids who are in school (plus afterschool care) and preschool. Regrettably some silly laws mean I can't send them out to sweep chimneys for money yet. None of the houses nearby have chimneys anyway

I ate out twice this week which is unusually high for me, once was a burrito and the other was a Papa John's pizza, so not exactly fine dining

I have one or two coffees from the cafe every day

I don't go on many nights out, maybe once a week for a couple of drinks

I go on one holiday a year (aiming for two this year) and I'd spend a few thousand on them

I recently bought a new phone, one before lasted 5 years until I fell on it, turns out Gorilla glass can't withstand my fat arse landing on it.

I wouldn't say I'm one for buying shiny new things all the time, although I did buy a stand mixer recently which will definitely never pay for itself unless cakes become a currency

My wife thankfully doesn't go for expensive jewellery or gifts and is very much financially independent (she's actually the top earner)

Most of my t-shirts are so old I'm risking putting my thumbs through them when putting them on. Did that recently and now I'm annoyed that I have to buy a new one. The closest I'll get to high street clothes is some shirts from M&S, or some jeans from Diesel. I avoid Penney's though, the stuff there is such garbage it could be free and would still be a rip off

So that's me and my life, I'll leave it to ye to judge if I'm living like a prince or a pauper

€4

I thought for a moment I walked into an after hours thread....

BITCOIN!!!!!

PM me...

My solar is paying for itself.

What a strange thread!

I know, a bit of personal information posted that should be deleted @Jonathan if you think so.

True, although I don't drink two coffees every day, so the savings aren't quite that much. Probably closer to €1500 which is closer to my calculated solar savings

There's also other considerations, like if I had a coffee machine, I'd drink more coffee which is bad for my health. Also I enjoy the walk to the coffee shop, which has physical and mental health benefits

Finally, I tried making my own coffee and it turns out I'd make a rubbish barista 😂

It's easier to get solar panels than learn to make coffee

I suggest starting with your consumption in kWh instead of your bills, it makes it a lot easier to see how much you can reduce by having solar panels

You need to figure out how big a system you can install within your budget and then use an online calculator to see how many kWh you'll generate. I've found PV GIS to be pretty good

There's other potential ways to save money. For example a lot of people here have batteries to increase their self consumption of solar. A neat trick is that you can charge it off the grid at night rates in winter when there isn't a lot of sunshine so you avoid using the grid during the day when it's expensive

Another method to save money is using a diverter of some sort. This is a device that senses when you have more solar power than you're consuming and switches something on to use up the excess

Most common one is to heat water using the immersion heaters and a device called an Eddi, although there's other options and people have had success using some electric heaters as diverters

If you have any plans to own an EV or PHEV at any point you can also use it as a diverter. Hard to beat free fuel

Finally, the ESB will pay you for your nice solar electricity that you send to the grid. If you aren't on a smart meter then you'll receive an estimated amount.

This is frankly a bit of a joke since you can literally export nothing but still be paid. You can get up to €200 tax free form this depending on the size of the system

So there's a lot of sums to look at before making your decision.

FWIW, my best case estimate sees my monthly bills reduced from €211 per month (increasing to €316 in May) down to €80 per month, before PSO levy and government supports

That's €2,832 saved per year, on a €14k system then payback is just 5 years

But I'm also saving around €2k per year by not spending money on petrol or gas/oil heating. It wouldn't be fair to consider those against the payback for the solar but the savings are real

No worries, hope this helps

If I may, it doesn't seem much like a philosophical issue to you as much as a question of whether it's a worthwhile investment

There's other smart ways to spend your money as well. Paying a lump sum off your mortgage might pay off more but probably takes longer

In terms of home improvements, improving your insulation is almost always a smart move and improves the comfort levels of your home as well as paying for itself

So it's important to consider all your options, see what they'll cost and what impact they have before making your decision

Just to make sure I understand you, you'll be clearing the balance using the savings over what you're paying monthly for the Solar panels?

Otherwise if you paid it from general savings then it would just be a deferred cost and would have the associated payback period

One thing I didn't understand in your post - In addition, given my reliance on electricity, it seems prudent to have some sort of backup supply if the grid fails (it happens every so often)

How does that work? When we have a power cut, the solar panels don't feed any energy into the house, the battery doesn't charge, etc.

Is there some way around this?

Can you direct me to the provider you used?

Interesting thread.

I notice from a lot of Solar threads that those putting in Solar tend to live in either very large houses or houses with a heatpump etc but I could be wrong here.

Living in an average 1600 detached 2 storey house build circa 2001. House hasn't been pumped or actic insulated much more above standard. Double Glazed PVC windows and doors. Average electicity use per year. 5 person house. Used around 4600 units last year down from 5300 the previous year. Heating is OFC with old school burner.

No one home during the day for 70 percent of the time however summer and holidays kids and wife etc at home.

Based on roof size I'd expect 8 - 10 panels maximum in a south east facing direction. No obstuctions etc. At most I'd reckon 3.2 to 4.0 kw system (4 would be a push) Haven't gotten pricing etc but I'd expect that to cost roughly 5-6 K after grant, would probably want hot water diverter and car charger while the work was being done also pushing things up a bit but would hope no more than 9K after all grants.

To me, until I get the house insulated, and a drafty front door replaced it doesn't make much sense to spend 9K yet while money is tight.

Solar as a service might be an option based on what has been said here, but I don't think the system would cover enough of my elec requirements for the payback to be worthwhile. 9K is enough to upgrade the OFCH burner to condensor, put a porch in and insulate the house better than it is now - which is probably a better use of the money.

It doesn't seem too crazy, like I said I could be saving around €2,400 for around €14k investment. So half the investment for half the savings seems logical

To be fair, it isn't really a money printer (that would be a nice feature) but a way of saving money. The problem is that when people have money they tend to spend it on something (yay consumerism) so when you save money you don't exactly notice straight away

The only way I've found is to make regular savings and increase the savings amount when you do something to reduce costs. It's a lot more visible then and, for me at least, having the money off in a savings account gives some mental separation to spending money so I don't just immediately spend it on junk

Not installed yet, but I'm getting a 6kWp system anda battery at some point in the future

I based my savings calculations on the Energia EV plan which I'll be on when my current discount expires in May, plus the amount I'll be getting from deemed export

I calculated how much output I'd be getting using an online calculator and deducted that from my annual usage (minus around 10% for losses)

When I've the battery I'll be charging it from night rate when there's not much sunlight expected to lower the cost of buying electricity from the grid a lot

The installer is on the list here https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058243236/solar-pv-boards-members-installer-information#latest The price they charge now has increased a lot since last year when they offered a basic system for around €29.99 a month.