Another piece of anti Landlord legislation

MakersMark · 01-07-2022 3:27pm #1

This makes 45 pieces of rental legislation since 2008.

https://www.thejournal.ie/renter-tenancies-notice-periods-increase-5805237-Jul2022/

Note that deadbeat tenants can still skip town without paying a cent and without giving a minutes notice.

How about some legislation that would encourage landlords to stay in the business ofproviding accommodation?

NSAman · 01-07-2022 3:30pm

Sorry but that won't happen. The Irish government is hell bent on getting small landlords out of the business..... you know... the ones that ACTUALLY PAY TAX!!!

They are more interested in keeping the large investment vehicles (WHO PAY LITTLE IF ANY TAX) sweet.

All the time the tax payer is paying for those who need assistance and it is being brought abroad for the pensions and investment vehicles of outside interests.

Wonder how this ever was allowed to happen...........hmmmm

Claw Hammer · 01-07-2022 3:30pm

No doubt this will hasten the exit of landlords from the market.

MacDanger · 01-07-2022 3:38pm

This is going to drive very few if any LLs out of the market.

What LLs (and good tenants) need legislation on though is dealing with tenants who aren't paying their rent - the evicton process should be very swift.

growleaves · 01-07-2022 3:40pm

The Government want big institutional money in control of the rental sector.

With economies of scale and tax advantages, financial corporations can withstand a number of bad tenants and still make a profit.

C3PO · 01-07-2022 6:54pm

If you think it’s bad now just wait until SF get into power!

drogon. · 01-07-2022 8:03pm

Assuming the same legislation should apply to big REIT too right ?

touts · 01-07-2022 11:11pm

If you think it's bad now wait until SF and PBP are in government in a couple of years. Landlords in Ireland will become their Kulak scapegoats.

Time to sell up and wait the next few years out.

dennis72 · 02-07-2022 10:52am

Just got another email rtb to register tenants leaving

Happy it is the seventh off the market this year worked hard at this business ess sold some

never screwed anyone deps returned and rarely put up rents

Small ll need a good relationship with tenants that is what I strived any tenant finding a new place with non reit will be able to milk it if they want

And with SF it will get worse

drogon. · 03-07-2022 4:39pm

Just thinking about it, wouldn't this not have other consequence. If you are letting out a house, just keep the tenant for 1 year.. find someone else, repeat cycle ?

freddie1970 · 03-07-2022 5:05pm

Was talking to a estate agent yesterday who was a good few Dublin peoperties on their books ..He was saying that all this legislation is having a negative effect on the rental market ..where years ago once someone had a reasonable income you could let a property out to them ..But now you can not consider someone unless they are in a real well paid safe job ..any body else is not worth the risk .....

AnRothar · 05-07-2022 10:47am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119285048#Comment_119285048

After 6 months the Tennant has other rights so that would not work.

Glaceon · 05-07-2022 10:50am

I’m in the process of moving out of my rental of 4 years after buying a place of my own. The landlord has decided to sell the house rather than relet it. Can’t really blame them in fairness.

spaceHopper · 05-07-2022 11:14am

If you had money to invest and wanted to use it as deposit to buy a place with a commercial mortgage, I'm not sure the banks would lend there is to much risk for LL and if the bank has to take over the property for them too.

drogon. · 05-07-2022 1:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119292303#Comment_119292303

But what if you only give them a 12 month contract from the start.

Mrs OBumble · 05-07-2022 1:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119293164#Comment_119293164

They get rights at six months, irrespective of the contract.

Some LL are doing what you suggest but the contract term is 5 months and three weeks. Lots of work for the LL. Tedious for tenants.

mrslancaster · 05-07-2022 2:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119293203#Comment_119293203

Looks like there will be no point doing that in future, these new notice periods say 90 days for a tenancy up to six months. That option will be gone for landlords, they'd have to give 3 months notice after a tenant is barely moved in.

Akrasia · 05-07-2022 2:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058252645/another-piece-of-anti-landlord-legislation

This is for 'No Fault' evictions.

Do you think it is reasonable for a landlord to be able to evict a tenant with only a few weeks notice for no fault of their own. Given how extremely hard it is to find rental accommodation at the moment, should tenants not be given a reasonable length of time to find new accommodation?

drogon. · 05-07-2022 4:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119293563#Comment_119293563

Honestly doesn’t make any logical sense if the rental agreement is only for 1 year when the tenants signed it.

Imagine giving a year employment contract and then still having to officially terminate the staff 3 or 6 months before their signed employment contract is supposed to end.

Xterminator · 05-07-2022 4:23pm

just wanted to reiterate The amended bill, which applies to ‘no-fault evictions’. its a specific change that is designed to give tenants more time if the landlord decides to terminate a tenancy where the tenant is holding up their end of the bargain. It has nothing to do with tenants who don't pay rent, etc.

I don't expect any landlords to like the idea but any fair person can concede that given the housing situation in Ireland (neither the landlords nor tenants fault) it is understandable the tenants need time to find alternative accommodation before falling into homelessness or overholding the property.

This one specific change has merit and i don't believe it will have landlords running for the exit ramp.

If you don't like the way the industry is going, then yes, perhaps its a good time to get out. Other mentioned SF etc and i cannot see any election result where SF are not the single largest block in the Dail in the current climate (housing crisis, cist of living crisis etc.). Will drive the floating voter to opposition parties- guaranteed.

MakersMark · 05-07-2022 4:53pm

So can someone tell me how making life more difficult for small landlords will increase rental supply please?

drogon. · 05-07-2022 5:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119294299#Comment_119294299

It won't in my opinion. But I guess this protection is mainly to help people who are already in the rental market and not those who are trying to get onto to it. Any legislation will have consequences and I am afraid this isn't going to help.

Claw Hammer · 05-07-2022 5:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119294081#Comment_119294081

Believe it or not statute overrides the contract! Furthermore the same thing can happen in employment situations. keep someone on a series of short contracts and they become entitled to a contract of indefinite duration. Look at the teaching forums for examples.

What may seem rational and sensible has been distorted in an attempt to provide "rights" to renters. All it has done is drive LLs out of business thus causing a shortage of supply and making things worse for many renters.

05-07-2022 5:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119294299#Comment_119294299

That's the one that Darragh "two dinners" O'Brien definitely doesn't want to answer - and one that, strangely, I've never heard any interviewer ask him.

mrslancaster · 05-07-2022 6:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119294081#Comment_119294081

Usually an employment contract has a probation period so both parties can see if they suit each other. If either decides it doesn't suit, they can quit/be terminated during the probation period. Under the new rental notice periods, there is no probation period for a landlord, and a tenant can break a lease contract whenever they like, even if they've signed a lease for a year.

An employee and a tenant are very similar - they can both walk away with little chance of follow up or penalty, but the company or landlord has to stick to the rules because if they break the rules, it can be very costly. The difference is that an employer is not handing over an asset worth hundreds of thousands to an unknown individual. No doubt, landlords will find a way around it but it doesn't mean it will be easier for renters to find a place.

DubCount · 05-07-2022 10:12pm

We are in a spiral at the moment. There is not enough rental supply, so make rules to protect tenants, which drives out landlords, which makes supply worse, so make more rules to protect tenants, which drives out landlords, which makes supply worse..... and so on. Adding more tenant protections only makes things worse for tenants. We need more rentals and more landlords. Heading for nearly 50 changes to rent legislation in the last few years, nothing has been done to encourage more landlords or tenancies.

It may be popular. It may be well meaning. It doesnt create supply, so it doesnt help.

amacca · 06-07-2022 1:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119295927#Comment_119295927

I find it hard to believe its well meaning

They can't be that stupid that they can't connect the dots.....

dennis72 · 06-07-2022 3:25am

Anybody living in a below market rental have been gifted a small portion of the property under the guise of extra protection and rent caps

My last remaining will have owner occupier with licencees for the next 2 year then back out at market rate

Threshold has fully evolved into rtb next step is ban on all evictions

tvjunki · 06-07-2022 9:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119293203#Comment_119293203

Landlords will offer only less than 6 months lease. Rtb will receive €40 per let so at least €90 per per year per minimum. More money for them.

The Government will be quick to close the gap on this also. More work for the landlord cleaning and prepping the property but at least there no continuous tenancy and limited resale value on the property.

Once again heard on the news they are going to charge vacant tax(info from the census) on properties in this years budget. There are only a small proportion of properties that are vacant. What happens when there is a gap between tenancies which can happen? This is just getting silly.

mrslancaster · 07-07-2022 4:10am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119301073#Comment_119301073

More changes for termination notices.

From 6th july, there are new rules on ALL notices of termination.

Every NoT must be notified to RTB on a Notice of Termination Return Form along with a copy of the notice plus any other documents eg Statutory Declaration. The Return Form must be notified on the same day it is served on the tenant or the NoT will be invalid.

https://www.rtb.ie/ending-a-tenancy/sample-notices-of-termination

mrslancaster · 07-07-2022 5:53am

The additional notice period and the new RTB return form rules were included in the Regulation of Providers of Building Works and Miscellaneous Provisions Bill 2022...

It's no wonder small landlords can't keep up with all the changes when the new rules are buried in with other legislation, in this case they're lumped in with rules about builders 😡😡.

Heard someone interviewed recently who said the rental legislation is now so cumbersome and bureaucratic that only barristers can really understand it.

Another piece of anti Landlord legislation

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