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Brexit discussion thread XIV (Please read OP before posting)

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 53,755 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    I have to say when ever I see Mike Lynch on these news shows, he comes across very well and doesn’t take any ****

    i certainly wouldn’t want to be up against him in these negotiations



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,263 ✭✭✭dublin49


    when Tesco acquired the Irish business they were able to see the gouging that was going on in Ireland ,they demanded price harmonisation with any UK Food firms selling into the Irish Market,they could then have slashed their prices in Ireland but decided to hold the status quo and pocket the large differences.That made the Irish business the golden goose of the group and it took Aldi & Lidl to put some manners on them but not totally and they would still be gouging ,just not to the same extent.I changed to Aldi 10 years ago and have never gone back,



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,014 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Your really just here to talk about Ireland aren't you



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,095 ✭✭✭paul71


    He is and everything he says is 3 decades late. In reality if someone wants to compare the UK economy to that of an EU country they should be comparing it to Poland, Czech Republic or Slovakia.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    but the thing is dublin has the same problems without brexit. so no this issue is not just brexit.

    i am surprised he dd not ask to get the military involved....

    he is just spinning it the way he likes to. in different ways in different countries.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,935 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Lynch has been a real eye-opener. Straight to the point and does not indulge the bull, he easily swots aside the inane questions of the media and Tory lightweights

    Born in London to Irish parents as well



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 36,787 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    The issue is Brexit. While a lot of places are suffering a hangover after covid, the UK is the only country in history to have willingly trashed its own trading relationships with its most important market.

    O'Leary knows he won't be able to overturn Brexit. He just sees no reason to pander to the Brexiters and the British right like the media does.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,861 ✭✭✭Christy42


    Kay posted this up herself with a comment stating Lynch got flustered. Obviously hoping people don't look at the video.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    I'm aware that others have responded to your nonsense but id like to delve a little deeper into what comes across as sawdust floating around inside your head....

    Bertie saying the part others are afraid to say out loud. I'd say it's past time the government start sending the kites up for the general public.

    People here are aware that as a result if the UK's actions that border checks might become necessary. This to my knowledge has never been denied and has been mentioned several times in this thread.

    What has also been mentioned in those conversations is that the people of the RoI are thought to be in agreement with the need to protect the single market.

    Unfortunately any borders erected (as a result of the British government) are likely to become a target which has the real potential to escalate into the Troubles Mk2. This is one area how Brexit risks the GFA while the NIP helps protect it.

    I think what the UK government also fail to recognise is that by forcing a trade border in Ireland, it will bring very unwelcome consequences from many of the UK's key markets (excluding the EU), most notably the USA. That the UK really wants to negotiate trade deals with these countries shows their lack of self-awareness.

    There are only two choices, either the EU decides to get tough or that bill becomes law and our place in the single market is over to all intents and purposes.

    The EU decides to get tough on what exactly? The bill has not been passed and is widely believed to never be passed. So what exactly are the EU to react to? If the EU take action now, it would be unjust and is probably exactly the kind of war that woukd suit Johnson as he can point to the EU and claim they are being bullied.

    The EU are wise to wait until the UK actually do something and then react.

    The denial of the obvious is really quite worrying. If you care about the single market you should be looking for protection from the EU. It hasn't happened and, like me, Bertie suspects it's not going to happen as does the British government.

    Where does Bertie say that the EU won't protect one of its members?

    This bit highlights the constant throwing under the bus refrain from Vrexiteers which also fails to recognise that (and I'll type it in caps for you) WE ARE THE EU!!!!!!! It really is a simple concept - so why do you have such ongoing difficulty in grasping the concept?



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,254 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    @Kermit.de.frog

    The EU has plenty of big bazookas if it wants to deploy them against the UK.

    It will start with legal action in the ECJ, then move onto some form of targeted sanctions, escalating them as it sees fit.

    The Irish border is likely to be the least of their worries. Dover is the weakest link for the UK, and together with air travel (remember, they are an island too), they are very vulnerable. Add in the City of London, and it will not be long before they find solutions to the NIP that are OK with the EU.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭54and56


    Part of me wants to see the UK rail strike carry on just so I can see more interviews with Mike Lynch as he is one of the calmest and most effective interviewee's I've ever witnessed in relation to "political" issues. He absolutely tears through any BS fed to with such clarity and simplicity and never gets flustered or wound up. They must absolutely hate having to deal with him.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 36,787 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I don't. It took me 2.5 hours to get to work yesterday.

    That Union was the only pro-Brexit one so I've little enough time for their complaints. He cuts an impressive figure but when the standard here is so abysmal, that is not difficult.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭54and56


    This.

    The DUP and Tories themselves know BoJo hasn't an ounce of principle in his body and there isn't a cause or political belief he'd die in a ditch for, remember that empty threat? When push comes to shove the EU can over time (as you have laid out) apply increasing pressure to the point where BoJo will see an opportunity to do a (another) deal with the EU, claim it as a win for his bold negotiating stance and the leverage created by threatening the NIP Bill and once again leave the DUP high and dry.

    It's only a question of when.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭54and56


    Ah I'm sorry about it inconveniencing you, honestly. I lived in London and was similarly inconvenienced by Tube strikes back in the early 90's so I feel your pain.

    I do however think Mick Lynch is genuinely impressive, perhaps that view is qualified given he is surrounded by such lightweights both in terms of politicians put up against him and the interviewer's he has faced but regardless he does seem to be in total command of his brief so to speak, comes across as highly confident without being arrogant and has a rare talent for articulating his position or answering questions in a brutally candid manner using plain language. Most political parties could do with someone of his calibre on their leadership team.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 36,787 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Thanks. Last strike made me get in for 11:45. Not great.

    Aye, he is impressive but since most of the government are there simply to be loyal to Johnson and not actually work for a living, this isn't difficult. Years of dealing with trade union politics will have shaped him into an adept well able to handle the likes of Kay Burley.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,515 ✭✭✭Enzokk


    I see we are back to the EU not doing anything yet from the same poster that lambasted the EU over enacting article 16 over vaccines as premature and damaging and the EU overstepping itself. It should be obvious to everyone that no matter the actions taken by the EU, it will their fault.


    As posted by @Seth Brundle we are all aware of the stark position we may find ourselves in. But I think most would think the EU will do its utmost to ensure this doesn't happen, instead of just deciding one day to cut off Ireland from the SM without warning.


    SF could easily just walk out of Stormont along with all other parties that are in favour of the NIP and collapse Stormont again if the UK enacts the NIP Bill and the DUP returns. Then we are back in the same position and the UK Government will have to have a NIP 2 Bill to overturn the NIP Bill that overturns the NIP. And round and around we go before the EU forces us to do anything. That is assuming Johnson lasts this long and someone with either more sense or even crazier takes over. As mentioned there are still a lot more to happen before we are going to choose ourselves what we want to do in terms of the single market.


    So @Kermit.de.frog again, please do not think we are not aware of the consequences of Brexit. It is the very reason we are all so against it as we can see the potential damage it can cause us. But putting the cart before the horse and voicing what seems to be personal grievances about the EU every few weeks serves nothing when it is not imminently going to happen. There are a lot of time before this happens and whenever a politician remarks the potential choice we face doesn't mean you are right. It is just stating what we know could happen, not what will happen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 876 ✭✭✭reslfj



    Indeed and the EU are very professional players and very able to use of all of the trade war 'orchestra'.

    The other part to the WA/NIP and TCA is not the island of Ireland, but the UK government backed by mostly English people.

    NI and Scotland voted against Brexit, Wales had/has a large group of English people - many older.

    The EU trade is with England is by far the largest part of EU-UK trade in goods, services and capital.

    The EU will surely play firm but low key until the proposed law is actually passed.

    The EU will focus its actions on England-continental EU26 trade i.e. across the Channel, North Sea, Bay of Biscay plus from UK airports.

    The EU will attempt to make its actions on the island of Ireland as light as possible.

    But will - IMO - possibly use diabolically hard measures against smuggling out of Ireland (e.g. confiscation of goods and lorries/containers and criminal actions against drivers, forwarders, owners, and EU buyers. Even ferries might be charged.

    The EU goal will be to get England to fold and return to the NIP - fully implemented.

    Anything outside the Joint Committee's competence simply will not be changed.

    The EU will not care much for GB businesses, but focus on frictionless trade between NI the EU (of which Ireland is one of 27 members)

    Lars 😀



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,014 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Well if he is anything like his predecessor Mick Cash (also of Irish parents) we will see plenty of him in the coming years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    but again it can only be brexit related if no other eu country had issues with airports. other countries in eu do have issues with airports ....





  • Registered Users Posts: 176 ✭✭mrunsure


    Do mainstream electrical goods sold in the EU (for example phones, TVs etc.) generally have the UKCA marking as well as CE marking? I live in the south of England and don't know anyone in the EU in 'real life' that I can ask this question.

    Everything I've bought (in England) recently has both markings. I haven't bought anything with just the UKCA marking. Logically it would just be easier for items to have both markings if they want to sell to both the UK and the EU.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,935 ✭✭✭Glaceon


    Yes I’ve seen plenty of IT equipment with the UKCA mark over the last year or so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,224 ✭✭✭joeysoap


    Both markings now seem to be fairly common - then again i would always price electrical appliances in both NI and here, (even if they originate in EU)



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,370 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    The kites are going up for the public. From the SBP. A Fine Gael MEP would not mention this without having it cleared by party HQ.

    The EU may have to consider temporary checks on goods coming from Ireland if the British government moves ahead with its Northern Ireland protocol legislation, Sean Kelly has said.

    I expect to see more kites being flown in the next few weeks and ramping up in the next few months softening up the public for what is absolutely inevitable with the trajectory we are on. You can make your own minds up on what "temporary" means. I think everyone knows what that means.

    I expect the usual denials on here to continue. It's not your fault. The government has not been honest for obvious reasons so the gravity of the situation we are in thanks to our neighbours has not been made apparent.

    I would suggest the group think of "the EU is always right about everything" and they are playing 4D chess comes to an end quick fast and trade action is demanded against the UK for threatening the interests of the EU member.

    Otherwise Ireland will fall out of the single market by default. That is Britain's clear intention now.

    Post edited by Kermit.de.frog on


  • Posts: 17,381 [Deleted User]


    This is exactly what you want, is it not? Ireland out of the EU and Single Market?

    Why do you feign dismay at the prospect?



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,370 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    It's not what I want. I have no issue with the single market.

    I just don't want our future decided by London any more than I do Brussels.

    London is calling the shots now.

    I'm waiting for everyone to wake up to the seriousness of the situation. The Department of Foreign Affairs know full well how serious it is. The Irish public don't.

    The way this is going to go now is you will see gradually these ideas floating to soften the public up. That's how these things work. It's like planting a seed.

    We'll still have the same denials from the usual on here. Heads in the sand.

    Said before i'm the one pleading for EU action because I know how this will roll for us. Others here are in total denial. It's happening before their eyes and they remain in denial.

    Just to be clear with everyone once a check goes up between Ireland and the continent - from that moment Ireland is an associate member of the single market. Once all checks go up as is inevitable as things currently stand Ireland is out of the single market.

    Post edited by Kermit.de.frog on


  • Posts: 17,381 [Deleted User]


    Everyone agrees it's serious. You keep inventing an audience to your posts that doesn't exist. What most here disagree with you about is what Ireland and the EU should do to counter this problem.

    You seem to have a serious issue with meeting resistance and thinking we live in a fairytale world where nothing bad could happen. Please get it into your brain that we agree it's serious and we can see the threat. It is tiring to keep going through this. Six years later. The severity of the problem is why we are still posting here.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,370 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    The seriousness is not understood. You can count on one hand the number of weeks the continent is going to allow a hole here in the SM - it won't get that far - it will be the number of days.

    Let's take Sean Kelly's statement - the ERG have already won at that point. Ireland is out of the single market. It's not "temporary" - lol. You might be surprised how quickly this will all happen

    The EU should have taken action before now. A member state has been basically threatened for the last 5 years. They haven't.

    Mark my words. They won't. Britain, like it or not, Brexit or not, is too important to Europe.

    If you believe they will then more power to you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,644 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    What you claim as inevitable is not inevitable at all. The proposed Bill still has to pass in both houses of the UK parliament and it is far from certain that it will. If it does, the EU will step up actions against the UK for unilaterally breaking an international agreement and the US is sure to react to the UK's actions and its impact on the GFA (and they have already made it abundantly clear that they will react to that).

    If the UK can weather the almighty shıtstorm which would be delivered upon it and deviates from EU standards, then checks between Ireland and EU becomes a consideration. It is extremely unlikely though that the UK will ever get that far because either the Bill fails or the consequences of passing the Bill take over. The trajectory is not linear resulting in what you claim to be an inevitability, in reality the only inevitability is that the current trajectory itself will introduce factors which mean the conclusion will be far from what you think/want it to be.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,370 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Two points - the EU should have taken action before now. It hasn't. It should have made it crystal clear to the British public the consequences of their government's actions - i.e "that's a nice Nissan plant in Sunderland, we can do something about that"...they don't even know ffs. Nothing has happened in that regard. That's how you get to the cabal of crooks running the UK atm.

    Secondly it's a brave Irish person who relies on the Lords.


    The fact we even have to do that says a lot really too.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,644 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    The EU is already taking legal action and has made it clear that it will take further actions if the UK continues with what its going. The EU can't take action against something which hasn't happened yet, this isn’t Minority Report. The consequences of their government's actions are already crystal clear to the UK public, many just refuse to believe it, the consequences of Brexit are clear now and still many refuse to believe. Issuing threats like that would only strengthen the UK government's position, with their domestic audience at least, and give them cover to continues down their current path.

    It is far from guaranteed that the Bill will pass the HoC nevermind the HoL. This UK government could even collapse before this is voted on.

    We all know you want the EU to do something which will harm itself, what is distributing is that you are annoyed that it won't!



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