Haven't taxed the Tractor in years

Easten · 06-07-2021 10:19am #1

As the title says, I haven't put tax on the tractor with at least 7 years. It has been Insured as it's on the farm Insurance. Is there anyway I can Tax it again without having to back tax it?

_Brian · 06-07-2021 10:23am

Transfer the ownership and that cancels all tax due.

Transfer to it to someone who transfers it back to you.

I know one chap transferred it into his own name but added his second name to the title and it worked the same thing.

But if it were me I’d transfer it out of my name and then back in.

Easten · 06-07-2021 10:30am

Will look into this, thanks

whomitconcerns · 06-07-2021 10:36am

For clarity what you are suggesting is tax avoidance, just so your aware. Doesn't change the fact that yes it works and yes it's a done thing by lots of people. But best to know what you are doing so you know what's what. Not going to land you in jail but will definitely make you a hotter topic of you ever have an issue. &#55357;&#56397;

blue5000 · 06-07-2021 11:53am

whomitconcerns wrote: »

For clarity what you are suggesting is tax avoidance, just so your aware. Doesn't change the fact that yes it works and yes it's a done thing by lots of people. But best to know what you are doing so you know what's what. Not going to land you in jail but will definitely make you a hotter topic of you ever have an issue. ��

Well if Apple and Google can avoid corporation tax by registering in Ireland it's hard to condone someone avoiding taxing the tractor by transferring it into someone else's name. AFAIK only tax evasion is illegal.

_Brian · 06-07-2021 12:02pm

blue5000 wrote: »

Well if Apple and Google can avoid corporation tax by registering in Ireland it's hard to condone someone avoiding taxing the tractor by transferring it into someone else's name. AFAIK only tax evasion is illegal.

Tax avoidance by legal means is sensible. Tax evasion is illegal.

Anyone who thinks the likes of Michael O Leary or JP McManus don’t use tax avoidance loopholes is a pure fool.

whomitconcerns · 06-07-2021 12:13pm

Yes a farmer not taxing his tractor is the same as Google's 40bn.....

Anyway I'm not saying it's wrong just that if considering it, should be aware. The government left the loophole there so lots of people continue to take advantage of it. Fwiw I pay my tax

Turbohymac · 06-07-2021 12:16pm

I'm in the same situation as the op..but my tractor never goes on the road..if I needed to sell it and have a clean record I'd transfer ownership to my oh..

thefareast · 06-07-2021 12:20pm

Ford makes (or at least used to) vans in Spain and exports them to the US, the US puts significantly large tariffs on importing vans, trucks etc. so what Ford did was to put seats into the backs of the vans and technically turned them into cars which carried lower duties than vans. When the car/vans arrived in the US after clearing customs Ford would strip out the back seats and sell them as vans. This apparently saved them 100 million+ in taxes.

_Brian · 06-07-2021 12:29pm

Turbohymac wrote: »

I'm in the same situation as the op..but my tractor never goes on the road..if I needed to sell it and have a clean record I'd transfer ownership to my oh..

No need.
No matter what your liability is, when you sell and transfer to new owner the liability is gone for anyone amd the new owner starts afresh with a clean slate.

0lddog · 06-07-2021 12:59pm

Dont overlook that if you are not going to use it on public roads you can avoid all this messing by declaring it 'off the road'

Del2005 · 06-07-2021 1:06pm

thefareast wrote: »

Ford makes (or at least used to) vans in Spain and exports them to the US, the US puts significantly large tariffs on importing vans, trucks etc. so what Ford did was to put seats into the backs of the vans and technically turned them into cars which carried lower duties than vans. When the car/vans arrived in the US after clearing customs Ford would strip out the back seats and sell them as vans. This apparently saved them 100 million+ in taxes.

We were even better with the conversation of passenger vehicles into vans. The bits taken out couldn't be sold they had to be destroyed, brand new leather seats getting smashed.

orm0nd · 06-07-2021 1:17pm

0lddog wrote: »

Dont overlook that if you are not going to use it on public roads you can avoid all this messing by declaring it 'off the road'

You need to declare off the road before the tax runs out and in following years before the off road period expires.

Just be careful messing with transferring ownership, in the event of an insurance claim it could have implications if the insurance company weren't notified of the changes.

K.G. · 06-07-2021 1:42pm

Turbohymac wrote: »

I'm in the same situation as the op..but my tractor never goes on the road..if I needed to sell it and have a clean record I'd transfer ownership to my oh..

But its" the use in a public place" is the key words as far as i know

Bass Reeves · 06-07-2021 1:59pm

_Brian wrote: »

No need.
No matter what your liability is, when you sell and transfer to new owner the liability is gone for anyone amd the new owner starts afresh with a clean slate.

I be careful with this as Government may change the rules relating to this any any stage. There is an element of re-registration happening with higher road tax vehicles especially those that are pre 2008 buts it's even happening with some older 2008 on vehicles. They may move to force new owners to back tax similar to what happens with property tax.

If I had such a tractor I would regularise it and put it off the road when you get it regularised. I did this lately with one of my tractors that was untaxed for 3+ years.

_Brian · 06-07-2021 2:10pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I be careful with this as Government may change the rules relating to this any any stage. There is an element of re-registration happening with higher road tax vehicles especially those that are pre 2008 buts it's even happening with some older 2008 on vehicles. They may move to force new owners to back tax similar to what happens with property tax.

If I had such a tractor I would regularise it and put it off the road when you get it regularised. I did this lately with one of my tractors that was untaxed for 3+ years.

They may indeed close this loophole at some stage. But for the moment it’s not breaking the law to change ownership of a vehicle amd for the moment all outstanding tax arrears are nullified as a result.

Donald Trump · 06-07-2021 4:43pm

whomitconcerns wrote: »

For clarity what you are suggesting is tax avoidance, just so your aware. Doesn't change the fact that yes it works and yes it's a done thing by lots of people. But best to know what you are doing so you know what's what. Not going to land you in jail but will definitely make you a hotter topic of you ever have an issue. ��

Avoidance =/= evasion. The technical term for avoidance is "using your noggin".

It can't land you in any trouble as long as you have everything in order.

leoch · 06-07-2021 6:09pm

Explained better bass ....wat does regularised mean

Bass Reeves · 06-07-2021 6:36pm

leoch wrote: »

Explained better bass ....wat does regularised mean

It means there is no longer back tax owed on it :rolleyes::rolleyes:

leoch · 06-07-2021 7:40pm

How do u do it

Base price · 06-07-2021 7:43pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I be careful with this as Government may change the rules relating to this any any stage. There is an element of re-registration happening with higher road tax vehicles especially those that are pre 2008 buts it's even happening with some older 2008 on vehicles. They may move to force new owners to back tax similar to what happens with property tax.

If I had such a tractor I would regularise it and put it off the road when you get it regularised. I did this lately with one of my tractors that was untaxed for 3+ years.

Surely the vendor has to discharge any LPT liability and not the purchaser. Any Solicitor worth their fee wouldn't allow the sale to proceed unless the liability was paid.

whisky_galore · 06-07-2021 8:19pm

Off road declarations are an absolute dose for anyone with vintage vehicles, did it for a while posting them bits of paper, then forgot. Now have to do the fakey owner switcheroo if I want to put it back on the road again.

zetecescort · 06-07-2021 9:12pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Off road declarations are an absolute dose for anyone with vintage vehicles, did it for a while posting them bits of paper, then forgot. Now have to do the fakey owner switcheroo if I want to put it back on the road again.

Do it online for the vintage tractor here

Charolois 19 · 06-07-2021 9:48pm

There was a case here in the North West several years ago of a man who transferred ownership to his son, (a young child) due to back tax, then back to himself, now these people would of been in the scope of the authorities anyways but the heal of the hunt was a fine in court and the amount of tax owed paid back, only time I ever heard of that happening tho

bfa1509 · 06-07-2021 9:50pm

It's the low hanging small-timers who Revenue like to wail on the most

[Deleted User] · 06-07-2021 10:07pm

bfa1509 wrote: »

It's the low hanging small-timers who Revenue like to wail on the most

Rubbish talk

Bass Reeves · 06-07-2021 10:12pm

Base price wrote: »

Surely the vendor has to discharge any LPT liability and not the purchaser. Any Solicitor worth their fee wouldn't allow the sale to proceed unless the liability was paid.

Yes but if it is not discharged by previous owner it remain a liability on the house. Solicitor will make sure it is discharged. Management charges are similar however I saw a situation lastly where a house was sold with that liability at auction and new owner had to discharge.

My point with cars tax is all it would take is a ministerial order to make the liability dischargeable on change of ownership and let car buyers make sure liability is discharged before purchase

bfa1509 · 06-07-2021 10:16pm

Mayo_fan wrote: »

Rubbish talk

Why is that rubbish talk Mayo_fan? Just look at the name and shame record that revenue publish quarterly.

[Deleted User] · 06-07-2021 10:36pm

bfa1509 wrote: »

Why is that rubbish talk Mayo_fan? Just look at the name and shame record that revenue publish quarterly.

The quarterly name and shame list you refer to is a really short one when you put it into the perspective of how many taxpayers there are out there. You are talking about some material evasion on one part (Surrey you can’t argue to this) and then the bit I assume you are talking about are the smaller fines section which relate to absolute chancers operating in the black economy which is absolute proper order, to get your name published means you took the absolute piss and stuck your head in the sand and ignored the many chances that revenue would have given you to come back on side and avoid publication. Poor example of revenue targeting the small hardworking guys because 95% of the publications deserve it.

The fact that someone hasn’t taxed their tractor in 7 years (maybe never on the road so fair enough) but plenty of posters can chime in with some workarounds mean your original post is simply not true or else it wouldn’t be possible to drive with no tax

Just feel your original comment was a lazy stereotype, off topic and added zero to the discussion

bfa1509 · 06-07-2021 11:00pm

Mayo_fan wrote: »

The quarterly name and shame list you refer to is a really short one when you put it into the perspective of how many taxpayers there are out there. You are talking about some material evasion on one part (Surrey you can’t argue to this) and then the bit I assume you are talking about are the smaller fines section which relate to absolute chancers operating in the black economy which is absolute proper order, to get your name published means you took the absolute piss and stuck your head in the sand and ignored the many chances that revenue would have given you to come back on side and avoid publication. Poor example of revenue targeting the small hardworking guys because 95% of the publications deserve it.

The fact that someone hasn’t taxed their tractor in 7 years (maybe never on the road so fair enough) but plenty of posters can chime in with some workarounds mean your original post is simply not true or else it wouldn’t be possible to drive with no tax

Just feel your original comment was a lazy stereotype, off topic and added zero to the discussion

I have no problem with people posting workarounds. I do have a problem with the people who say that revenue are not going to bother with such small cases. That's completely untrue.

I've had plenty of petty interactions with revenue along with many people I know, which gives me more than the right to say the above.

Donald Trump · 06-07-2021 11:28pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Yes but if it is not discharged by previous owner it remain a liability on the house. Solicitor will make sure it is discharged. Management charges are similar however I saw a situation lastly where a house was sold with that liability at auction and new owner had to discharge.

My point with cars tax is all it would take is a ministerial order to make the liability dischargeable on change of ownership and let car buyers make sure liability is discharged before purchase

Not really workable for tractors.
I could buy an old yoke that has been lying at the back of a ditch with grass growing around it for the last 15 years, do it up and want to put it on the road.

Or a fella wanting to buy a small yoke that the previous owner used genuinely only as a scraper tractor around the yard for example. The seller isn't going to want to have to discount the price for X years tax to sell it to him.

Haven't taxed the Tractor in years

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