Andrew Brown Shooting (US)

hawley wrote: »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/apr/22/andrew-brown-shooting-north-carolina

This report is muck; we get 16 paragraphs of character defense, blame shifting to his mother being killed and him dropping out of school etc. - yes, those are issues to discuss in the aftermath, with social safety nets etc and policies or whatever, but not excuses or explanation for the incident which is centrally being reported on, and I'm really cheesed off that Guardian's piece in this regard is basic muck.

Having tried to get a different take from WaPo I see the suspect was reportedly unarmed, with the police department being especially mum about what happened and as of yet, have declined* to publish the incident footage which appears to be the prime demand of the demonstrators on the ground. WaPo's best of knowledge about the incident thus far - thank goodness for a cup of actual journalism with regard to actually telling us what went down before hyping the reader up on sympathies for the deceased before they have any knowledge of what at all happened:

At around 8:30 a.m. Wednesday, the sheriff’s office said, deputies arrived at the 400 block of Perry Street to execute an arrest warrant for Brown in Elizabeth City, located about 45 miles south of Norfolk. Pasquotank County Sheriff’s Chief Deputy Daniel Fogg said in a video statement that Brown was “a felon with a history of resisting arrest,” but he did not release additional details. Court records show Brown had been previously convicted of misdemeanor drug possession and had pending drug charges.

“Our training and our policies indicate under such circumstances there is a high risk of danger,” Fogg said in the recorded statement.

Those who watched the encounter told local media that Brown got into his car and started to drive away from law enforcement. That’s when, neighbors say, the sheriff’s deputies started shooting at Brown, firing off six to eight shots. The News & Observer said that one neighbor said she found 14 shell casings. Daniels told The Post that it remained unclear whether Brown was shot at from outside his car. He added that all three deputies fired their guns.


Police have yet to release any information about whether Brown was unarmed.

Neighbor Demetria Williams recounted to the Associated Press that Brown’s car skidded from his yard and hit a tree. She told WITN that the deputies tried to resuscitate Brown after the shooting but that it was too late.

“When they opened the door, he was slumped over already,” Williams said, adding that Brown “wasn’t a threat.”

“I knew he was gone,” Williams said.

When authorities removed Brown’s vehicle, the car was riddled with multiple bullet holes and had a broken rear windshield, AP reported.

there's other quote from the neighbors about how the incident has disturbed them etc. but that don't add any pertinent details to the immediate incident.

NAACP, Carolina Public Press et al. are expected to file a motion today for a court order to release the body camera footage - * it is important to note that in North Carolina state law stipulates the police are 'only required' to release footage under a court order. I don't know if this is a simplification by the WaPo author if it is is the implication that the Police could, but are reluctant, to publish the video. From the reporting of the incident, the videos would likely be incredibly graphic and stir up a lot of emotions, however I'm not entirely sure that should be a valid excuse to not do so - that leads to 'we ****ed up so badly and so violently that we can't show it to you because you'd be super angry with us.' I hope they release the video soon, I figure it won't come out before a court order. Currently, seems like no definitive conclusions can be reasonably argued about who is at fault for what with immediate regard to the shooting that occurred.

edit: forgot the link

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/04/23/elizabeth-city-andrew-brown-shooting/

markmoto wrote: »

Or perhaps watching these videos to understand what law enforcement is dealing with on a daily basis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ykxQyNM9vw

Or what the public deals with?



I believe there are all sorts of videos that we could call back up to gaslight this case before we have any definitive facts about it.

So all speculation and no facts yet. I'll wait for the video.

Is it just a coincidence that all of these guys have a long criminal history, and all fail to comply with police?

Overheal wrote: »

Did Tamir Rice resist? Did Philando Castile?

The cop didn't know that Tamir Rice had a toy gun. He was responding to a report of someone with a gun so he likely expected he was going to meet an armed person. Added to that, the gun that Tamir Rice had didn't have the mandated orange barrel tip that airsoft replicas are supposed to have. The cop said he saw Tamir Rice reaching for the gun in his waistband. Video footage is poor but it seems to show that Rice could have been reaching for the gun so I guess we'll have to give the cop the benefit of the doubt on that one. The cop was cleared by a Grand Jury and also by a DOJ investigation that concluded in 2020. They said that there wasn't enough evidence to charge him with a crime.

Regarding Philando Castile, I'm not so much on the side of the cop. I think the cop overreacted but the jury thought otherwise. I don't agree with the jury verdict. The cop was so close that if he saw Castile's hand on a pistol, he had time to react. Maybe not so much time to react in the case of Tamir Rice (if the gun was real).

AmyMurphy22 wrote: »

Thanks. They're going to court on Wednesday to release the video to the public. Brace yourselves.

It's also only one bodycam, from one of the officers at the back, only 20 seconds, and seems to start once the shooting has already begun.

Unfortunately, it really looks like the police are hesitant to show them any more because they're trying to hide something.

twowheelsonly wrote: »

"In your opinion" it's confirmation bias or whatever the latest buzz word is.
In my opinion, backed by figures, it's not.

There are a little over 10 million arrests per year in the USA.
How many of these end up in shootings ? How many of these end up in fatal shootings ? How many of these end up in fatal shootings of a black man ? How many of these end up in fatal shootings of an unarmed compliant black man ?

The answers will confirm whether your theory of confirmation bias stands up or not.

Do these numbers excuse the behavior of any cop in an incident of police brutality? Didn’t I already mention how drastically America changed after 9/11 even though it only happened once? We can do better than “it doesn’t happen more than a couple thousand times a year so why should be attentive to deaths of suspects at the hands of police?”

twowheelsonly wrote: »

My point is that it doesn't point to 'confirmation bias' as you were asserting. I'm not saying that any shooting is ok, just pointing out that there is zero evidence of confirmation bias when you break down the numbers.

Please read the quote of the user I was responding to when I mentioned confirmation bias. I’m not sure it is related to what you are talking about. Police brutality can occur regardless of the criminal record of the victim.