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The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

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Comments

  • #5792
    Shedite27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,613 ✭✭✭Shedite27


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    It's recency bias.

    There's a reason you can't get into the HOF until you're retired at least 5 years.
    Absolutely.

    Evaluate it in 5 years time and it will paint a clearer picture.


  • #5793
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,349 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote: »
    Lads iv seen "edelman to the hall of fame?" Articles a few different spots now. Is there even any pats fans on here who believe he should be anywhere near it? Cant understand it at all

    They're just good for clicks. Gets people annoyed enough to read how someone could possibly think that.


  • #5794
    el Fenomeno
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,942 ✭✭✭el Fenomeno


    Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote: »
    Lads iv seen "edelman to the hall of fame?" Articles a few different spots now. Is there even any pats fans on here who believe he should be anywhere near it? Cant understand it at all

    Pats HOF? Instantly.

    NFL HOF? No.


  • #5795
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    BonnieSituation wrote:
    It's recency bias.

    There's a reason you can't get into the HOF until you're retired at least 5 years.
    I think being a three time Superbowl winner and Superbowl MVP will stand the test of time.


  • #5796
    Jasper Fit Pedestrian
    Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭ Jasper Fit Pedestrian


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I think being a three time Superbowl winner and Superbowl MVP will stand the test of time.

    Do you think he's hall of fame?


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  • #5797
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote:
    Do you think he's hall of fame?
    I'm not sure, no chance he's a first ballot but could get in later on.
    He wasn't just a receiver, he was a brilliant return man too, excellent blocker as well.
    I'd like him to Heinz Ward as in he was a great team player rather than an individual superstar.
    I'd like to see both those guys in the Hall.


  • #5798
    el Fenomeno
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,942 ✭✭✭el Fenomeno


    I love Edelman, but I think Hines Ward has a far, far more impressive résumé with regards to getting into the HoF.


  • #5799
    adrian522
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 16,592 Mod ✭✭✭✭adrian522


    And Ward can't even get into the final round of voting so very difficult to see a path for Edelman.


  • #5800
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    el Fenomeno wrote:
    I love Edelman, but I think Hines Ward has a far, far more impressive résumé with regards to getting into the HoF.
    I never said who was better than who if them. I'm saying they were both great team players and not individual superstars. They both could have had way better individual careers if they weren't so team orientated.
    As I said I'd like to see both get in at some stage.


  • #5801
    Jasper Fit Pedestrian
    Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭ Jasper Fit Pedestrian


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I never said who was better than who if them. I'm saying they were both great team players and not individual superstars. They both could have had way better individual careers if they weren't so team orientated.
    As I said I'd like to see both get in at some stage.

    Id argue edelman.woukdnt be anywhere close to as celebrated if he didn't land in the perfect.spot. I thought welker was better in the same spot being honest.

    From purely a stats perspective edleman was an average reciever at best.

    I appreciate you giving the other side of the argument all the same I don't think I'll ever agree but it's interesting to hear


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  • #5802
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,111 ✭✭✭Christy42


    My main thing is I don't think there was a point anyone was arguing Julian was one of the best in the nfl which counts him out for me. Really good player on the right team.

    Aaron Donald offered an apology. Victim states there was a case of mistaken identity. Not sure how many people look like Donald but anyway.


  • #5803
    Hococop
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,741 ✭✭✭Hococop


    Think a video was posted of your man getting beat up by a group of people and it's donald dragging people off him


  • #5804
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Christy42 wrote:
    My main thing is I don't think there was a point anyone was arguing Julian was one of the best in the nfl which counts him out for me. Really good player on the right team.
    His yardage isn't great by any stretch but his clutch plays, some of which lead to a Superbowl MVP, were what made him stand out. On top of that he was an excellent punt returner for many years.
    He's the guy you want with seconds left on the clock in the fourth quarter.


  • #5805
    Jasper Fit Pedestrian
    Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭ Jasper Fit Pedestrian


    eagle eye wrote: »
    His yardage isn't great by any stretch but his clutch plays, some of which lead to a Superbowl MVP, were what made him stand out. On top of that he was an excellent punt returner for many years.
    He's the guy you want with seconds left on the clock in the fourth quarter.

    Ya and I agree they bump him to an extent but his numbers are average nfl reciever numbers at best they are to low. I think he's had 2 1k years ever. Marshal falks recieving numbers are better than his as a running back. Honestly darren sproles has a better hall of fame shout and noone will be calling for that


  • #5806
    rebelyell99
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 407 ✭✭rebelyell99


    Edelman was absolutely clutch in the playoffs but HOF worthy? .I mean Wes Welker isnt in the HOF and I would say he had a better career overall then Edelman imo .


  • #5807
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,111 ✭✭✭Christy42


    eagle eye wrote: »
    His yardage isn't great by any stretch but his clutch plays, some of which lead to a Superbowl MVP, were what made him stand out. On top of that he was an excellent punt returner for many years.
    He's the guy you want with seconds left on the clock in the fourth quarter.

    I will still take Julio or Fitzgerald or peak Antonio at the end of a game every single time. The difference is Tom Brady. I will take Adams or Allen over him as well any time during a game.

    He was a really good player and deserved to be a wr1 for a team in the league however I am not sticking in everyone who hung around that dynasty for long enough just because of their rings. The likes of Brady and Gronk would have dominated in nearly any team. I can't say the same for Edelman.


  • #5808
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,246 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    Hococop wrote: »
    Think a video was posted of your man getting beat up by a group of people and it's donald dragging people off him

    Saw on Twitter the guy that was attacked has acknowledged that AD was not the culprit and has apologised for wrongly accusing him. The venue has it all on CCTV according to AD’s lawyer so I’d say he knew the chance of a payoff was gone and he is now trying to save face.


  • #5809
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Christy42 wrote:
    I will still take Julio or Fitzgerald or peak Antonio at the end of a game every single time. The difference is Tom Brady. I will take Adams or Allen over him as well any time during a game.
    Fitzgerald and Brown are two of the greatest ever and I'd have them up there in clutch moments with Edelman.
    Jones didn't perform in his only Superbowl. Adams and Allen haven't been to a Superbowl but Adams has played below his normal standard in his NFCCG appearances. Keenan hasn't done well in his playoff performances either.
    Only comparisons there in clutch moments are Fitzgerald and Brown but I'd still take Edelman first in those moments. He's just done it in those moments more often.


  • #5810
    the baby bull elephant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭the baby bull elephant




    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSirjCbbP1c


  • #5811
    Shedite27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,613 ✭✭✭Shedite27


    Edelman will come down to the same thing as Eli, nobody thinks his play deserves HOF, but NFL loves nostalgia, and a Superbowl MVP and one of the best ever catches/highlights in a Superbowl will get him a lot of kudos.

    Career yardage, TD's and receptions sometimes get overshadowed.


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  • #5812
    Jasper Fit Pedestrian
    Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭ Jasper Fit Pedestrian


    Eli has decent numbers at least there's a reason santonio holmes is not in the hof


  • #5813
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Santonio had a short enough career, how many full seasons did he play? Five maybe six?
    Eli has 360 tds and 240 ints which isn't a good look. He'll deffo be in the hall though, could even be first ballot.


  • #5814
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,349 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote: »
    Eli has decent numbers at least there's a reason santonio holmes is not in the hof

    Yeah, there is really no comparison between Eli's numbers and Edelman. A fine career for Edelman given his limitations but he never came close to the player Eli was.

    Pointing to rings as main support for a WR shows just shows how incredibly weak the claim is.

    There is unsurprising talking out of both sides of certain mouths going on here. I don't remember Edelman being noted as a HOF level talent during discussions around the quality of the Patriots teams. Must remember this when it inevitably comes up in the future.


  • #5815
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,737 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Santonio had a short enough career, how many full seasons did he play? Five maybe six?
    Eli has 360 tds and 240 ints which isn't a good look. He'll deffo be in the hall though, could even be first ballot.

    Wasn’t the short career the knock on Terrell Davis also ? I don’t think length of time in the league should be given that much weight honestly. Quality over quantity as they say.

    I don’t think that the TD to int ratio will hurt Eli because one of the all time greats in Brett farve had nearly 400 ints in his career. While obviously stats are important in the nfl, there are times when I think analysts get too bogged down in them.


  • #5816
    Jasper Fit Pedestrian
    Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭ Jasper Fit Pedestrian


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Santonio had a short enough career, how many full seasons did he play? Five maybe six?
    Eli has 360 tds and 240 ints which isn't a good look. He'll deffo be in the hall though, could even be first ballot.

    Santonio had one good year and a few decent years his but his career stats are essentially the same as edleman


  • #5817
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote:
    Santonio had one good year and a few decent years his but his career stats are essentially the same as edleman
    Yeah but a very short career too. That always goes against the player.


  • #5818
    Jasper Fit Pedestrian
    Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭ Jasper Fit Pedestrian


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Yeah but a very short career too. That always goes against the player.

    But as a non hall of famer outperformed edleman in far fewer years while himself being average to below average I'm no sure I understand your argument


  • #5819
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Lily Thoughtless Swimmer wrote:
    But as a non hall of famer outperformed edleman in far fewer years while himself being average to below average I'm no sure I understand your argument
    What argument? All I said was I wouldn't rule out Edelman getting in. He had a long career, has 3 rings and a Superbowl MVP, he was a clutch receiver and an excellent punt returner too. He was a great blocker, threw td passes too, a true team player. He has the second most receptions and receiving yards in the postseason behind only the GOAT receiver Jerry Rice in those categories. He is the only player to have 340 or more yards in more than one postseason.
    The only knock is his regular season receiving yards totals.


  • #5820
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,737 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Yeah but a very short career too. That always goes against the player.

    Why does it go against the player ? It doesn’t always because Gale sawyers had a short career and retired in 1972(well 1971) and was elected to the HOF in 1977 which is five years. Eagle eye and nerd(the two people talking) do either of you subscribe to the whole “ you can’t write the history of football without person X or Y” logic for the hall of fame ?


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  • #5821
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,928 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Itssoeasy wrote:
    Why does it go against the player ? It doesn’t always because Gale sawyers had a short career and retired in 1972(well 1971) and was elected to the HOF in 1977 which is five years. Eagle eye and nerd(the two people talking) do either of you subscribe to the whole “ you can’t write the history of football without person X or Y†logic for the hall of fame ?
    I'm not saying is should go against him, I'm saying it does. It took 11 years for Terrell Davis to get in and it shouldn't. He was ridiculously good.

    As far as every a
    player is concerned I look at their career and decide if I think they should get in or not.

    I believe that Edelman and Heinz Ward should get in. Edelman's postseason numbers and his clutchness are hugely important in that. The same goes for Ward.


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