Reference/background check employment

Route1 · 15-02-2021 10:08pm #1

Just have a query regarding the references/background check. I’m applying for a job at one of Dublin’s big tech companies. I understand they use an external background checking service, what is the general obligation to provide as references. As in I would try to keep this new job completely under wraps until I was cast iron in this new role. So the idea of using a manager or senior person is not appealing to me. I definitely have a colleague who I would use but ideally I wouldn’t have to use someone from my current process.

I understand this is probably a difficult question to answer as lots of places have different processes and regulations. But I’m guessing if anyone can shed any light on what options I may have available to me.

John Doe1 · 15-02-2021 10:12pm

Use you cousin on your mothers side with a different surname. Be grand

Ubbquittious · 15-02-2021 10:13pm

Route1 wrote: »

Just have a query regarding the references/background check. I’m applying for a job at one of Dublin’s big tech companies. I understand they use an external background checking service, what is the general obligation to provide as references. As in I would try to keep this new job completely under wraps until I was cast iron in this new role. So the idea of using a manager or senior person is not appealing to me. I definitely have a colleague who I would use but ideally I wouldn’t have to use someone from my current process.

I understand this is probably a difficult question to answer as lots of places have different processes and regulations. But I’m guessing if anyone can shed any light on what options I may have available to me.

Dont provide any reference until they ask for one

The place im working now never even saw my CV. Companies say they use this that and the next thing but youd be surprised how few actually bother

Route1 · 15-02-2021 10:39pm

Really yeah?

slipperyox · 15-02-2021 10:50pm

Last year I was looking for a change (15 years in same job)
Had interview, then current line manager (good relationship) phoned me to say he was just asked for a reference, and he's sorry I'm leaving.

Next day, prospective company phone me to say I didn't get the job.
I called them unprofessional, as it put me in an iffy position with long term work.

Just a caveat.

[Deleted User] · 15-02-2021 10:53pm

slipperyox wrote: »

Last year I was looking for a change (15 years in same job)
Had interview, then current line manager (good relationship) phoned me to say he was just asked for a reference, and he's sorry I'm leaving.

Next day, prospective company phone me to say I didn't get the job.
I called them unprofessional, as it put me in an iffy position with long term work.

Just a caveat.

Maybe you had got it before they talked to the line manager.

slipperyox · 15-02-2021 10:55pm

I though about that, but The manager is also a good friend.

stampydmonkey · 15-02-2021 10:56pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Maybe you had got it before they talked to the line manager.

...burn

..edit...unburn

Gremlinertia · 15-02-2021 10:58pm

Thread moved to Work and Jobs - note local charter applies

berocca2016 · 15-02-2021 11:02pm

Route1 wrote: »

Just have a query regarding the references/background check. I’m applying for a job at one of Dublin’s big tech companies. I understand they use an external background checking service, what is the general obligation to provide as references. As in I would try to keep this new job completely under wraps until I was cast iron in this new role. So the idea of using a manager or senior person is not appealing to me. I definitely have a colleague who I would use but ideally I wouldn’t have to use someone from my current process.

I understand this is probably a difficult question to answer as lots of places have different processes and regulations. But I’m guessing if anyone can shed any light on what options I may have available to me.

The external checking companies will just contact HR generally to get them to confirm your position and length of seniority. You generally won't get to pick who they contact as they generally have their own contacts. You will be asked to nominate who your line manager is but this will only generally be checked if its an SME with no HR to confirm.

Make sure to fill every box out as per exact fact as they're literally by the book. The reference check should start once contracts are signed, so if youre serious about taking the job, you'll have already handed in your notice. (And have nothing to hide).

I don't think you can complete this in secret as they'll more than likely contact HR themselves in your previous role and you'll be asked by your recruiter in the new place is it OK to share your details with the fact check place.

Route1 · 16-02-2021 1:13am

Well, I haven't handed in my notice. That would be contingent on getting the applied for job, my company is quite as small company so the "HR Department" would definitely let my manager know. Surely this is a big no-no to not have the consent of the prospective hire, could jeopardise both jobs.

OMM 0000 · 16-02-2021 6:04am

slipperyox wrote: »

Last year I was looking for a change (15 years in same job)
Had interview, then current line manager (good relationship) phoned me to say he was just asked for a reference, and he's sorry I'm leaving.

Next day, prospective company phone me to say I didn't get the job.
I called them unprofessional, as it put me in an iffy position with long term work.

Just a caveat.

How did they know who your line manager is?

Never put your references on your CV. You only provide them when asked.

Also, it sounds like your line manager said something which caused you to not get the job. Reference checking is done when they are going to give you the job. It's just a sanity check.

AngryLips · 16-02-2021 8:54am

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Never put your references on your CV. You only provide them when asked.

Normally it is done after a conditional job offer has already been made (conditional on reference checks coming back okay)

Route1 · 16-02-2021 11:21am

AngryLips wrote: »

Normally it is done after a conditional job offer has already been made (conditional on reference checks coming back okay)

Is it common place then not to choose your references?

AngryLips · 16-02-2021 1:02pm

Route1 wrote: »

Is it common place then not to choose your references?

Yea you provide the references usually. But it's about timing, I wouldn't offer up references unless they've already made a conditional offer and pay negotiated etc. As another poster has mentioned, they could in theory contact the HR team in your previous companies independently from your given references but that has never happened to my knowledge for any jobs I have applied for.

berocca2016 · 17-02-2021 9:00am

Route1 wrote: »

Well, I haven't handed in my notice. That would be contingent on getting the applied for job, my company is quite as small company so the "HR Department" would definitely let my manager know. Surely this is a big no-no to not have the consent of the prospective hire, could jeopardise both jobs.

I would be highly surprised if you didn't sign contracts before doing the reference check.

I think you need to decide whether you want the new job or not, no matter what job you ever go for in the future they will check your references as part of the process!

bucketybuck · 17-02-2021 9:07am

AngryLips wrote: »

As another poster has mentioned, they could in theory contact the HR team in your previous companies independently from your given references but that has never happened to my knowledge for any jobs I have applied for.

I'm infinitely more likely to contact somebody else within the industry and try to get a straight answer than I am to contact any of the cherry picked names given on a CV.

I'd never contact their current employers though, that's just clearly and obviously bad form.

berocca2016 · 17-02-2021 10:37am

bucketybuck wrote: »

I'm infinitely more likely to contact somebody else within the industry and try to get a straight answer than I am to contact any of the cherry picked names given on a CV.

I'd never contact their current employers though, that's just clearly and obviously bad form.

This is what third party fact checkers do, I've been through the situation before. Your offer and contract is conditional on you passing the background check which includes contacting your current employer. There is absolutely no way around to get a final offer without this, I suppose the reason for the independent check is to stop the cherry picking of names!

Jim2007 · 17-02-2021 11:40am

berocca2016 wrote: »

This is what third party fact checkers do, I've been through the situation before. Your offer and contract is conditional on you passing the background check which includes contacting your current employer. There is absolutely no way around to get a final offer without this, I suppose the reason for the independent check is to stop the cherry picking of names!

They do a lot more than that to justify the fees...

I received a couple of reports that included: news media scans, social media, court records, education confirmation etc... basically anything they could get their hands on easily.... they did flag up one guy that had changed his name by deed poll, turned out he a very colourful past in Australia...

mariaalice · 17-02-2021 12:16pm

Jim2007 wrote: »

They do a lot more than that to justify the fees...

I received a couple of reports that included: news media scans, social media, court records, education confirmation etc... basically anything they could get their hands on easily.... they did flag up one guy that had changed his name by deed poll, turned out he a very colourful past in Australia...

I don't understand how people are not more aware of it.

A very large MNC one of mine now works for had a very long pre-employment check which was done by an outside company it was the usual, education qualification etc plus a financial background check and social media profile check as well.

berocca2016 · 17-02-2021 12:39pm

mariaalice wrote: »

I don't understand how people are not more aware of it.

A very large MNC one of mine now works for had a very long pre-employment check which was done by an outside company it was the usual, education qualification etc plus a financial background check and social media profile check as well.

Yup that too, when I was going through it I was petrified of any irregularities I didn't know about on my records!!

Thing is though, if you've nothing to hide you'll be absolutely fine!

Tpcl20 · 17-02-2021 12:44pm

Recently moved jobs within the public sector. My current employer gave a reference back in October and I still have no definite start date for the job (which the hiring agency says I was successful in applying for and will commence soon). It's very uncomfortable between myself and my boss and he keeps requesting for me to hand in resignation so that I can be replaced but I don't have a contract for the new position yet. I've sent in all the required documentation and I'm just waiting to hear back from the hiring agency. I've never experienced anything like this and it's extremely embarrassing.

JustAThought · 17-02-2021 5:53pm

I ln your circumstances wouldn’t hand in any notice until I had a start date even if it was the public sector.

I’ve been stressed & stung by references in the past - one of which required me to sign an authorisation allowing access to search anything & contact anyone for a reference and character check they felt necessary. I got the job somewhat surprisingly but the same big tech company ****ed me around from day one and treated me and everyone else like human offal. That should have been a sign.

I always try and negotiate a contract and salary offer/ start day in principle in writing before I allow access - its very hard as they have you over a barrel.

Some companies - govt funded such as DCU & Cork University despite paying lip service to HR law and legislation that says you can’t discriminate demands that you give 3 written references with your application (CU) despite asking for favouritism disqualifing the candidate - or my personal anti-favourite of DCU demanding you fill out all of their form for employment check which includes demanding to know if care for an ageing parent before deciding if they will employ you - and if there is history of heart conditions or alzheimers in your family. Unbelievable really.

I’ve found that most other Irish run & managed companies are reasonable & understand the dilema you are in.

I wonder if any of this has ever been challenged by GDPR or a FOI request if the offer is then dropped? I’d say there a lot of people in jobs who if their backgrounds were scrutinised might be out of a job.

Isn’t it illegal to give a bad reference in Ireland or is that just old wives tales?

I’ve also worked (extremely hard) for a few companies who then say they only confirm dates and don’t give references as a matter of policy after you are in. They’d ask you to dig up your dead granny to give them one thou on your way IN.

Interested Observer · 17-02-2021 6:53pm

If the company who are doing the check is HireRight, then they will verify (or have you verify for them) that you have worked where you say you worked. If you don't want to alert your existing company you can do that using your payslips and/or contract. There's a good chance they aren't going to look for the "Route1 is a great sort of worker altogether" sort of reference.

Mrs OBumble · 17-02-2021 8:14pm

berocca2016 wrote: »

The reference check should start once contracts are signed

I've never ever received a contract before reference checking was done.

Reference/background check employment

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