US Presidential Election 2020 Thread II - Judgement Day(s)

Call me Al · 06-11-2020 01:18PM

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

I can only assume the people who are genuinely shocked by what he said are the kind of people who don't pay much attention to politics outside of landmark events such as the presidential debates and this week.

That rambling, repetitive speech full of blatant falsehoods, inflammatory claims and personal grievances is typical when he talks just to the Press.

It was always going to go down like this if he lost.

I wasn't surprised, but I was very disappointed that he felt emboldened to go on tv to the whole world and say what he said.
That this was ok, the GOP didnt distance themselves from the ráiméis and terrible accusations he made about honest people going about their jobs, and that he was allowed walk away from that podium without having to justify or defend a single word of it.

Carfacemandog · 06-11-2020 01:22PM

I have to say I am taking quite a bit of joy in the moaning about "fraud" (or as the rest of us call it, mail in voting) from the very same people who ignored and mocked those pointing out the dangers of the GOP removing so much funding from ele toral protections over the last four years.

everlast75 · 06-11-2020 01:25PM

Carfacemandog wrote: »

I have to say I am taking quite a bit of joy in the moaning about "fraud" (or as the rest of us call it, mail in voting) rom the very same people who ignored and mocked those pointing out the dangers of the GOP removing so much funding from ele toral protections over the last four years.

Particular credit needs to go to this lady too

https://twitter.com/TheWomensOrg/status/1324653254450569218?s=20

Inspirational stuff

Retr0gamer · 06-11-2020 01:28PM

Only 18k behind in Pennsylvania after the latest numbers dump.

Hurrache · 06-11-2020 01:29PM

peteeeed wrote: »

intersting in respect to trumps twitter rants , steve bannon has had his twitter account suspended

For advocating the decapitation of 2 federal employees. Not comparative to Trump.

signostic · 06-11-2020 01:33PM

Was watching Ingraham on Fox last night trying to justify Trumps fraud claims, she had to 2 "witnesses" to the "fraud" in AZ, a man an election observer who said the count was run ok but he had to stay 6 feets away and a woman who said she and her Republican friends were given markers (sharpies) to vote while Democrats were given pencils...

Shelga · 06-11-2020 01:34PM

Wouldn't putting Trump in prison enrage his base and possibly lead to violence?

Not that the law should not be pursued for this reason, but it makes me worry...

Quin_Dub · 06-11-2020 01:34PM

UpBack1234 wrote: »

Trump has spent is whole adult life mired in lawsuits and no one has made a single criminal charge stick yet. I somehow doubt he'll see the inside of any jail cells.

Lewis_Benson wrote: »

With his money, no he wont, but he should be jailed several times over for the way he behaves.

Here's the thing though.

He didn't actually win almost any of those literally thousands of court cases. He either delayed and frustrated poorer opponents until they gave up/ran out of money or he settled out of court quietly.

Now though , all his bluster has been utterly exposed - People *know* he's a liar , People *know* he doesn't have anything like the money he claims to have and so on.

His entire ediface of bluster and Bravado has been destroyed.

The next time he walks into a court room he's going to get wiped out.

The next time he tries to shine on a creditor and float his debt further down the river on the promise of some big future success , they will laugh in his face and foreclose.

If nothing else , his time as President has removed almost every single one of his methods of staying in the game.

Hurrache · 06-11-2020 01:35PM

Penn wrote: »

I don't think so. Seems like a normal shift change, especially given what time it is over there.

Tapper and Blitzer aren't usually on until their afternoon/our evening, even throughout this week from what I can remember. But then again this isn't a usual day.

jaykay74 · 06-11-2020 01:36PM

signostic wrote: »

a woman who said she and her Republican friends were given markers (sharpies) to vote while Democrats were given pencils...

Thats weird. How would anyone know who you are going to vote for ?

Carfacemandog · 06-11-2020 01:36PM

everlast75 wrote: »

Particular credit needs to go to this lady too

https://twitter.com/TheWomensOrg/status/1324653254450569218?s=20

Inspirational stuff

Absolutely. I saw her name mentioned quite a bit in the last year but only read an article on her role this morning, absolutely great job on her and that may tip future elections across state level also if they keep that momentum going. Georgia may well become another Virginia sooner rather than later.

breezy1985 · 06-11-2020 01:37PM

jaykay74 wrote: »

Thats weird. How would anyone know who you are going to vote for ?

They probably all looked like Karens.

More likely these women were activists with Trump badges on. But its even more likely to just be a lie

Movementarian · 06-11-2020 01:38PM

jaykay74 wrote: »

Thats weird. How would anyone know who you are going to vote for ?

Exactly, they wouldn't. Its just more nonsense

Carfacemandog · 06-11-2020 01:39PM

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Here's the thing though.

He didn't actually win almost any of those literally thousands of court cases. He either delayed and frustrated poorer opponents until they gave up/ran out of money or he settled out of court quietly.

Now though , all his bluster has been utterly exposed - People *know* he's a liar , People *know* he doesn't have anything like the money he claims to have and so on.

His entire ediface of bluster and Bravado has been destroyed.

The next time he walks into a court room he's going to get wiped out.

The next time he tries to shine on a creditor and float his debt further down the river on the promise of some big future success , they will laugh in his face and foreclose.

If nothing else , his time as President has removed almost every single one of his methods of staying in the game.

Added to that, his upcoming legal battles won't be with Dan Wisniewski and Sons Construction Ltd. like so many have previously been, but with entities that have much deeper pockets and can't be war-of-attritioned to death with legal fees.

jaykay74 · 06-11-2020 01:39PM

Movementarian wrote: »

Exactly, they wouldn't. Its just more nonsense

You'd think she could construct a more logical fake argument that doesn't sound totally stupid.

L1011 · 06-11-2020 01:39PM

Movementarian wrote: »

Exactly, they wouldn't. Its just more nonsense

You register your party for primary purposes; so it is available

The claimed 'fraud' is nonsense though; plus in an election where it was thought there was a substantial number of Republicans that wouldn't vote for Trump it would have failed to work anyway.

Jo jo the eskimo · 06-11-2020 01:40PM

Is Bannon not on parole?
Can he not be arrested ?

Big Pussy Bonpensiero · 06-11-2020 01:42PM

CNN stating that DJT has a "stranglehold on the Republican Party." Senior Republican figures were apparently on Fox echoing the sentiments of the president, Republicans you would expect would be front runners for the 2024 nomination.
There's very little to suggest so far that the Rep party will be dropping the Trump family when all is said and done in this election. The opposite seems more likely.

06-11-2020 01:43PM

seamus wrote: »

As it stands, if it's a 268/270 split where Trum has PA & GA, there are no practical states where a faithless elector would/can support him. The only other blue states it's legal are deep blue states like NY or IL.

A state being deep blue isn't necessarily enough to prevent it. In fact, if there was going to be an issue, it would most likely occur in a far-far-left state than any other. If Biden has 270, it only needs one faithless elector to vote for anyone else - they don't have to flip to Trump. If the electoral college split is 269-268-1, that's not enough to be elected, it must be an absolute majority of 270. If a Hawaiian elector cast their vote for, say, Bernie Sanders[1], that's enough, and Hawaii are one of many states with no penalty for the faithless elector.

Now this is all fairly academic, I think it's far more likely that Biden gets 302 votes than 270, and even if it does come down to that, it's a lot harder for an elector to stick to a principled stance when they know they'll be publically vilified for having an actual impact instead of casting a protest vote.

[1]Why pick Hawaii and Bernie Sanders? Because that's exactly what happened in 2016.

paul71 · 06-11-2020 01:44PM

everlast75 wrote: »

Particular credit needs to go to this lady too

https://twitter.com/TheWomensOrg/status/1324653254450569218?s=20

Inspirational stuff

My God, that is an incredible amount of work, it is literally Daniel O'Connell proportions. I may need to rethink what I said earlier about Georgia not replicating presidential votes into the Senate run offs if someone like that is driving voter registrations in Georgia.

Jimmy Bottlehead · 06-11-2020 01:46PM

Big Pussy Bonpensiero wrote: »

CNN stating that DJT has a "stranglehold on the Republican Party." Senior Republican figures were apparently on Fox echoing the sentiments of the president, Republicans you would expect would be front runners for the 2024 nomination.
There's very little to suggest so far that the Rep party will be dropping the Trump family when all is said and done in this election. The opposite seems more likely.

I am trying not to be dramatic, but Trump is like a cancer for the party. Yes, he's pulled in competitive figures, but I suspect there will a long-term detrimental impact due to his prominence in the GOP, their continues support of him, and the culture he's created (racism, anti-democratic, autocratic desires).

These results feel like they'll be a match to the powder-keg that the US is right now. Heavily armed protesters are about to get VERY pissed-off in the next couple of hours.

Akabusi · 06-11-2020 01:47PM

I had hoped for a landslide victory and was initially disappointed with how close it was, but I'm really enjoying this now, the Trumps will had had to go through the ecstasy of Florida with the confidence that others would follow and this was backed up when most States where only counting of the election day votes. Once the mail votes have started to be counted and it has slowly become apparent to them that its a lost cause we get to see the hysterical tweets, the lashing out and the pure desperation. Apart from the car crash media briefing, and Anderson Coopers line about a turtle on his back in the sun, the videos of Trump supporters chanting count the votes in AZ whilst at the same time chanting stop the count in PA will always live in my memory. This certainly is a year like no other.

MJohnston · 06-11-2020 01:48PM

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

I am trying not to be dramatic, but Trump is like a cancer for the party. Yes, he's pulled in competitive figures, but I suspect there will a long-term detrimental impact due to his prominence in the GOP, their continues support of him, and the culture he's created (racism, anti-democratic, autocratic desires).

These results feel like they'll be a match to the powder-keg that the US is right now. Heavily armed protesters are about to get VERY pissed-off in the next couple of hours.

It has yet to be seen, but I have a vague feeling that Trumpism only really works for Trump.

Brian? · 06-11-2020 01:48PM

5 hours of sleep and I’m back baby! That’s the longest sleep I’ve had since Monday. Feel great.

No President elect yet, but everything looks good for Biden still.

I suggest we shut this thread down and move to the Biden presidency thread

Gbear · 06-11-2020 01:50PM

everlast75 wrote: »

Particular credit needs to go to this lady too

https://twitter.com/TheWomensOrg/status/1324653254450569218?s=20

Inspirational stuff

It was perhaps a blessing in disguise that she didn't win (or, had stolen from her), the governorship of Georgia. She should keep doing what she's been doing.

They should make a cabinet position for election engagement and put her in it.

breezy1985 · 06-11-2020 01:50PM

Brian? wrote: »

5 hours of sleep and I’m back baby! That’s the longest sleep I’ve had since Monday. Feel great.

No President elect yet, but everything looks good for Biden still.

I suggest we shut this thread down and move to the Biden presidency thread

Might as well its all over. Biden has it in the bag just look at the bookies lads

Mellor · 06-11-2020 01:52PM

seamus wrote: »

A 268/270 split at this stage would need AZ, PA & GA to go Trump's way.

That would leave Nevada as the faithless elector to target. It's not possible in Nevada.

His only hope really would be that he keeps PA *and* gets NV and AZ back on his side. Then he could get faithless electors in GA to flip.

As it stands, if it's a 268/270 split where Trum has PA & GA, there are no practical states where a faithless elector would/can support him. The only other blue states it's legal are deep blue states like NY or IL.

Unless there are some major odd shifts in states such as PA & GA going to Biden and NV & AZ going to Trump, the faithless electors thing is a non-runner.

The question was what happens IF its a draw or close results. Nobody said it was likely.

IF it's a close result, ANY faithless electors could be critical. The claim that every state has to have faithless electors for it to be significant is plainly wrong. That's not related to how likely it is to happen.

Any elector can be faithless, it's nothing to do with how close a state was.

Graham wrote: »

Haven't many states since legislated to prevent that happening again?

Some do. Not all. Some of the ones that do have no way of enforcing the law.
Some laws fine the elector, or void the vote, but don't prevent it.

Brian? · 06-11-2020 01:54PM

MJohnston wrote: »

It has yet to be seen, but I have a vague feeling that Trumpism only really works for Trump.

I’m a bit disappointed people are even using the term “Trumpism”. It’s not a philosophy or an ethos of any kind. It’s an empty vessel people pour their own hatred and fear into. Trump doesn’t actually stand for anything.

To steal a quote. Dude, say what you want about National Socialism, but at least it was an ethos. Can anyone tell me the core values of Trumpism?

It’s a personality cult. That’s it. It dies with Trump.

ancapailldorcha · 06-11-2020 01:56PM

Brian? wrote: »

I’m a bit disappointed people are even using the term “Trumpism”. It’s not a philosophy or an ethos of any kind. It’s an empty vessel people pour their own hatred and fear into. Trump doesn’t actually stand for anything.

To steal a quote. Dude, say what you want about National Socialism, but at least it was an ethos. Can anyone tell me the core values of Trumpism?

It’s a personality cult. That’s it. It dies with Trump.

I'd say that "Trumpism" is just bare rage and prejudice and nothing more than that. It won't die with Trump, it'll simply find a new avatar now that the genie's out of the lamp. The GOP no longer need to pretend to condemn racism or aim for some facade of respectability. That's the big change Trump made to US politics.

Brian? · 06-11-2020 01:57PM

Gbear wrote: »

It was perhaps a blessing in disguise that she didn't win (or, had stolen from her), the governorship of Georgia. She should keep doing what she's been doing.

They should make a cabinet position for election engagement and put her in it.

I’d love to see her take HUD or Education secretary. She’s exactly what the Democrats should be about. Strong community activity for the marginalised. I’ve enormous respect for her.

US Presidential Election 2020 Thread II - Judgement Day(s)

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