Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

martingriff · 05-10-2020 11:04PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Its just not so simple and its foolish to think it is.

It was admitted tonight, NPHET are only concerned with Covid, no other health issues

We knew that already it was why they were set up. Did you believe they were some super group of economists and health together. Covid was there remit

drunkmonkey · 05-10-2020 11:05PM

sterz wrote: »

Didn't he say that Israel were trying something similar and no real sign as of yet that it's working?

He mentioned Melbourne a few times as well...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT5bXmdfdq8

manniot2 · 05-10-2020 11:05PM

Mervyn Skidmore wrote: »

A lot of people here seem to be praising the government for standing up to NPHET. Showing them who's in charge, etc. It's bizarre, they're only trying to protect people. This isn't a win.

At what cost? Please tell me what price are we willing to pay for this,and I don’t mean economically.

amadangomor · 05-10-2020 11:05PM

iguana wrote: »

WTAF are you on about? What we know about the virus now that we didn't know then is actually worse. We knew before the lockdown that the IFR was most likely somewhere between 2% and 0.5% and almost certainly toward the lower end of that. The WHO currently estimates the IFR as .62% which was a surprise to precisely no-one with a clue. Our new information is how very contagious it is, that it's airborne and that it's not seemingly seasonal. We've also learned that it leads to a very high rate of post-viral issues in even very mild infections which can cause people problems for months. We've also learned that scientists who warned immunity may not be as good as we hoped may have been right as there are a number of confirmed cases of reinfection already. So maybe you were in a tizzy in March thinking this virus was something so awful that the really bad thing it is seems good. But don't put your lack of knowledge in March on everyone else.

The implications (economic and personal) of a lockdown were also crystal clear in March too. What is it that you think was a surprise to anyone about that?

If you'd more paragraphs and didn't start with such an aggressive opening line and I might have read this.

igCorcaigh · 05-10-2020 11:06PM

spookwoman wrote: »

https://twitter.com/davidcullinane/status/1313236405703913477?s=20

Is this the case?

I'm confused. I thought our ICU capacity was far less.

Goldengirl · 05-10-2020 11:06PM

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

They need to be challenged and have different opinions put to them.

Opinions like some here ?
Or expert opinions?

An Ri rua · 05-10-2020 11:06PM

NPHET should have informed the Strategic Communications Unit. End of.

Bang out of order. He who tweets first, sh1ts the golden egg first. Tweet tweet.

Thomas.. · 05-10-2020 11:06PM

Holohan has that megalomania look about him

Wouldn't surprise me if he came in like a bulldozer

Happydays2020 · 05-10-2020 11:07PM

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Yes it is a problem.
It’s a problem that is unquantified because the government have not got in place the necessary system to allow safe travel that detects people who are positive. It doesn’t have aN adequate tracing system For those that have travelled either, so if your issue is with people being cut off and airlines going bust then you can see how safe travel needs to be introduced for a variety of reasons.

I want safer travel with testing etc, but the metrics are that there is very little travel at the moment. Probably 10% of normal levels. and I can safely say that a week on a beach in Greece with outdoor dining is far safer than here plus the vitamin d.

martingriff · 05-10-2020 11:07PM

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Did anyone ask any of these government spokespeople what they intend to do when the cases don’t start decreasing two and three weeks into this lockdown?

Because I reckon they won’t.

Schools, colleges and foreign travel are three major problems That level 3 does nothing about.

Blame the Virus. I am not kidding that was essentially what Donnelly said

niallo27 · 05-10-2020 11:07PM

Mervyn Skidmore wrote: »

Because the health systems vary and capacity varies across the world.

So if the HSE said hospitals were not at risk and this information was ignored would you still agree with these experts.

Strumms · 05-10-2020 11:07PM

Mervyn Skidmore wrote: »

Because the health systems vary and capacity varies across the world.

I agree, we can’t just copy and paste the responses of other nations into our own scenario. They have vastly differing resources, differing populations in numbers, density and social makeups.. But the ‘look, LOOK this country are...’ merchants don’t want to recognize that.

Happydays2020 · 05-10-2020 11:08PM

Goldengirl wrote: »

Opinions like some here ?
Or expert opinions?

Would you advocate LEVEL 5 now?

spookwoman · 05-10-2020 11:08PM

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Is this the case?

I'm confused. I thought our ICU capacity was far less.

That's the capacity I don't know about staffing. I gather an extra 17 is for the winter.

Goldengirl · 05-10-2020 11:09PM

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Yes and they will take responsibility.

They will be called granny killers in under a month!

Ignore professional expert advice as a politician at your peril.

Yes. Remember Boris saying much the same as Leo , and the following fortnight it was lockdown in UK with cases out of control.

polesheep · 05-10-2020 11:09PM

MrMusician18 wrote: »

When was the last time a senior civil servant was dumped on by a senior government Minister? I don't think even Neary (Central bank governor) got such a public dressing down. It was completely uncalled for. Extraordinary.

Cannot see how Holohan or NPHET can continue. As I said earlier I suspect many will resign in the morning. Government will be charting this course all on their own.

And being blamed for making a bollocks of it now is no less than this Government deserve.

There are plenty of scientists and medics who were not in agreement with NPHET. I'm sure there would be enough of them willing to step forward and serve their country.

Professor Moriarty · 05-10-2020 11:10PM

Strumms wrote: »

I agree, we can’t just copy and paste the responses of other nations into our own scenario. They have vastly differing resources, differing populations in numbers, density and social makeups.. But the ‘look, LOOK this country are...’ merchants don’t want to recognize that.

It's cherry-picking to suit a crude political narrative. Hurler on the ditch stuff.

Mervyn Skidmore · 05-10-2020 11:10PM

niallo27 wrote: »

So if the HSE said hospitals were not at risk and this information was ignored would you still agree with these experts.

I would say that the HSE has a record of mismanagement so I would be sceptical of their information.

Lundstram · 05-10-2020 11:11PM

igCorcaigh wrote: »

I'm very confused about ICU capacity.
Can anyone enlighten me?

March Lockdown, on the day the decision was made:
68 in ICU
380 in hospital
Admissions to both were rising rapidly.

Today, as NPHET recommends Level 5 lockdown:
21 in ICU
134 in hospital
Both are rising slowly.

280 ICU beds in Ireland.

gmisk · 05-10-2020 11:11PM

polesheep wrote: »

There are plenty of scientists and medics who were not in agreement with NPHET. I'm sure there would be enough of them willing to step forward and serve their country.

I'd say Ciara Kelly would love to take over....

manniot2 · 05-10-2020 11:11PM

Thomas.. wrote: »

Holohan has that megalomania look about him

Wouldn't surprise me if he came in like a bulldozer

He was on the front of our national newspapers on the brink of resignation a few years ago over the cervical check scandal. Short memories.

seamus · 05-10-2020 11:11PM

Quite a few freaking out about Varadkar's dressing down of NPHET, but it will gain him a lot of kudos in the "He's just saying what everyone is thinking" stakes.

That is, that it's very easy for NPHET to recommend a hard lockdown when none of them will have to deal with the consequences of it. They'll all go home on their decent state salaries and private health insurance, virtually unaffected by any economic shocks or healthcare restrictions.

I wonder is Varadkar livid at Holohan leaking to the press last night and so is giving him a warning to not play political games.

MrMusician18 · 05-10-2020 11:11PM

polesheep wrote: »

There are plenty of scientists and medics who were not in agreement with NPHET. I'm sure there would be enough of them willing to step forward and serve their country.

No matter what your opinions, who would be willing to serve on a body that's going to get that kind of public treatment?

stockshares · 05-10-2020 11:12PM

Are these ICU numbers correct

https://twitter.com/davidcullinane/status/1313236405703913477?s=19

FintanMcluskey · 05-10-2020 11:12PM

iguana wrote: »

WTAF are you on about? What we know about the virus now that we didn't know then is actually worse. We knew before the lockdown that the IFR was most likely somewhere between 2% and 0.5% and almost certainly toward the lower end of that. The WHO currently estimates the IFR as .62% which was a surprise to precisely no-one with a clue. Our new information is how very contagious it is, that it's airborne and that it's not seemingly seasonal. We've also learned that it leads to a very high rate of post-viral issues in even very mild infections which can cause people problems for months. We've also learned that scientists who warned immunity may not be as good as we hoped may have been right as there are a number of confirmed cases of reinfection already. So maybe you were in a tizzy in March thinking this virus was something so awful that the really bad thing it is seems good. But don't put your lack of knowledge in March on everyone else.

The implications (economic and personal) of a lockdown were also crystal clear in March too. What is it that you think was a surprise to anyone about that?

So your theory is the virus has actually got worse the more we have learned since March????

titan18 · 05-10-2020 11:12PM

I can't believe people and government are complaining about NPHET leaking stuff. The government leak everything before they do it. The cabinet meeting today pretty much had live commentary on their discussions. Seems perfectly fair that another group would use leaks to fire back at the government then.

smellyoldboot · 05-10-2020 11:12PM

Lundstram wrote: »

280 ICU beds in Ireland.

Total ICU beds.....

Tenzor07 · 05-10-2020 11:12PM

polesheep wrote: »

There are plenty of scientists and medics who were not in agreement with NPHET. I'm sure there would be enough of them willing to step forward and serve their country.

I'd like to see Dr. Martin Feeley heading up the new NPHET committee if there is to be a new one...

niallo27 · 05-10-2020 11:13PM

Mervyn Skidmore wrote: »

I would say that the HSE has a record of mismanagement so I would be sceptical of their information.

I totally agree with you there but even they can't say things are ok when they are not.

gmisk · 05-10-2020 11:13PM

seamus wrote: »

Quite a few freaking out about Varadkar's dressing down of NPHET, but it will gain him a lot of kudos in the "He's just saying what everyone is thinking" stakes.

That is, that it's very easy for NPHET to recommend a hard lockdown when none of them will have to deal with the consequences of it. They'll all go home on their decent state salaries and private health insurance, virtually unaffected by any economic shocks or healthcare restrictions.

I wonder is Varadkar livid at Holohan leaking to the press last night and so is giving him a warning to not play political games.

Zero indication that Holohan leaked it, or anyone else in NPHET.
It is a pretty dysfunctional government currently I wouldn't be surprised if they leaked it themselves.

Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

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