What oil for the old girl

[Deleted User] · 11-01-2019 2:24pm #1

74 bmw 2002,
What do you recomend ?

Thanks

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 2:56pm

A3/B4 0W40 or 5W40.

It will also run OK on 10W40.

That is what I would use if it was my car

.

unkel · 11-01-2019 3:18pm

Surely you wouldn't want to use fully synth on an engine of that era?

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 3:24pm

unkel wrote: »

Surely you wouldn't want to use fully synth on an engine of that era?

Why?

Sure, I would. Have used in all my cars.

Gravelly · 11-01-2019 3:24pm

I always use mineral oil in my classics. Wouldn't use a synthetic unless the engine had been rebuilt.

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 3:27pm

Gravelly wrote: »

I always use mineral oil in my classics. Wouldn't use a synthetic unless the engine had been rebuilt.

I use synthetic oils wherever possible because they are better than mineral oils.

Gravelly · 11-01-2019 3:31pm

Seweryn wrote: »

I use synthetic oils wherever possible because they are better than mineral oils.

Yes synthetic oils are far superior to mineral oils - for the close-tolerance engines designed for them.

I prefer to use an oil that the engine was designed for, and was specified by the manufacturer, but everyone to their own.

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 3:43pm

Gravelly wrote: »

Yes synthetic oils are far superior to mineral oils - for the close-tolerance engines designed for them.

I prefer to use an oil that the engine was designed for, and was specified by the manufacturer, but everyone to their own.

Synthetic oils did not exist when some engines were designed. Same as radial tyres which I prefer to diagonal tyres.

Synthetic oil i.e. 0W40 has more less the same viscosity as 15W40 oil (which you probably have in mind) at working temperatures. Both oils are thick when cold, synthetic less so which makes it superior.

Mind that I wouldn't use any say 5W20 or 0W20 oil (which is designed for specific multi valve engines) or any low SAPS or long life type oil in my Classic.

Gravelly · 11-01-2019 3:47pm

Seweryn wrote: »

Synthetic oils did not exist when some engines were designed. Same as radial tyres which I prefer to diagonal tyres.

Synthetic oil i.e. 0W40 has more less the same viscosity as 15W40 oil (which you probably have in mind) at working temperatures. Both oils are thick when cold, synthetic less so which makes it superior.

Mind that I wouldn't use any say 5W20 or 0W20 oil (which is designed for specific multi valve engines) or any low SAPS or long life type oil in my Classic.

Like I said, everyone to their own.

I've owned and run classics for nearly 30 years, and rebuilt engines from the 50's to the 70's, and I've never had issues with running mineral oils in them - I have seen issues with oil seals and gaskets etc. on some classics that used synthetics.

[Deleted User] · 11-01-2019 4:02pm

OK Gravelly,
what should I get!
Thanks

Gravelly · 11-01-2019 4:05pm

BrownFinger wrote: »

OK Gravelly,
what should I get!
Thanks

I use Millers Classic Sport 20w60 or Halfords (I know!) Classic 20w50.

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 4:05pm

Gravelly wrote: »

I've owned and run classics for nearly 30 years, and rebuilt engines from the 50's to the 70's, and I've never had issues with running mineral oils in them.

You are not going to have problems using mineral oils. But synthetic oils are just better.

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 4:11pm

Gravelly wrote: »

I use Millers Classic Sport 20w60 or Halfords (I know!) Classic 20w50.

I see you only mention the viscosity grade. What about the quality class of the oil? That is often more important than the viscosity grade.

So called classic oils are very often of too low class for the application.

Gravelly · 11-01-2019 4:12pm

Seweryn wrote: »

I see you only mention the viscosity grade. What about the quality class of the oil? That is often more important than the viscosity grade.

So called classic oils are very often of too low class for the application.

I named those oils because I've been using them in all kinds of classics for years.

You seem to have a bee in your bonnet about mineral oils!

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 4:23pm

Gravelly wrote: »

You seem to have a bee in your bonnet about mineral oils!

No, as I mentioned there will be no issue with using mineral oils. But if so, why not get a quality oil (SJ or SL) instead for the same money or quite often less

.

Example:

https://www.micksgarage.com/d/engine-oils-and-lubricants/products/177098/total-quartz-5000-15w40-multigrade-mineral-engine-oil-5-litre

Or even better:

https://www.micksgarage.com/d/engine-oils-and-lubricants/products/177099/total-quartz-7000-10w40-semi-synthetic-engine-oil-5-litre

Gravelly · 11-01-2019 4:30pm

Seweryn wrote: »

No, as I mentioned there will be no issue with using mineral oils. But if so, why not get a quality oil (SJ or SL) instead for the same money or quite often less .

Example:

https://www.micksgarage.com/d/engine-oils-and-lubricants/products/177098/total-quartz-5000-15w40-multigrade-mineral-engine-oil-5-litre

Or even better:

https://www.micksgarage.com/d/engine-oils-and-lubricants/products/177099/total-quartz-7000-10w40-semi-synthetic-engine-oil-5-litre

I wouldn't use either in a classic as I think they are a little too thin, but as I keep saying to you, everyone to their own.

What I use has worked for me for decades, in numerous different cars.

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 6:19pm

Gravelly wrote: »

I wouldn't use either in a classic as I think they are a little too thin...

No, they are not too tin. I have just checked the oil specification for the mentioned car and this time of year the old manual says it should be 10W30 oil used (so 5W30 or 0W30 is also fine / better) - so even thinner than the one I listed previously.

During the summer XW40 to XW50 (in very hot climate) is recommended, which means in Irish climate 0W40, 5W40 or 10W40 is the sweet optimum.

Gravelly wrote: »

What I use has worked for me for decades, in numerous different cars.

And it will work for ever without issues. It doesn't mean it is a better choice.

Tazio · 11-01-2019 6:32pm

I'm half scared to reply

but I've been using this : https://www.commaoil.com/passenger-vehicles/products/view/262

for the last 5 years in different classics (1970 VWs 1970s Alfa Romeos).. I'm not a mechanic; just do all my own maintenance.

Service Classification: SAE 20W50 API SE CC
Typical Inspection Data:
Recommended by Comma for applications requiring:
Density @ 20 °C 0.870 g/cm3
Viscosity @ 100 °C 17.2 cSt
Viscosity @ 40 °C 145 cSt
Viscosity Index 120
Viscosity CCS @ -15 °C 8000 cP
Sulphated
Ash Mass 1.1%
Zinc 0.08%
Calcium 0.22%
Phosphorus 0.07%
Colour Green
Pour Point -27 °C

It smells delicious almost like olive oil.

But; the oil is changed every 1000 miles or annually which ever comes first. Overkill? no idea. but it's a great excuse to get dirty

here is some light reading for you:

https://www.oilspecifications.org/api_eolcs.php

If you're not driving the nuts of the car and do very regular changes there are some great modern mineral oils out there... just check the rating.

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 6:41pm

Tazio wrote: »

If you're not driving the nuts of the car and do very regular changes there are some great modern mineral oils out there... just check the rating.

Exactly... You pay the same price for much better, higher quality oil so why would you put that tick low quality fluid into your engine instead, I have no idea.

You said you do your oil changes every 1600 km, which is fine. I believe your annual mileage is low. The engine oil in a classic engine should be changed every 6 months or so.

ianobrien · 11-01-2019 8:32pm

OP, if it's a standard enough engine, I'd be using what was recommended by the manufacturer, probably 20W50 mineral oil. That's what the engine was designed for. The older engines had greater tolerances, wider oil galleries, etc compared to modern engines, hence the "thicker" oil being used.

Before I had the engine rebuild on the Mk2 Escort, I ran it on Castrol 20W50 as that's what my mechanic recommended (he built the odd race/rally Ford engine so knew what worked). When the engine was rebuilt (to much tighter tolerances complete with a high pressure oil pump), the same mechanic / engine builder recommended Castrol Edge Sport 10W60 due to the higher pressure oil pump. (The engine had a lot of other goodies fitted also)............

Seweryn · 11-01-2019 8:38pm

ianobrien wrote: »

OP, if it's a standard enough engine, I'd be using what was recommended by the manufacturer, probably 20W50 mineral oil. That's what the engine was designed for. The older engines had greater tolerances, wider oil galleries, etc compared to modern engines, hence the "thicker" oil being used.

The recommended oil for this time of year for the car is 10W30 as stated above and as per the owner's manual (mineral or synthetic). So, why would you use thicker oil that is not recommended?

ianobrien · 13-01-2019 9:16am

Seweryn wrote: »

The recommended oil for this time of year for the car is 10W30 as stated above and as per the owner's manual (mineral or synthetic). So, why would you use thicker oil that is not recommended?

According to the owners manual, it's 20W50.......

Seweryn · 13-01-2019 9:55am

ianobrien wrote: »

According to the owners manual, it's 20W50.......

Not during the winter. 20W is too thick for the winter and the manufacturer at the time recommended 10W30, which is what was commonly available.

ianobrien · 13-01-2019 10:29am

Seweryn wrote: »

Not during the winter. 20W is too thick for the winter and the manufacturer at the time recommended 10W30, which is what was commonly available.

As I said, not according to the owners manual

Wibbs · 13-01-2019 11:32am

Gravelly wrote: »

everyone to their own.

What I use has worked for me for decades, in numerous different cars.

That would be my take too G. I'm no expert(no shit Sherlock), but down the years I've found my various engines seemed to have a "favourite" oil. Even when the label numbers were the same. When I ran a Renault 5 turbo I found it hated fully synthetic. Was more rattly and consumed it like a two stroke, yet mineral/semi synthetic of the same grade was quite different. No idea why, though the engine in them was designed back in the 60's IIRC, so maybe that's it. On my current Honda B18c engine I've only ever fed it fully synthetic 5W 40, as it would likely implode in short order on mineral. Even then I've noticed differences with different oils. A few years back on a recommendation I threw in Millers nano Racing oil and the difference and improvement was obvious. Ran quieter and the PPM readings on the NCT dropped noticeably.

Gravelly · 13-01-2019 3:09pm

Wibbs wrote: »

That would be my take too G. I'm no expert(no shit Sherlock), but down the years I've found my various engines seemed to have a "favourite" oil. Even when the label numbers were the same. When I ran a Renault 5 turbo I found it hated fully synthetic. Was more rattly and consumed it like a two stroke, yet mineral/semi synthetic of the same grade was quite different. No idea why, though the engine in them was designed back in the 60's IIRC, so maybe that's it. On my current Honda B18c engine I've only ever fed it fully synthetic 5W 40, as it would likely implode in short order on mineral. Even then I've noticed differences with different oils. A few years back on a recommendation I threw in Millers nano Racing oil and the difference and improvement was obvious. Ran quieter and the PPM readings on the NCT dropped noticeably.

I'd the same experience with an MGB I had, that was fitted with a Stage 2 engine. Was so rattly when I tried synthetic in it I was afraid to run it and changed it straight away to mineral - sounded way better.

Seweryn · 13-01-2019 4:01pm

Wibbs wrote: »

That would be my take too G. I'm no expert(no shit Sherlock), but down the years I've found my various engines seemed to have a "favourite" oil. Even when the label numbers were the same. When I ran a Renault 5 turbo I found it hated fully synthetic. Was more rattly and consumed it like a two stroke, yet mineral/semi synthetic of the same grade was quite different. No idea why, though the engine in them was designed back in the 60's IIRC, so maybe that's it. On my current Honda B18c engine I've only ever fed it fully synthetic 5W 40, as it would likely implode in short order on mineral. Even then I've noticed differences with different oils. A few years back on a recommendation I threw in Millers nano Racing oil and the difference and improvement was obvious. Ran quieter and the PPM readings on the NCT dropped noticeably.

That is interesting.

I found any older Honda I had (from the '80s or '90s) likes to run on good synthetic and the engine runs perfectly fine and to its best.

The air cooled Volkswagen will obviously run on anything including tar sands, but I think the 10W40 that is in the engine at the moment seems to do a great job - the engine runs cool, the oil stays clear and does not burn a drop. It will be changed soon as always is.

Never noticed a problem with an engine when running on synthetic (quite the opposite) including the old Volkswagen. The only worry I would have is too thick oil at startup (15W or 20W) which increases the engine wear. But happily here in Ireland we do not experience very cold weather.

irshmerc · 14-01-2019 1:37am

Hi,

Halfords classic oil 20/50, every 5k miles. Is what i use in my 1971 1602.

Good luck

Seweryn · 14-01-2019 9:22am

irshmerc wrote: »

Hi,

Halfords classic oil 20/50, every 5k miles. Is what i use in my 1971 1602.

How long does it take you to cover that mileage?

Henry Ford III · 14-01-2019 10:20pm

irshmerc wrote: »

Hi,

Halfords classic oil 20/50, every 5k miles. Is what i use in my 1971 1602.

Good luck

I've been using this stuff for years in a 1979 Escort RS2000 with no issues.

I'd go for whatever BMW specified originally OP.

irshmerc · 14-01-2019 10:54pm

Seweryn wrote: »

How long does it take you to cover that mileage?

I'd say i get through 10k mile a year, so i change the oil twice a year at least just for my own peace of mind.
I get where your coming from with the synthetic oil, it probably is better for modern engines designed with it in mind, even a bmw m10 bored to the hilt with modern internals would benefit from synthetic over dino i'd say, but the op's 40year old M10 would be better with proper old 20/50 dino oil, just my 2cents like.

Good luck

What oil for the old girl

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