Landlord being difficult- considering rtb adjudication

Brbiyer · 27-11-2018 8:55am #1

Hi,
This is a a bit of rant and also seeking a bit of advice from anyone who has been through the process. I have scoured the threads here and it looks like a lot of people were landlords who had to face difficult tenants and rtb.

We have been renting this particular property for close to a year now. We have our own in another area- but I wanted to cut down my commute to work-so I moved the kids and we moved to this rental in the country. AT the time of renting, the landlord seemed to be looking for long term renter sand that suited us fine.
Now, about 3 weeks ago she told us that she wont be renewing our lease because she needs the property for her son who is renovating his house and after that she doesn't really know what she is going to do with the property- she may sell it. I don't buy this story a all. Mostly because this is not her only rental property and the fact that we had a difficult relationship with her for the past few months.
The difficulty has been that whenever anything like toilets, showers, plumbing, etc needed to be fixed- she would never reply to my text for ages or the job wouldn't get done in a reasonable time frame. I had to be constantly text her to get around to jobs- and then she would make it feel like it was somehow our fault. For example- the septic tank had a little overflow and the and she said that that hadn't happened before (!like it was just us!) and that she thought it was only because of the rain-now we had only been there for 2 months and it certainly wasn't us that made it so. Apparently they found baby wipes when emptying it and her son tried to tell us off! Now my kids are over 8years and we don't use baby wipes at all- also did i tell you we had been there only 2 months at that stage?
Another time, both the showers stopped working- again she said that it was strange that had happened- I don't know what she thinks a family of 2 adults and 2 children do with the showers!- Never mind the fact that the water is really hard and they have no water softer here to protect their appliances.
Now, I did insist that she organise to have external lights put in as we live in the country side and its pitch dark- I think that's basic and safety and that she is required to do that really- she was very cross with me that stage. We did have a good few months during the summer when thankfully all was working fine and I didn't need to contact her.
Also, there was a tendency for workmen (usually her son and his crew) turn up suddenly without so much as a text. She lives next door, so she can see clearly if we are in or not...but its really no excuse
Now she has slapped me with a notice- it is not a valid notice as it's not a statutory declaration. I am going to dispute that. I was wondering do I have a leg to stand on ass she only wants the property or her son fora few weeks, while I have to move my whole family and the children are in in school in the area.
Also, she is not giving us a proper reference. I had a friend ring her to test the waters- she said that we paid the rent promptly but thats all she is prepared to say- what landlord is going to rent us another property with a reference like that.
we are quiet and we are clean and always pay rent on time.
She also owns the property next door to us and she has renewed their lease no problem. They have also asked to fix stuff which she hasn't done-but they haven't really followed up as they are building their own house and moving soon.
Any advice is appreciated.

Browney7 · 27-11-2018 9:34am

Have all the notices been given in writing?

myshirt · 27-11-2018 9:38am

It sounds like it may be a mechanism to get you out, and not bona fides, agreed. But it also sounds like you are a right pain in the arse. If the relationship has went sour, just move on.

RossieMan · 27-11-2018 9:41am

I don't know why people insist on having their contracts extended when they don't have a good relationship with the landlord. Move on, lives too short for both sides to out up with arseholes.
Some people just don't mix.

Brbiyer · 27-11-2018 9:46am

All very good advice-thanks so much ,NOT!
Have you considered the fact that maybe we haven't been able to find anything else suitable and would like some time?

antoinolachtnai · 27-11-2018 10:06am

Brbiyer wrote: »

All very good advice-thanks so much ,NOT!
Have you considered the fact that maybe we haven't been able to find anything else suitable and would like some time?

If this is important to you and you are prepared to have a long fight then you will be able to stay for some time. It is your family’s home so best thing might be to appoint a solicitor.

DubCount · 27-11-2018 10:44am

Brbiyer wrote: »

All very good advice-thanks so much ,NOT!

How to win friends and influence people ?

Mrs OBumble · 27-11-2018 11:25am

You know ahe has a son. You don't know if he needs to move in or not - but you cannot prove that he doesn't.

She is not required to give you a reference - but you might point out to her that unless she gives you a good one you're not going to find somewhere else to move to.

You certainly have the grounds for a legal fight, which will buy you time at least.

In the meantime, try not to break anything else. Or if you do, just fix it yourself.

meijin · 27-11-2018 12:12pm

you have 28 days to file the dispute with RTB, wait until day 25 and do it online

if there is no statutory declaration, few months wait until you get the hearing date, and easy win for you

more in PM ;-)

Fol20 · 27-11-2018 12:33pm

Honestly your attitude here stinks so you need to up that. People here are just giving you advice so no need to bite down their neck. As others have pointed out, potentially you might be a pain to deal with if your constantly texting, i know for my own situation, i normally never increase rent for sitting tenants but for this one guy, due to the way he interacts with me there is no love loss between us and rent will be increased to the max the moment i get the chance. and even doing jobs for him now, i have either ignored them if they are not critical or dug my feet in to slow them down. Once is current Part 4 expires, he will be getting the boot.

What comes around goes around so you need to maintain a friendly relationship or its time to move on. If you dig your heels in here, you can forget about receiving any reference which will make it more difficult for you to move out. They are not obliged to give a reference and if i have something bad to say, its better to say nothing at all. LL are not your friend and dont have to bs their way so you can get a place.If you submit an RTB dispute, it is all public and can be viewed by anyone, any time i vet tenants, i check this out and if i see the dispute you might lodge, i would run a mile.

To your benefit,I would request an affidavit before you move out and you should move out. If the ll wants the place back ,they will get it back, it will just take more time and you will shoot yourself in the foot for other applications. You have no proof it is or is not legit. If they re-let the place within 6months of you leaving, they are obliged to give you first right to decline. If they dont, you then have a valid claim but its only after confirming this.

Browney7 · 27-11-2018 12:53pm

Fol20 wrote: »

Honestly your attitude here stinks so you need to up that. People here are just giving you advice so no need to bite down their neck. As others have pointed out, potentially you might be a pain to deal with if your constantly texting, i know for my own situation, i normally never increase rent for sitting tenants but for this one guy, due to the way he interacts with me there is no love loss between us and rent will be increased to the max the moment i get the chance. and even doing jobs for him now, i have either ignored them if they are not critical or dug my feet in to slow them down. Once is current Part 4 expires, he will be getting the boot.

What comes around goes around so you need to maintain a friendly relationship or its time to move on. If you dig your heels in here, you can forget about receiving any reference which will make it more difficult for you to move out. They are not obliged to give a reference and if i have something bad to say, its better to say nothing at all. LL are not your friend and dont have to bs their way so you can get a place.If you submit an RTB dispute, it is all public and can be viewed by anyone, any time i vet tenants, i check this out and if i see the dispute you might lodge, i would run a mile.

To your benefit,I would request an affidavit before you move out and you should move out. If the ll wants the place back ,they will get it back, it will just take more time and you will shoot yourself in the foot for other applications. You have no proof it is or is not legit. If they re-let the place within 6months of you leaving, they are obliged to give you first right to decline. If they dont, you then have a valid claim but its only after confirming this.

In fairness, the second reply the OP got was being labelled a pain in the arse and two out of the three issues cited by the OP seemed very reasonable to me to have remedied as quick as possible - raw sewage entering the garden and no working showers. Any decent LL shouldn't drag their feet on such issues and should remedy as quick as possible and shouldn't require the tenant to chase up regularly to get an update. If a tenant feels you are fobbing them off, of course they'll keep onto you. It's not like they asked for new lightbulbs to be fair.

Clearly, the rental market isn't the scary place it's made out to be by LL's on this forum where tenants will stay rent free for two years and kill your first born if LLs can drag their feet for essential repairs and then if the tenant "pisses them off" turf them out.

Fol20 · 27-11-2018 1:09pm

Browney7 wrote: »

In fairness, the second reply the OP got was being labelled a pain in the arse and two out of the three issues cited by the OP seemed very reasonable to me to have remedied as quick as possible - raw sewage entering the garden and no working showers. Any decent LL shouldn't drag their feet on such issues and should remedy as quick as possible and shouldn't require the tenant to chase up regularly to get an update. If a tenant feels you are fobbing them off, of course they'll keep onto you. It's not like they asked for new lightbulbs to be fair.

Clearly, the rental market isn't the scary place it's made out to be by LL's on this forum where tenants will stay rent free for two years and kill your first born if LLs can drag their feet for essential repairs and then if the tenant "pisses them off" turf them out.

Well we are getting his opinion here also. In my case, its all based on the relationship with the tenant, with some i have had very good ones where i will fix whatever they want and get people out asap. Others based on experience can request everything and anything and expect a plumber to come out within 3 hours on the weekend. Having no shower in the house is a bit much however from the attitude he showed after a small comment, it would lead me to believe, he might be like this in real life as well.

Browney7 · 27-11-2018 1:15pm

Fol20 wrote: »

Well we are getting his opinion here also. In my case, its all based on the relationship with the tenant, with some i have had very good ones where i will fix whatever they want and get people out asap. Others based on experience can request everything and anything and expect a plumber to come out within 3 hours on the weekend. Having no shower in the house is a bit much however from the attitude he showed after a small comment, it would lead me to believe, he might be like this in real life as well.

I'm sure if someone responded to a thread started by you if you were looking for advice dealing with a delinquent tenant and based on the detailed post you were labelled "a right pain in the arse" you wouldn't exactly be responding with a response filled with puppy dogs and rainbows.

TJ Mackie · 27-11-2018 1:20pm

Brbiyer wrote: »

Also, she is not giving us a proper reference. I had a friend ring her to test the waters- she said that we paid the rent promptly but thats all she is prepared to say- what landlord is going to rent us another property with a reference like that.

She is under no obligation to give you any reference. Your future living arrangements are not her concern or obligation.

Frankly, it was a mistake to list her as a referee in the first place considering your strained relationship to date.

Remove her as a reference for any future application, and just say you've been living in your own property to any future landlords.

Fol20 · 27-11-2018 1:26pm

Browney7 wrote: »

I'm sure if someone responded to a thread started by you if you were looking for advice dealing with a delinquent tenant and based on the detailed post you were labelled "a right pain in the arse" you wouldn't exactly be responding with a response filled with puppy dogs and rainbows.

I would defend myself and argue the valid points that have been mentioned, his response didnt do this however and was a little rude. Lets get back on point before we hijack the thread

The_Conductor · 27-11-2018 4:00pm

1. The landlord has to properly terminate the tenancy- with the requisite notice, and a statutory declaration declaring the reason for the termination.
2. Her son renovating his property- and needing somewhere to stay- is valid.
3. She is under no obligation to tell you what is happening to the property after her son- and it would be better for both the landlord and the tenant to not speculate.
4. The list of items you listed- some are perfectly fine- others- such as demanding outdoor lights- are not. The property is rented 'as-is'. If it did not have outdoor lights when you moved in- most normal people would ask for permission to install some- possibly notion activated lights at the door or something. It doesn't say anywhere that a property has to have outdoor lighting. It was cheeky seeking it. The other items though- the shower and the septic tank- are standard items- most people have their septic tanks emptied periodically (there are specific regulations governing it). The shower- that could be hard-water- or any of a long list of other things. Providing there is hot water present- its not an emergency- but it would normally be expected to be repaired in a reasonable time frame.
5. Hard-water- is a curse in this country. Some people have water softeners or water softening devices- a majority of people don't. Once again its not specified anywhere that you should have one.

You've very obviously rubbed the landlord up the wrong way- some of the things were not your fault- but you took liberties with others (such as outdoor lighting). The landlord very obviously sees you as a troublemaker- and wants you out. At this point- you can frustrate and draw out the termination of the tenancy- but it is going to happen- and you have to plan for that.

Obviously you're looking elsewhere now- if you do find somewhere- you might be in a position to offer to leave your current residence asap- providing the landlord gives you a reasonable reference- if his/her reference means that much to you.

Brbiyer · 27-11-2018 6:37pm

Thanks for all the helpful messages and there have been quite a few of them!
I don't think my demands have been unreasonable. I have waited beyond the prescribed time period before asking again for toilets, showers and septic tank to be repaired/maintained.
As for the outdoor lights- there it wasn't a case of changing a light bulb. The house is also in the country with no street lightning. Its health and safety.

Wheres Me Jumper? · 27-11-2018 6:44pm

myshirt wrote: »

It sounds like it may be a mechanism to get you out, and not bona fides, agreed. But it also sounds like you are a right pain in the arse. If the relationship has went sour, just move on.

i have to concur. as a LL if i had a tenant like you i would seek to get rid asap.
nothing personal but as one poster already said, life is too short and there are too many good people desperately seeking accommodation to be dealing with this.

OP try to learn from this and move on.

Nekarsulm · 27-11-2018 6:51pm

Brbiyer wrote: »

Thanks for all the helpful messages and there have been quite a few of them!
I don't think my demands have been unreasonable. I have waited beyond the prescribed time period before asking again for toilets, showers and septic tank to be repaired/maintained.
As for the outdoor lights- there it wasn't a case of changing a light bulb. The house is also in the country with no street lightning. Its health and safety.

She should have got the septic tank investigated ASAP, in everyones interest.
As another poster stated, the normal thing to do would be to ask if you could fit a sensor light unit at the back door.
30 euro in Woodies would see you sorted.
Demanding them as "health snd safety" because there is no street lighting is fairly ridiculous.

RossieMan · 27-11-2018 6:53pm

Brbiyer wrote:

The house is also in the country with no street lightning. Its health and safety.

You should have stated this when renting the house. As had been said, it's generally rented as is. No demands for extras a few months down the line. And perhaps face to face or a phone call is better? Texting can make you come across worse than you want it to. Similar to this forum sometimes.

q85dw7osi4lebg · 27-11-2018 7:22pm

Why anyone would want to be a landlord anymore is beyond me.

q85dw7osi4lebg · 27-11-2018 7:30pm

The_Conductor wrote: »

1. The landlord has to properly terminate the tenancy- with the requisite notice, and a statutory declaration declaring the reason for the termination.
2. Her son renovating his property- and needing somewhere to stay- is valid.
3. She is under no obligation to tell you what is happening to the property after her son- and it would be better for both the landlord and the tenant to not speculate.
4. The list of items you listed- some are perfectly fine- others- such as demanding outdoor lights- are not. The property is rented 'as-is'. If it did not have outdoor lights when you moved in- most normal people would ask for permission to install some- possibly notion activated lights at the door or something. It doesn't say anywhere that a property has to have outdoor lighting. It was cheeky seeking it. The other items though- the shower and the septic tank- are standard items- most people have their septic tanks emptied periodically (there are specific regulations governing it). The shower- that could be hard-water- or any of a long list of other things. Providing there is hot water present- its not an emergency- but it would normally be expected to be repaired in a reasonable time frame.
5. Hard-water- is a curse in this country. Some people have water softeners or water softening devices- a majority of people don't. Once again its not specified anywhere that you should have one.

You've very obviously rubbed the landlord up the wrong way- some of the things were not your fault- but you took liberties with others (such as outdoor lighting). The landlord very obviously sees you as a troublemaker- and wants you out. At this point- you can frustrate and draw out the termination of the tenancy- but it is going to happen- and you have to plan for that.

Obviously you're looking elsewhere now- if you do find somewhere- you might be in a position to offer to leave your current residence asap- providing the landlord gives you a reasonable reference- if his/her reference means that much to you.

:pac:

Ray Palmer · 27-11-2018 7:38pm

In any reference I state if the the person paid the rent on time. Other than that it is the dates of tenancy. I am not going to be held legally responsible for a tenants behaviour and I am not going to say what I thought of them.

Wheres Me Jumper? · 27-11-2018 8:06pm

Magdalena Modern Supertanker wrote: »

Why anyone would want to be a landlord anymore is beyond me.

there are many very good tenants out there.

The_Conductor · 27-11-2018 8:12pm

Wheres Me Jumper? wrote: »

there are many very good tenants out there.

Certainly there are- however, from a regulatory perspective- its now practically a fulltime job.

Wheres Me Jumper? · 27-11-2018 11:10pm

The_Conductor wrote: »

Certainly there are- however, from a regulatory perspective- its now practically a fulltime job.

no it's not.

i own a number of rental properties and i wouldn't even classify it as a part-time role tbh.

Fol20 · 28-11-2018 12:13am

Wheres Me Jumper? wrote: »

no it's not.

i own a number of rental properties and i wouldn't even classify it as a part-time role tbh.

I don’t think he meant it literally. It’s a figure of speech. Some months it can be quiet and some it can really ramp up. You also need to keep on top of legislation just in case your caught out. I would classify as part time however depending on the amount of properties you have.If you had enough properties potentially 50+, I could see it being a full time job.

q85dw7osi4lebg · 28-11-2018 12:43am

Fol20 wrote: »

I don’t think he meant it literally. It’s a figure of speech. Some months it can be quiet and some it can really ramp up. You also need to keep on top of legislation just in case your caught out. I would classify as part time however depending on the amount of properties you have.If you had enough properties potentially 50+, I could see it being a full time job.

A better way to put it - if you have a full time job already you have no time to be a landlord in this country. Calls and call outs at all times of the day. Attending the property at all hours etc etc. Keeping taxes in check, making sure you don't end up in court. Effort

Browney7 · 28-11-2018 1:07am

Fol20 wrote: »

I don’t think he meant it literally. It’s a figure of speech. Some months it can be quiet and some it can really ramp up. You also need to keep on top of legislation just in case your caught out. I would classify as part time however depending on the amount of properties you have.If you had enough properties potentially 50+, I could see it being a full time job.

I'd imagine if you'd 50 properties at an average of 800 a month you wouldn't need a 50k per annum salaried job now to be fair...

q85dw7osi4lebg · 28-11-2018 1:13am

Browney7 wrote: »

I'd imagine if you'd 50 properties at an average of 800 a month you wouldn't need a 50k per annum salaried job now to be fair...

How will they get by on a day to day basis? People seem to think landlords don't have to pay tax or mortgages from their rental income.

Browney7 · 28-11-2018 1:19am

Magdalena Modern Supertanker wrote: »

How will they get by on a day to day basis? People seem to think landlords don't have to pay tax or mortgages from their rental income.

If they can't get by generating a rent roll of 40k per month they only have themselves to blame

Landlord being difficult- considering rtb adjudication

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