The 8th amendment referendum - part 4

ohnonotgmail · 22-05-2018 07:45PM

jjmcclure wrote: »

A mixture of both.

based on what? given that there are very few jurisdictions that would even allow it except for medical reasons? You think women remain pregnant for 5 months and then decide to go "**** it" and have an abortion?

jjmcclure · 22-05-2018 07:46PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

But "we" didn't did we?
"we" had an "emergency" so couldn't play.
Sweden was busy too.
Switzerland was minding everyone's money.

Whole swathes of Asia and South America minded their own business.

What was your point again?

I dint say "we". I said the world or better put those who could.

Macha · 22-05-2018 07:46PM

jjmcclure wrote: »

A mixture of both.

Ridiculous. After my missed miscarriage, I had to go in and have a D&C because the medical pills hadn't worked. I lost another day of work and had to have a procedure under general anaesthetic. I then had to take another type of medication to encourage the lining of my womb to grow back properly.

I went the medical way first because my gynaecologist advised it was less risky and gentler on my body. Again, the idea that someone would go through this lightly is incredibly ignorant.

Also, do you really think women are pregnant for 5 months and then suddenly decide they don't want the baby? This is a completely moronic idea.

Sofiztikated · 22-05-2018 07:47PM

bridster007 wrote: »

So, why don't they admit that they are going to abort a baby so, I have not found anyone Yes voter who will talk about it in these terms. Why suddenly they choose to use scientific terms when they want rid ?

I'll call it a baby, I'll call it a hamster, I'll call it whatever you fancy.

I also call my car a brum brum, but if I was talking to a mechanic, I'd call it a car.

Bannasidhe · 22-05-2018 07:52PM

jjmcclure wrote: »

I dint say "we". I said the world or better put those who could.

Or those who were invaded so didn't have much choice.
Then there were those who were colonies of participating nations so again limited choice.
Then there were those pesky treaties some countries signed that didn't give them much wriggle room

If we focus on those who got involved because 'they could' it's hardly the world now is it?

That really is a crap analogy.

I'm struggling to see what point you are labouring to make.

antiskeptic · 22-05-2018 07:56PM

Macha wrote: »

Also, do you really think women are pregnant for 5 months and then suddenly decide they don't want the baby? This is a completely moronic idea.

We're told that the reasons people might want an abortion up to three months is because of life circumstance changes: they might lose their jobs or home, their partner might die, their parents are struck down and they need to care for them

Are you saying such things can't happen at 5 months?

You can't have it both ways.

fxotoole · 22-05-2018 07:56PM

antiskeptic wrote: »

What do folk think of the line up tomorrow at 10pm on Pat Kenny

Couldn't be bothered tbh.

Already made my mind up and no amount of foreign funded rentamob propaganda is going to sway me.

captbarnacles · 22-05-2018 07:57PM

bridster007 wrote: »

So, why don't they admit that they are going to abort a baby so, I have not found anyone Yes voter who will talk about it in these terms. Why suddenly they choose to use scientific terms when they want rid ?

I'll talk about it in those terms if you like?

Here I'll save you typing out your next post "BABYKILLER!!!!!!!!!!!!"

The 'you call it a baby' angle has to be the dopiest argument from either side. I sometimes refer to my car as a she but I am not attributing female reproductive organs to it.

jjmcclure · 22-05-2018 07:57PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Or those who were invaded so didn't have much choice.
Then there were those who were colonies of participating nations so again limited choice.
Then there were those pesky treaties some countries signed that didn't give them much wriggle room

If we focus on those who got involved because 'they could' it's hardly the world now is it?

That really is a crap analogy.

I'm struggling to see what point you are labouring to make.

I know you are missing the point. That part is clear.

The point is just because you choose to do something doesn't mean its right. That is where right thinking individuals need to come together to protect those who can't protect themselves.

vicwatson · 22-05-2018 07:58PM

antiskeptic wrote: »

What do folk think of the line up tomorrow at 10pm on Pat Kenny

Maria Steen and Ronan Mullen (he seemed to do okay on the Claire Byrne show)

vs.

Regina Doherty and Colm O'Gorman

Saving Grace for the yes campaign is pat Kenny and not Claire Byrne will be moderating, he won’t let untruths pass

DOS · 22-05-2018 07:58PM

Canvass break here.

3 couples in their 30s and 40s told me they intend to vote No but have told Yes campaigners they are voting Yes because.. they feared being considered 'backward'.. How sad

I tried to tell them they weren't in the least backward.

This is Portlaoise town. 2 couples from Dublin who have bought here.

amcalester · 22-05-2018 08:00PM

DOS wrote: »

Canvass break here.

3 couples in their 30s and 40s told me they intend to vote No but have told Yes campaigners they are voting Yes because.. they feared being considered 'backward'.. How sad I tried to tell them they weren't in the least backward.

This is Portlaoise town. 2 couples from Dublin who have bought here.

Or they’re telling you what they think you want to hear.

DOS · 22-05-2018 08:00PM

In the interest of fairness all houses I went to over the last few days said all Yes campaigners were polite and respectful. Good on them.

alan partridge aha · 22-05-2018 08:00PM

vicwatson wrote: »

antiskeptic wrote: »

What do folk think of the line up tomorrow at 10pm on Pat Kenny

Maria Steen and Ronan Mullen (he seemed to do okay on the Claire Byrne show)

vs.

Regina Doherty and Colm O'Gorman

Saving Grace for the yes campaign is pat Kenny and not Claire Byrne will be moderating, he won’t let untruths pass

I have heard Kenny moderating before on abortion debates. A very biased person

jjmcclure · 22-05-2018 08:01PM

DOS wrote: »

Canvass break here.

3 couples in their 30s and 40s told me they intend to vote No but have told Yes campaigners they are voting Yes because.. they feared being considered 'backward'.. How sad I tried to tell them they weren't in the least backward.

This is Portlaoise town. 2 couples from Dublin who have bought here.

I think this is the secret shock coming for the yes campaign. Many people won't say they are voting no. I also think the grey vote will be out in force for the no side. The polls are useless on this one!

BeerFarts · 22-05-2018 08:01PM

DOS wrote: »

Canvass break here.

3 couples in their 30s and 40s told me they intend to vote No but have told Yes campaigners they are voting Yes because.. they feared being considered 'backward'.. How sad I tried to tell them they weren't in the least backward.

This is Portlaoise town. 2 couples from Dublin who have bought here.

They should consider growing a spine.

DOS · 22-05-2018 08:01PM

amcalester wrote: »

Or they’re telling you what they think you want to hear.

No. I'm a good reader of people. They wanted to stay chatting. The body language was open.

darem93 · 22-05-2018 08:01PM

Seems like the No campaign have now moved on to the Dublin Mountains.

https://twitter.com/thejournal_ie/status/999014699718103040

fxotoole · 22-05-2018 08:02PM

jjmcclure wrote: »

I know you are missing the point. That part is clear.

The point is just because you choose to do something doesn't mean its right. That is where right thinking individuals need to come together to protect those who can't protect themselves.

Voting no doesn't protect babies. Women will still be getting abortions if you vote no.

DOS · 22-05-2018 08:03PM

alan partridge aha wrote: »

I have heard Kenny moderating before on abortion debates. A very biased person

Pro life or pro choice bias?

jjmcclure · 22-05-2018 08:04PM

fxotoole wrote: »

Voting no doesn't protect babies. Women will still be getting abortions if you vote no.

If voting NO saves one, that's a victory.

gmisk · 22-05-2018 08:04PM

darem93 wrote: »

Seems like the No campaign have now moved on to the Dublin Mountains.

https://twitter.com/thejournal_ie/status/999014699718103040

OK does anyone think this will help the no side? I really don't see it myself, it's kind of bizarre, people are sick of the site of posters as it is!

Macha · 22-05-2018 08:04PM

antiskeptic wrote: »

We're told that the reasons people might want an abortion up to three months is because of life circumstance changes: they might lose their jobs or home, their partner might die, their parents are struck down and they need to care for them

Are you saying such things can't happen at 5 months?

You can't have it both ways.

First of all, it shows how little you think of women if you think women get abortions after 12 weeks for the reasons you mention above. I would call it an extremely misogynistic viewpoint. But your signature also suggests you only see women as a 'womb'.

But it's dishonest to claim things that you know aren't true, antiskeptic.

And you should know by now that according to the proposed law, abortion after 12 weeks would only be allowed if two medical practitioners (one of which must be an obstetrician) certify three things:
1) a risk to the life of the pregnant woman or a risk of serious harm to her
2) the foetus hasn't reached viability (which is normally around 22 weeks now)
3) the termination of pregnancy is an appropriate way to avoid the above risk.

So I am saying that only a misogynist would assume that women would have abortions after 12 weeks for the above reasons, and I am saying that it cannot happen under the proposed legislation.

amcalester · 22-05-2018 08:05PM

DOS wrote: »

No. I'm a good reader of people. They wanted to stay chatting. The body language was open.

Fair enough.

I’ve often wondered how effective door to door canvassing is on subjects like this, do people really change their minds based on what a biased stranger tells them?

That’s not a dig by the way.

Guy:Incognito · 22-05-2018 08:05PM

DOS wrote: »

Canvass break here.

3 couples in their 30s and 40s told me they intend to vote No but have told Yes campaigners they are voting Yes because.. they feared being considered 'backward'.. How sad I tried to tell them they weren't in the least backward.

This is Portlaoise town. 2 couples from Dublin who have bought here.

It's uncaring for others despite claiming whatever the reasons are for wanting to maintain the pregnancy. The most caring thing anyone can do in this whole debate is leave the issues up to the wpman involved to decide and stol forcing her to live by your opinion.

No one on the no side would be happy having a random person in the country assigned to decide things for them.

DOS · 22-05-2018 08:05PM

BeerFarts wrote: »

They should consider growing a spine.

Didn't want to offend anyone.

I'm sure some who say they'll vote No to canvassers will vote Yes. It's just which side will be in the majority that will count.

fxotoole · 22-05-2018 08:05PM

jjmcclure wrote: »

If voting NO saves one, that's a victory.

It wont. It only maintains the status quo. Ie abortions where a woman's life is at risk and young wans getting the boat to England.

munsterlegend · 22-05-2018 08:06PM

Macha wrote: »

Ridiculous. After my missed miscarriage, I had to go in and have a D&C because the medical pills hadn't worked. I lost another day of work and had to have a procedure under general anaesthetic. I then had to take another type of medication to encourage the lining of my womb to grow back properly.

I went the medical way first because my gynaecologist advised it was less risky and gentler on my body. Again, the idea that someone would go through this lightly is incredibly ignorant.

Also, do you really think women are pregnant for 5 months and then suddenly decide they don't want the baby? This is a completely moronic idea.

I know of a teenage girl(18) who was 4 1/2months pregnant and didn't even know until that point. She went to the UK as she didn't want it for a variety of reasons nothing to do with the health of the foetus. So yep it does happen.

Hotblack Desiato · 22-05-2018 08:06PM

jjmcclure wrote: »

If voting NO saves one, that's a victory.

How many women dying because of the 8th are worth that "victory"?

I've asked this a few times and oddlly enough, nobody ever replies. What IS the acceptable level of collateral damage caused by the 8th?

gmisk · 22-05-2018 08:06PM

DOS wrote: »

In the interest of fairness all houses I went to over the last few days said all Yes campaigners were polite and respectful. Good on them.

As has been mentioned here a few times already when this referendum is over we are all going to have to live together on this little island.
It is very decent of you to say that fair play.

The 8th amendment referendum - part 4

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