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Frustrated with Turas Nua

1234689

Comments

  • #152
    Ajsoprano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 698 ✭✭✭Ajsoprano


    donegal_man wrote: »
    The company in question has an an 18% success rate placing people in work. What I'd like to see is a cost benefit analysis of their performance.

    I’d say it’s more so 18 per cent of their clients used to work. Hit a recession and then got work after it.
    Or they changed payment.
    I doubt they actually found any work from my dealing with them.


  • #153
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,847 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    donegal_man wrote: »
    The company in question has an an 18% success rate placing people in work. What I'd like to see is a cost benefit analysis of their performance.

    How does that compare to the old system?


  • #154
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    How does that compare to the old system?

    It’s a lot more complicated then that Maryanne.
    A lot of people mysteriously signed off when they got “invited” to TN/Seetec.
    A lot of people turned up and as I’ve explained before it turned out they shouldn’t have been on Jobseekers at all, should’ve been on Carers Disability FIS etc.
    A lot of people who had been on JSA “coincidentally” found jobs themselves not long after attending TN.
    All of these people are excluded from the list of successful TN participants, but are no longer on the live register.
    That’s why unemployment is the lowest right now that it’s been for over 10 years.


  • #155
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,847 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    splinter65 wrote: »
    It’s a lot more complicated then that Maryanne.
    A lot of people mysteriously signed off when they got “invited” to TN/Seetec.
    A lot of people turned up and as I’ve explained before it turned out they shouldn’t have been on Jobseekers at all, should’ve been on Carers Disability FIS etc.
    A lot of people who had been on JSA “coincidentally” found jobs themselves not long after attending TN.
    All of these people are excluded from the list of successful TN participants, but are no longer on the live register.
    That’s why unemployment is the lowest right now that it’s been for over 10 years.

    So it’s been a success then. Now, if FAS had been doing this all along, imagine the savings!


  • #156
    jmcgill16
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 60 ✭✭jmcgill16


    splinter65 wrote: »
    It’s a lot more complicated then that Maryanne.
    A lot of people mysteriously signed off when they got “invited” to TN/Seetec.
    A lot of people turned up and as I’ve explained before it turned out they shouldn’t have been on Jobseekers at all, should’ve been on Carers Disability FIS etc.
    A lot of people who had been on JSA “coincidentally” found jobs themselves not long after attending TN.
    All of these people are excluded from the list of successful TN participants, but are no longer on the live register.
    That’s why unemployment is the lowest right now that it’s been for over 10 years.

    Unemployment is at its lowest right now because Ireland is in the midst of a burgeoning economic boom. JobPath/Turas Nua placing 18% of the 150k approx people to date referred to them in jobs has very little to do with it. Especially given a good chunk of those likely would have found their own jobs anyway.

    You refused to answer on a previous page of this thread when you were asked which exact "coalface" (as you described it in your own words) that you said you worked at relating to JobPath. I'd seriously question your motivation making pro-JobPath posts all over this forum in multiple threads at this stage - are you employed by Seetac?

    I think regardless of the morality of JobPath/TN and job activation schemes in general, people on both right and left wing sides of the political spectrum should at this stage be in complete agreement about one thing: JobPath is a complete waste of state resources. Its been empirically proven to be bad value at this stage. 18% of 'customers' finding employment is far too low a figure to justify the massively increased costs compared to in-house Intreo/Local Employment Services that previously handled the role, and had similar results.

    Why continue handing so much tax money over to a British firm that is only going to take it out of the economy?


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  • #157
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    jmcgill16 wrote: »
    Unemployment is at its lowest right now because Ireland is in the midst of a burgeoning economic boom. JobPath/Turas Nua placing 18% of the 150k approx people to date referred to them in jobs has very little to do with it. Especially given a good chunk of those likely would have found their own jobs anyway.

    You refused to answer on a previous page of this thread when you were asked which exact "coalface" (as you described it in your own words) that you said you worked at relating to JobPath. I'd seriously question your motivation making pro-JobPath posts all over this forum in multiple threads at this stage - are you employed by Seetac?

    I think regardless of the morality of JobPath/TN and job activation schemes in general, people on both right and left wing sides of the political spectrum should at this stage be in complete agreement about one thing: JobPath is a complete waste of state resources. Its been empirically proven to be bad value at this stage. 18% of 'customers' finding employment is far too low a figure to justify the massively increased costs compared to in-house Intreo/Local Employment Services that previously handled the role, and had similar results.

    Why continue handing so much tax money over to a British firm that is only going to take it out of the economy?
    Its against the site rules to demand any personal information from any poster and if you come again with that I’ll report you.
    I don’t work for any government department. This is a discussion forum, I am entitled to my opinion, I am entitled to post, and i don’t need to provide you with any background or possible “motivation” I might have. Neither is my background or motivation up for discussion.


  • #158
    jmcgill16
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 60 ✭✭jmcgill16


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Its against the site rules to demand any personal information from any poster and if you come again with that I’ll report you.
    I don’t work for any government department. This is a discussion forum, I am entitled to my opinion, I am entitled to post, and i don’t need to provide you with any background or possible “motivation” I might have. Neither is my background or motivation up for discussion.

    But it was you who brought up that you "work at the coalface" on Turas Nua in this very thread:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105960822&postcount=80

    You can't make vague assertions of your possessing superior knowledge of this issue to other posters by claiming to work in the area in one post, and then get annoyed when you're asked at which exact "coalface" you work at subsequently.


  • #159
    Ajsoprano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 698 ✭✭✭Ajsoprano


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    So it’s been a success then. Now, if FAS had been doing this all along, imagine the savings!

    I believe fas were at the helm in the 2000s when we had full employment.


  • #160
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    jmcgill16 wrote: »
    But it was you who brought up that you "work at the coalface" on Turas Nua in this very thread:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105960822&postcount=80

    You can't make vague assertions of your possessing superior knowledge of this issue to other posters by claiming to work in the area in one post, and then get annoyed when you're asked at which exact "coalface" you work at subsequently.

    Are you telling me how and what I can post? I see.


  • #161
    jmcgill16
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 60 ✭✭jmcgill16


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Are you telling me how and what I can post? I see.

    No not at all, just pointing out the conflict between your posts in this thread.

    In one post you claim to work "at the coalface" on Turas Nua:
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105960822&postcount=80

    And that you enjoy "dealing with the great unwashed":
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105967219&postcount=84

    But subsequently you claim you "don't work for any government department."
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=106252197&postcount=165

    Its just something worth pointing out to readers of the thread - it would raise certain doubts about the veracity of your posts on the issue. Why are you claiming to work in the industry if you don't? Or why are you now claiming not to work in the industry when you do? Theres something fishy going on either way.


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  • #162
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    jmcgill16 wrote: »
    No not at all, just pointing out the conflict between your posts in this thread.

    In one post you claim to work "at the coalface" on Turas Nua:
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105960822&postcount=80

    And that you enjoy "dealing with the great unwashed":
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105967219&postcount=84

    But subsequently you claim you "don't work for any government department."
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=106252197&postcount=165

    Its just something worth pointing out to readers of the thread - it would raise certain doubts about the veracity of your posts on the issue. Why are you claiming to work in the industry if you don't? Or why are you now claiming not to work in the industry when you do? Theres something fishy going on either way.

    Report posts you find break the charter. That’s what I’ve done.


  • #163
    Ajsoprano
    Closed Accounts Posts: 698 ✭✭✭Ajsoprano


    Is this how boards goes?
    I’m new enough here but it seems people disagree then one person starts having the better side of the arguement then the other chap tries to find a loophole in the charter to get the fella banned.
    Surely there’s nothing bad there that’s need to be reported.


  • #164
    mikemac2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,002 ✭✭✭mikemac2


    If sending a qualified tradesman to stand in a car park for 12 months is the best solution the agency can come up with how are they going to help anyone else

    :(


  • #165
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Ajsoprano wrote: »
    Is this how boards goes?
    I’m new enough here but it seems people disagree then one person starts having the better side of the arguement then the other chap tries to find a loophole in the charter to get the fella banned.
    Surely there’s nothing bad there that’s need to be reported.

    There’s fairly clear rules about badgering a poster to reveal personal details about themselves. I don’t know why you think he was getting the better side of the argument.
    Don’t you mean that he was taking your side?


  • #166
    mp22
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 6,854 Mod ✭✭✭✭mp22


    Ok people toys back in the pram please.......


  • #167
    mp22
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 6,854 Mod ✭✭✭✭mp22


    Yes posts have been deleted,back on topic please......Final warning to all concerned......
    Thanks


  • #168
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,610 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Its against the site rules to demand any personal information from any poster and if you come again with that I’ll report you.
    I don’t work for any government department. This is a discussion forum, I am entitled to my opinion, I am entitled to post, and i don’t need to provide you with any background or possible “motivation” I might have. Neither is my background or motivation up for discussion.

    When you claim untruths to be facts, then others have a right to question you on it.

    Anyone searching this forum for information and advice, will see your posts... which are extremely contradictory and inconsistent

    "working at the coal-face"

    "absolutely no connection to any firm"

    Give over. You should either declare your involvement in any firm or department, or stop giving people incredulous advice here


  • #169
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    My name is URL wrote: »
    When you claim untruths to be facts, then others have a right to question you on it.

    Anyone searching this forum for information and advice, will see your posts... which are extremely contradictory and inconsistent

    "working at the coal-face"

    "absolutely no connection to any firm"

    Give over. You should either declare your involvement in any firm or department, or stop giving people incredulous advice here

    Once again with the back seat modding. Ok.


  • #170
    brianregan09
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,503 ✭✭✭brianregan09


    In fairness I see where everyone is coming from , You're flying the DSP and Turas Nua flag the whole way through the 12 pages and dismissing bad stuff said about either until proven wrong with actual facts and then you sneakily try to get them banned in response , pretty sneaky if you ask me are you sure you don't work for the government ? Because you should


  • #171
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    brianregan09 wrote: »
    In fairness I see where everyone is coming from , You're flying the DSP and Turas Nua flag the whole way through the 12 pages and dismissing bad stuff said about either until proven wrong with actual facts and then you sneakily try to get them banned in response , pretty sneaky if you ask me are you sure you don't work for the government ? Because you should

    I’m as entitled to my opinion as anyone else.
    If you need to read only opinions and views that tally with your own then you should go on social media where you can block people who don’t like your echo chamber.
    I don’t owe you or anyone here any explanations and I don’t have to put up with being told where and what I can post.
    Just to be clear.


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  • #172
    brianregan09
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,503 ✭✭✭brianregan09


    I never said you couldn't have an opinion at all, I reread my post several times and can't see where I said that ??? Can you ??? any poster above said it better than I can , You're the one trying to shut people down as soon as you're given facts you go on the attack , Your basically stirring a pot and running out of the kitchen to mommy when it gets too hot.......anyway had my say

    I work and I'm not on social welfare but I know people who are people close to me and this turas nua stuff is fine , but the way people are treated in there is disgraceful , a friend of mine put in a room (a friend who is just below the cut off point) with people who worked all there lives in there 60's and people who can't even read (who's going to employ them ???) and put on menial courses that are mostly common sense , My mother had to fix my mates CV after your one in Turas Nua was finished with it spelling errors all over it , the Advisors in there get about a months training themselves and then are entitled to tell people how to run there lives , the whole thing like most government run things is a shi.tshow


  • #173
    jaxxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,225 ✭✭✭jaxxx


    Doctor Jimbob wrote: »
    No one said you aren't entitled to your opinion, or told you where you can and can't post. You're posting your opinion as fact by implying you have inside information, and people are calling you out on it.

    If anything you're the one trying to silence other's opinions by crying about backseat modding every time someone questions you. If you want to make claims, people are free to question those claims.

    When you get to the brass tacks of it all, there are essentially just two types of humans in the world:

    Type A: Those that acknowledge that 1+1=2, i.e. they see things as they are.

    Type B: Those that believe 1+1=-543,645, i.e. they see things as they like to see things.

    Crystal clear case of Type B here, from the couple of posts I've read...

    Anyway back to Turas Nua. I've been with them since October I believe. I will admit right here right now that 99.99% of it has been a complete and utter waste of time, with me being no closer to securing even a part time job let alone full time. But that being said, there have been a few useful seminars I've attended and everyone I have dealt with has been friendly, approachable and not at all condescending, UNLIKE pretty much everyone I have ever dealt with in the DSP. Plus not having to sign on every month is a nice touch.


  • #174
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,777 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I've been referred to LES for my next step with Jobpath. 1st meeting consisted of him asking "would you not look for a course" "have you heard of springboard" was like talking to my secondary school guidance councillor all over again.


  • #175
    jaxxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,225 ✭✭✭jaxxx


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I've been referred to LES for my next step with Jobpath. 1st meeting consisted of him asking "would you not look for a course" "have you heard of springboard" was like talking to my secondary school guidance councillor all over again.

    Think I dealt with them once. Another huge waste of time, as has pretty much every experience I've ever had with the DSP or whoever they try and fob you off to so they can claim that the number of people on the dole is lower than it actually is. But that's just me being sour really. Though there is one organisation I have dealt with and refuse to ever deal with again the that's the National Learning Network. Not gonna go into details but they're liars. Dealt with them once, and they twisted my words and made me out to be some uninterested scumbag who has no desire to try and find work. I have records of my job applications going back 4 years, so if anyone tries and fabricate lies about me again I'll not hold back in my profanity.


  • #176
    Twelve Bar Blues
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 161 ✭✭Twelve Bar Blues


    I don't think that there's any doubt that while TN is a good idea on paper, it is not as good in practice.
    I was declined funding for a course (one day a week for 4 weeks) that would undoubtedly better my chances at gaining employment. TN declined my request for the Technical Employment Support Grant. I contacted my local office, and they confirmed that I would still eligible for the funding, and being with TN does not change this. I tried and I tried, but TN would not budge.

    TN email in response to my query -

    ....."I have checked here in the office if there is any way we can refer you to this course and cover / part cover the costs.

    Unfortunately private courses such as this one, are not ones we can refer you on to and cover / part cover the costs.

    If you get a guaranteed job offer, on the condition that you complete this course, we may be able to review this at that time.

    I know this is not what you would like to hear....."


    They have done so little to effect any change to my search for employment, and the few times I have asked for assistance I received a flat NO.

    I have a friend who is also with TN, in a different office, and they have helped her write up her CV and have LIED about previous employment. She told the agent that she did not want to do this and she was told they do it all the time. I'm not talking about a bit of embellishment - I mean making up jobs out of thin air.

    I just think that instead of it being an argument about dolers and workers, it should be about the actual experiences people, or customers, are having with TN.


  • #177
    Sephiroth_dude
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 81,209 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sephiroth_dude


    Twelve Bar Blues wrote: »


    If you get a guaranteed job offer, on the condition that you complete this course, we may be able to review this at that time.

    .

    So in others words if you had a job lined up for after the course finished that you found yourself, they would take credit for finding it and still get there commission, wow I guess that's all they really care about is the money side of things and not actually helping people.


  • #178
    thinkingahead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭thinkingahead


    Anyone interested its on Indeed.com website
    Personal Adviser
    FRS Recruitment

    Full-time, Permanent
    Turas Nua is a new joint venture between Ireland's leading recruitment agency FRS Recruitment and leading employability and skills provider Working Links. We bring together a wealth of experience to help transform the lives of individuals in Ireland through the government's new JobPath programme.

    Personal Advisers

    Would you like to improve people`s lives through employment?

    Turas Nua, through the Job Path Program, offer valued and integrated services that truly meet the needs of our individual customers, giving them and their communities a positive economic future.

    We are looking for people to join our vibrant and fast paced office to help us get people back to work. We'd need you to be driven, target focused and hardworking. This can be demanding at times, so you'd also need to thrive under pressure.

    PRINCIPAL ACCOUNTABILITIES / KEY RESULT AREAS

    Manage a caseload of customers to ensure appropriate and effective contractual activity is undertaken by working with individuals to find suitable sustainable employment
    Address customer's personal constraints to employment, providing challenge, advice and guidance where appropriate.
    Develop customer's capability in the recruitment process ensuring they have the necessary skills and confidence to secure sustainable employment.
    Provide advice, guidance and support for customers during transition from welfare to employment to sustain employment in the long term.
    Develop relationships and networks with key stakeholders
    ESSENTIAL REQUIREMENTS

    Proven ability to successfully work in a target driven environment.
    Leaving Certificate as a minimum.
    The ability to build rapport and work effectively with challenging individuals.
    Excellent networking and relationship building skills.
    Experience in the use of Microsoft office packages and CRM Systems.
    Excellent administrative skills.
    Fluent written and spoken English.
    Flexible and approachable.
    For more information on Turas Nua please visit our website www.turasnua.ie


  • #179
    Rhyso
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25 ✭Rhyso


    Just had my first meeting with JobPath today. Have a course lined up in September that I'm really looking forward to. Just learned recently that I probably won't be able to do it now that I'm with JobPath. Don't really know what to do, stressed out to be honest.


  • #180
    tringle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 868 ✭✭✭tringle


    Rhyso wrote: »
    Just had my first meeting with JobPath today. Have a course lined up in September that I'm really looking forward to. Just learned recently that I probably won't be able to do it now that I'm with JobPath. Don't really know what to do, stressed out to be honest.

    Just do.it, it was organised before you were with job path. Tell your social welfare office about the course.


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  • #181
    Twelve Bar Blues
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 161 ✭✭Twelve Bar Blues


    Rhyso wrote: »
    Just had my first meeting with JobPath today. Have a course lined up in September that I'm really looking forward to. Just learned recently that I probably won't be able to do it now that I'm with JobPath. Don't really know what to do, stressed out to be honest.

    Don't let it go. Try your local DSP office, as other poster mentioned.
    Let us know what happens?
    Good luck.


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