VRT treatment <30 yrs

galvo_clare · 07-10-2017 1:32pm #1

Hi

Early next year I'll have a garage to put something in. At the moment I quite fancy the idea of a BMW E36 cabriolet - a 328 for preference and definitely manual.
That might change of course but my question is about the VRT treatment if I brought one in from the UK.
It won't be 30 years old and I can live with the tax for a few years until it hit that age but how would, say, a 25 year old car be treated regarding VRT?

TIA

unkel · 07-10-2017 2:33pm

VRT is based on the OMSP (market value) of the car. What you actually paid for it in the UK makes no difference. In case of a straight six E36, you'll be paying at the 36% rate

Is the car on the VRT calculator? If not, you could email the VRT for a quote (but you might never get a reply). Or just risk it and bring it in. Hope they won't value it too highly. To give you an idea, if they reckon it is worth €4k, the VRT will be €1440

galvo_clare · 07-10-2017 3:15pm

unkel wrote: »

VRT is based on the OMSP (market value) of the car. What you actually paid for it in the UK makes no difference. In case of a straight six E36, you'll be paying at the 36% rate

Is the car on the VRT calculator? If not, you could email the VRT for a quote (but you might never get a reply). Or just risk it and bring it in. Hope they won't value it too highly. To give you an idea, if they reckon it is worth €4k, the VRT will be €1440

So it's treated exactly like any other car even though it's approaching 30 years.
It all depends on the value they put on it so. Will do a bit of digging. Thanks.

[Edit]
Just checked - a typical value seems to be around the €4K mark. Coupés seem to be around half that.

w124man · 07-10-2017 5:21pm

galvo_clare wrote: »

So it's treated exactly like any other car even though it's approaching 30 years.
It all depends on the value they put on it so. Will do a bit of digging. Thanks.

[Edit]
Just checked - a typical value seems to be around the €4K mark. Coupseem to be around half that.

The only place to go digging is the VRT website. They will tell you the value that will be used to calculate the VRT. You pay but if you think you have been done then you can appeal.

Isambard · 07-10-2017 9:34pm

just buy one here, you might have to wait for the right one, but you'll save a packet.

rugbyman · 08-10-2017 11:31am

think i might get my fingers rapped for this but here goes.

th hen · 08-10-2017 7:11pm

are cars over 30 years not 200 euro vrt ??

Kenny Logins · 08-10-2017 7:19pm

th hen wrote: »

are cars over 30 years not 200 euro vrt ??

Yes, but this car isn't old enough.

CJhaughey · 08-10-2017 8:56pm

You have 7 days to book and 30 to complete the registration. After the 30 days passes you have to pay 1% of the total VRT amount per day.
You won't be able to insure it for longer than 30 days anyway as its a requirement for the Insurance company to notify Revenue after that period is up.
Draconian yes, but thats the way it is.

Looking at it this way the VRT won't be that high on a car of that age anyway, so 36% of not much is still not much.

macplaxton · 10-10-2017 5:41am

CJhaughey wrote: »

You won't be able to insure it for longer than 30 days anyway as its a requirement for the Insurance company to notify Revenue after that period is up.

42 days. An insurance company is able to insure an "unregistered" vehicle as long as it likes. However, if it insures an "unregistered" vehicle for more than 42 days, it has to inform the Revenue within 30 days. The Revenue may (or may not) take enforcement action base on the information supplied by the insurer.

The exact wording is here in the Finance Act 2010, S111: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2010/act/5/section/111/enacted/en/html

CJhaughey wrote: »

Looking at it this way the VRT won't be that high on a car of that age anyway, so 36% of not much is still not much.

The minimum OMSP the Revenue uses is €2000. Therefore minimum VRT @36% is €720. This can be in some circumstances be disproportionately high in relation to the true value or actual purchase cost of a vehicle.

macplaxton · 10-10-2017 5:59am

For a rag top 328, stat code I used was 40585295

Use the Revenue VRT calculator: https://www.ros.ie/evrt-enquiry/vrtenquiry.html

Looking at 34% VRT, so minimum €680. OMSP for a convertible is showing around 4299, which equals €1461 VRT.

Top-Tips:

Buy an E28 or E30 convertible over 30 years old instead.
Wait until an E36 is over 30 years old before importing one.
Move to the UK to enjoy cheap vehicles.
Inherit an E36 upon death of UK-based person. (bit tricky that one)

Any more legal suggestions lads?

unkel · 10-10-2017 4:25pm

E28 and E30 prices have gone up quite a lot over the past few years. But yeah there are lots of benefits of buying a 30+ year old car and bringing it in. Paid the €200 to register my September 1987 W201 yesterday and taxed it today for the €56 for the full year

macplaxton wrote: »

Looking at 34% VRT

How do you get 34%? Surely a 328i would be 36%?

This is for a '93 E36 328i convertible auto:

Mileage

100000
Year of First Registration

Month of First Registration

Calculate VRT Cancel
Clear

Your VRT Calculation
Date 10/10/2017
Time 16:21
Rate of VRT
36%
Vehicle Registration Tax
(payable on enquiry)
€1,623
Vehicle Details
Statistical Code
40685295
Model
328 I
Make
BMW
Version
I E36 02DR A
Breakdown of VRT Calculation
Open Market Selling Price (OMSP) determined by Revenue
€50114
Monthly Adjustment
N/A
Depreciation Code Allocated by Revenue
A5
Odometer Reading
100000 Miles
Date of First Registration
January 1993
Mileage/Kilometre Reduction
€0
Rate of Depreciation for this Vehicle
91%
Current OMSP determined by Revenue
€4510
Revenue CO2 Calculation
CO2 Emissions
248
Rate of VRT
36%
Vehicle Registration Tax
(payable on enquiry)
€1,623

Isambard · 10-10-2017 5:41pm

Last time I did it the minimum was €720. Did something change or did Macs sum come out wrong?

macplaxton · 10-10-2017 5:43pm

unkel wrote: »

How do you get 34%? Surely a 328i would be 36%?

Because different statistical code.

VRT Calculator
Vehicle Registration Tax (VRT) calculation for vehicle.
Edit Details
Your VRT Calculation
Date 10/10/2017
Time 17:42
Rate of VRT
34%
Vehicle Registration Tax
(payable on enquiry)
€1,461
Vehicle Details
Statistical Code
40585295
Model
328 I
Make
BMW
Version
I E36 02DR
Breakdown of VRT Calculation
Open Market Selling Price (OMSP) determined by Revenue
€47775
Monthly Adjustment
N/A
Depreciation Code Allocated by Revenue
A5
Odometer Reading
100000 Miles
Date of First Registration
January 1993
Mileage/Kilometre Reduction
€0
Rate of Depreciation for this Vehicle
91%
Current OMSP determined by Revenue
€4299
Revenue CO2 Calculation
CO2 Emissions
221
Rate of VRT
34%
Vehicle Registration Tax
(payable on enquiry)
€1,461

From that, you'd want to present the appropriate evidence for emissions banding.

unkel · 10-10-2017 8:42pm

I'd say it would be hard to prove the emissions of the old 2.8 straight 6 were under 225g/km

Seriously I would be surprised if manufacturers recorded official CO2 records in the early 90s. Not sure what other evidence would be acceptable. I doubt fuel consumption would do the trick here either. Not that it matters much on a car of this value, just out of interest.

Greybottle · 10-10-2017 9:29pm

unkel wrote: »

I'd say it would be hard to prove the emissions of the old 2.8 straight 6 were under 225g/km

Seriously I would be surprised if manufacturers recorded official CO2 records in the early 90s. Not sure what other evidence would be acceptable. I doubt fuel consumption would do the trick here either. Not that it matters much on a car of this value, just out of interest.

The Germans did and the Swiss did for imported cars, not sure about ones already registered there.

The manual 328i comes in at 219g/km. The Auto at 243g/km.

If you want to find this out www.mobile.de is a good site. Most cars have the CO2 entered in on them, but you need to do a manual search.

https://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/search.html?damageUnrepaired=NO_DAMAGE_UNREPAIRED&isSearchRequest=true&makeModelVariant1.makeId=3500&makeModelVariant1.modelId=14&maxFirstRegistrationDate=1997-12-31&maxPowerAsArray=PS&minPowerAsArray=PS&scopeId=C

unkel · 11-10-2017 12:50pm

Great help Greybottle! That explains it too as I presumed the car to be auto and macplaxton presumed it to be manual

macplaxton · 12-10-2017 12:14am

unkel wrote: »

as I presumed the car to be auto and macplaxton presumed it to be manual

I presumed nothing!

galvo_clare wrote: »

a 328 for preference and definitely manual.

galvo_clare · 12-10-2017 9:02am

macplaxton wrote: »

I presumed nothing!

Correct. I did say manual originally!

Thanks for all the input. I kind of have a hankering for the E36 as I had a lovely 320i saloon back in the day. I saw it two years after I sold it and it was wrecked. Broke my heart after I looked after it so well.
Lovely engine, even the 2.0 litre.
As I said, early days, I may go another direction yet.

unkel · 12-10-2017 12:28pm

Ha! Not reading the thread properly, my bad

My own choice for an E36 convertible or saloon 328i would probably be auto, but for a coupe it would be sports suspension and manual

Alan_Ganley · 19-10-2017 11:53am

I bought a 92 car for £600 (€643)
Fecking revenue want €740!!
Thats criminal..
I am planning to just throw her on axle stands and let it sit till 2022

Isambard · 19-10-2017 12:22pm

Have you told Revenue/NCT about the car though? If it's on their radar, you might still have to shell out in 2022.(with penalty)

Alan_Ganley · 19-10-2017 12:39pm

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Or you could have done your research before you bought the car...

Too good to pass up so it got bought :-)

Alan_Ganley · 19-10-2017 12:41pm

Isambard wrote: »

Have you told Revenue/NCT about the car though? If it's on their radar, you might still have to shell out in 2022.(with penalty)

Nope. Its getting sold back to my In-laws till then, if I cant figure something out, and I'll buy it back when its 30 years old.
Providing we are still allowed petrol then......

Isambard · 21-10-2017 2:05pm

should be OK so.

VRT treatment <30 yrs

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