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Flender.ie - anyone heard of them?

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  • 04-06-2017 2:25pm
    #1
    Avatar MIA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,750 ✭✭✭


    No connection to them. Seen them when looking through bonkers. ie for best savings rates.

    This seems to be a peer to peer lender presumably with flender getting a cut. I thought I heard peer to peer lending was something being considered, but didn't think it was legal yet.


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    #2
    Strettie11
    Registered Users Posts: 231 ✭✭Strettie11


    Avatar MIA,

    Peer to peer lending is legal but is not regulated in Ireland yet. If you look at the bottom of the web page you will see flender is regulated in the UK and is an authorised peer to peer lender in UK.

    I would advise maybe looking at Linkedfinance first that has been operating for a number of years in Ireland. Always remember the reason rates are higher with peer to peer lenders compared to banks is your money is guaranteed in a bank account and covered by financial compensation scheme. Peer to peer lending you can lose money if a borrower defaults and your money is not covered by financial compensation scheme


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    #3
    bopter
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭bopter


    You're lucky if you even get 1% interest from the bank.

    I lend on Flender and my average return is around 10.5%. No defaults.

    If you spread your money across multiple business loans (which is the only sensible thing to do) then it won't matter much if one of them goes out of business.

    Even if you have a few defaults you're still going to get a way better return on peer to peer lending that you would from a bank.


  • Options
    #4
    garrettod
    Registered Users Posts: 2,420 ✭✭✭garrettod


    Hello bopter,

    I don't think Flender have done much P2P in Ireland to date, have they ?

    ... as such, I don't think it's really appropriate to point to them having no defaults, as they've probably not had enough transactions or been running loans on their platform for long enough to make reasonable comparisons with other P2P sites.

    Your point about the returns on P2P generally is fair, but I don't think you are correct to suggest that even if someone has a few defaults, they will still do better than if they had cash in the bank. Much depends on how many defaults, how much is lost, how much they have invested across other loans etc. Simply put, loss of capital on one loan, can take quite a while to replace with interest from others and lets not forget, that interest is before tax is paid, so you really only end up with about half of it !

    Thanks,

    G.



  • Options
    #5
    ct5amr2ig1nfhp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,019 ✭✭✭ct5amr2ig1nfhp


    garrettrod summed it up nicely. Comparing Flender to other p2p lenders - no buyback guarantee (or similar), no short term loans, fewer loans on offer and returns are only average.

    I understand their concept of borrow/lend from friends or family which is a nice idea in theory but they are still just another p2p lender. Do Flender offer anything unique in the p2p market?


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    #6
    garrettod
    Registered Users Posts: 2,420 ✭✭✭garrettod


    Joyce Modern Barley wrote: »
    ....I understand their concept of borrow/lend from friends or family which is a nice idea in theory ....

    I actually think that's a pretty poor approach to P2P to be honest, it's simply encouraging people to ask friends and family for financial help - something people would probably do anyway, if they needed help and couldn't get a bank loan (so why have a P2P site in the middle of it, taking a slice of the money ?).

    Thanks,

    G.



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  • Options
    #7
    bopter
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭bopter


    garrettod wrote: »
    Hello bopter,

    I don't think Flender have done much P2P in Ireland to date, have they ?

    ... as such, I don't think it's really appropriate to point to them having no defaults, as they've probably not had enough transactions or been running loans on their platform for long enough to make reasonable comparisons with other P2P sites.

    Flender offered more loans than Grid last year from what I can see. I think I've done nearly 25 on Flender.

    I like that the businesses need to bring lenders from their own customer base first before they're marketed to retail lenders. So anyone on the public marketplace already has 'validation' from lenders who know them.


  • Options
    #8
    ct5amr2ig1nfhp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,019 ✭✭✭ct5amr2ig1nfhp


    How many loans are currently available on flender?


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    #9
    bopter
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭bopter


    Joyce Modern Barley wrote: »
    How many loans are currently available on flender?

    Can't see the private ones but several on their public market: https://flender.ie/marketplace


  • Options
    #10
    ct5amr2ig1nfhp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,019 ✭✭✭ct5amr2ig1nfhp


    Thanks. I see only three? Are there similar numbers on the private market?
    bopter wrote: »
    Can't see the private ones but several on their public market: https://flender.ie/marketplace


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    #11
    golfman
    Registered Users Posts: 317 ✭✭golfman


    How do you get to see the private market?


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  • Options
    #12
    garrettod
    Registered Users Posts: 2,420 ✭✭✭garrettod


    I like that the businesses need to bring lenders from their own customer base first before they're marketed to retail lenders. So anyone on the public marketplace already has 'validation' from lenders who know them.

    Never thought about it from that point of view, tbh.

    Thanks,

    G.



  • Options
    #13
    Biketourer
    Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭Biketourer


    Does anyone notice that there is often mistakes in the financial snapshot of the companies? This puts me off lending with them.


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    #14
    garrettod
    Registered Users Posts: 2,420 ✭✭✭garrettod


    Biketourer wrote: »
    Does anyone notice that there is often mistakes in the financial snapshot of the companies? This puts me off lending with them.

    Yikes ! :eek:

    Thanks,

    G.



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    #15
    golfman
    Registered Users Posts: 317 ✭✭golfman


    Biketourer wrote: »
    Does anyone notice that there is often mistakes in the financial snapshot of the companies? This puts me off lending with them.

    Where is the "financial snapshot"? This is my biggest bugbear. You essentially have to bet blindly relying on their analysis and very limited disclosure .

    EDIT: I just found it on the Salt by Ignition Group - Elvertex Ltd loan. Shockingly there is a huge difference in what they are showing in the snapshot and what they are saying in the write up!

    In the write up it says
    "Currently, the group are operating:

    -The Galleon Restaurant
    -Salt Restaurant and Bar
    -SALT@THEGLASSFACTORY and
    -SALT Events and Catering

    The existing turnover of the group is €5.5 Million."

    Then in the financial snapshot it shows a turnover of €1.7m


  • Options
    #16
    Biketourer
    Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭Biketourer


    golfman wrote: »
    Biketourer wrote: »
    Does anyone notice that there is often mistakes in the financial snapshot of the companies? This puts me off lending with them.

    Where is the "financial snapshot"? This is my biggest bugbear. You essentially have to bet blindly relying on their analysis and very limited disclosure .

    EDIT: I just found it on the Salt by Ignition Group - Elvertex Ltd loan. Shockingly there is a huge difference in what they are showing in the snapshot and what they are saying in the write up!

    In the write up it says
    "Currently, the group are operating:

    -The Galleon Restaurant
    -Salt Restaurant and Bar
    -SALT@THEGLASSFACTORY and
    -SALT Events and Catering

    The existing turnover of the group is €5.5 Million."

    Then in the financial snapshot it shows a turnover of €1.7m

    I think the problem here is that it isn't clear as to whether the loan is to the Ignition Group or Elvertex Ltd.

    I would assume the loan is to Elvertex and the revenue is 1.7m


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    #17
    golfman
    Registered Users Posts: 317 ✭✭golfman


    Biketourer wrote: »
    I think the problem here is that it isn't clear as to whether the loan is to the Ignition Group or Elvertex Ltd.

    I would assume the loan is to Elvertex and the revenue is 1.7m

    So Ignition group is a business name attached to Elvertex Ltd. Those accounts are for Elvertex Ltd. So unless they've miraculously managed to more than triple revenue in a year I call bull**** on the claimed €5.5m turnover.


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    #18
    adam88
    Registered Users Posts: 1,599 ✭✭✭adam88


    Sorry for dredging up an old post. I’m a long term Linkedfinance lender but recently I’ve doscovered flender. Seems to be an easier interface to linked finance. Anyone got any experience with them


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    #19
    NIMAN
    Registered Users Posts: 32,976 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    I heard a story the other day on the radio about a company that defaulted on loans it got from P2P lending.

    In that case, wouldn't individuals lose out on their money they lent?


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    #20
    adam88
    Registered Users Posts: 1,599 ✭✭✭adam88


    That case you mention is being investigated by Gardai as possible fraud.


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    #21
    Sheep Shagger
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 6,216 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sheep Shagger


    Jamie Heaslip is involved...

    https://www.businessworld.ie/financial-news/Peer-to-peer-lending-platform-backed-by-Jamie-Heaslip-goes-from-strength-to-strength-571255.html


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  • Options
    #22
    gordongekko
    Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭gordongekko


    golfman wrote: »
    Where is the "financial snapshot"? This is my biggest bugbear. You essentially have to bet blindly relying on their analysis and very limited disclosure .

    EDIT: I just found it on the Salt by Ignition Group - Elvertex Ltd loan. Shockingly there is a huge difference in what they are showing in the snapshot and what they are saying in the write up!

    In the write up it says
    "Currently, the group are operating:

    -The Galleon Restaurant
    -Salt Restaurant and Bar
    -SALT@THEGLASSFACTORY and
    -SALT Events and Catering

    The existing turnover of the group is €5.5 Million."

    Then in the financial snapshot it shows a turnover of €1.7m
    This company ceased trading last week

    https://connachttribune.ie/concerns-over-future-of-long-established-galway-catering-company/


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