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Safety/emergency tip

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Comments

  • #32
    alps
    Registered Users Posts: 4,922 ✭✭✭alps


    You can have all the safety audits you want, it's about mindset, not necessarily facilities....

    The audit will not stop people walking under loaders, walking between the tractor and the wall, stomach tubing the calf in front of the cow, using the grinding disc without the goggles...


  • #33
    dzer2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,938 ✭✭✭dzer2


    alps wrote: »
    You can have all the safety audits you want, it's about mindset, not necessarily facilities....

    The audit will not stop people walking under loaders, walking between the tractor and the wall, stomach tubing the calf in front of the cow, using the grinding disc without the goggles...

    This is the culture I am talking about the change needs to be implemented with common place mentality. Its common sense really and a need to allocate the time properly. Loads of aged farmers around here slobbering until 10 at night but rarely ever doing anything before 8 in the morning.


  • #34
    Sam Kade
    Registered Users Posts: 12,313 ✭✭✭✭Sam Kade


    dzer2 wrote: »
    This is the culture I am talking about the change needs to be implemented with common place mentality. Its common sense really and a need to allocate the time properly. Loads of aged farmers around here slobbering until 10 at night but rarely ever doing anything before 8 in the morning.
    So if they start before 8am they will less likely have an accident?


  • #35
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,104 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Well, that's a 14 hour day.


  • #36
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,949 ✭✭✭emaherx


    Water John wrote: »
    Well, that's a 14 hour day.

    That has a lot to do with safety records on farms. Long days, farmers always on duty it's easy to get complacent.


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  • #37
    foxy farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,194 ✭✭✭foxy farmer


    dzer2 wrote: »
    Totally agree that the dept should hire an Independent safety company to audit all farms on safety.

    First 5 yrs should be allocated to getting farmers and workers up to date with the current laws and regs.

    After that a penalty for anyone that hasn't made a reasonable effort to improve.
    Deaths and serious injury needs to be reduced massively.


    It is a culture that needs replacing which will take time and money.

    I do an audit here every year with the young lads. We first talk about any incidents that happened that remains in the memory. We move on to walking around to see what looks like an accident waiting to happen.

    HSA is quite suitable. Why replicate their duties? No need for another money wasting organisation. Bord Bia are doing safety audits as it stands. Get the HSA out onto farms and let them wield a little power instead of the usual case where they carry out investigations after accidents.
    Oh yeah all the signs in the world plastered up around farm yards won't prevent people from having accidents.


  • #38
    ganmo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,748 ✭✭✭ganmo


    From some comments on here I think a lot of older farmers would be quite content to die on their farm, so how can we prevent those deaths?


  • #39
    Muckit
    Registered Users Posts: 11,174 ✭✭✭✭Muckit


    Every farmer has a responsibility to look after their own safety and the safety of their workers, but a genuine interest and commitment from the DAFM would be nice too. The farm safety scheme was a case in point. A minimum spend of over €2000 in order to apply. This ruled out a large number of small part time farmers straight away. I went ahead and carried out a number of safety measures on my own bat, but how many didn't?

    Health and safety checks would need to be viewed in a positive light. And any faults found should not be penalised without a sufficient time frame offered to farmer to rectify the situation.

    As someone else has also pointed out, it's as much about safe systems of work as faulty equipment. These are things that would not be picked up by an audit.

    Near misses are never recorded. Mores the pity. We only ever hear about the deaths.


  • #40
    kowtow
    Registered Users Posts: 6,135 ✭✭✭kowtow


    locky76 wrote:
    The biggest thing with health & safety is that it's very profitable for the farmer to implement as it dramatically reduces the chances of them getting injured therefore they can keep working away. I'd be interested in your thoughts.

    I'd have to disagree with you there, at least in terms of the way profits are understood on most irish farms.

    The culture encouraged on farms is to measure profits and costs in cash terms and mitigated future risks ... whilst economically valid.. are hardly a cash profit especially when we all assume that we can control the outcome.


  • #41
    Sam Kade
    Registered Users Posts: 12,313 ✭✭✭✭Sam Kade


    ganmo wrote: »
    From some comments on here I think a lot of older farmers would be quite content to die on their farm, so how can we prevent those deaths?

    Why do you single out older farmers?


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  • #42
    Sam Kade
    Registered Users Posts: 12,313 ✭✭✭✭Sam Kade


    emaherx wrote: »
    That has a lot to do with safety records on farms. Long days, farmers always on duty it's easy to get complacent.

    And then a wagon load of paper work on top of long days to add even more pressure.


  • #43
    ganmo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,748 ✭✭✭ganmo


    Sam Kade wrote: »
    Why do you single out older farmers?
    look at the age profile of this years deaths


  • #44
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,104 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    There seems to be the inevitable tendency, by some, to apply the apparent solution, that won't work.
    A bit of new thinking needed here.
    The solutions, used in an employer + employees situation, won't work here.


  • #45
    Dunedin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,219 ✭✭✭Dunedin


    alps wrote: »
    You can have all the safety audits you want, it's about mindset, not necessarily facilities....

    The audit will not stop people walking under loaders, walking between the tractor and the wall, stomach tubing the calf in front of the cow, using the grinding disc without the goggles...

    +1


  • #46
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,949 ✭✭✭emaherx


    Sam Kade wrote: »
    Why do you single out older farmers?

    Most at risk of accidents are the youngest and the oldest. We can educate our youngest farmers to be safe. The older ones tend to be less open to change.


  • #47
    einn32
    Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭einn32


    emaherx wrote: »
    Most at risk of accidents are the youngest and the oldest. We can educate our youngest farmers to be safe. The older ones tend to be less open to change.

    Doing a safety audit is a good idea. Set it on a repetitive basis maybe. Take an hour to walk the farm with an audit list. Think of it as important as checking stock etc. The HSA have printable ones. Might save injury/life. Influence younger generation.

    The older generation are a tough one. How do you teach an auld lad farming all his life that he's doing unsafe practices.


  • #48
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,104 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    The problem with older people often, is that waht they have always got away with, they can't any longer as they are slowing down in reaction time. Esp with stock.
    See the BIL with the bull. You could caution, all you like, just end up closing your eyes and hoping.

    Some also don't see the diff between bravery/cowardice and stupidity.


  • #49
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,468 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Good to see the topic getting aired again.

    One thing to remember is the ratio of injuries too. Fatalities are awful, but in general terms it's widely accepted that for every fatality there are ~10 "permanent life altering injuries, that would be lost limb, lost eye sight, paralysis etc, there would be ~100 "lost day cases" where through a minor injury the person was unable to work for one or more days.

    A simple walk round mightn't see anything that would cause a fatality, but who knows, you might save some fellas eye or even prevent a broken finger. It all adds up to a better working environment.


  • #50
    lakill Farm
    Registered Users Posts: 4,735 ✭✭✭lakill Farm


    I bought an A frame on Saturday along with a weight box for the back of the tractor. Reduce chance of crush injuries when putting on implements on A frame and weight box to reduce chance or flipping the tractor


  • #51
    onrail
    Registered Users Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭onrail


    From experiences in the construction industry it's fear of financial penalties that drive change in 95% of cases. Very few construction workers honestly believe that wearing a hardhat, attending the SafePass etc actually reduces risk of injury or death.

    Nevertheless, such a fear has lead to a significant reduction in injuries/fatalities in the sector.

    Likewise, a change in farming will (unfortunately) need to be driven by fear of repercussions.

    Carry out unannounced DAFM/HSA spot-inspections, provide a reasonable timeframe for correction, enlist the assistance of Teagasc/Ag. advisors if necessary. Enforce penalties for non-compliance.

    A cynical approach - but something needs to be done


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  • #52
    lakill Farm
    Registered Users Posts: 4,735 ✭✭✭lakill Farm


    I think a lot of farmers now think you cant take a p1ss outside without needing a course and special pass.

    as some other poster said about the safety grants that were introduced a few years ago. You could get a grant on a weighbridge but not on a PTO shaft or chainsaw PPE . explain that to me?

    also the likes of VAT58 should be allowed on rewiring sheds with modern wiring. And replacing dangerous roofs and gutters. at least 1 or 2 farmers die yearly falling off/through a roof.

    instead of giving 40/60% grants on slurry tankers with dribble bars etc why didn't they do a similar safety grant on lazy arm fillers. save loads of backs and injuries around PTO shafts.





    onrail wrote: »
    From experiences in the construction industry it's fear of financial penalties that drive change in 95% of cases. Very few construction workers honestly believe that wearing a hardhat, attending the SafePass etc actually reduces risk of injury or death.

    Nevertheless, such a fear has lead to a significant reduction in injuries/fatalities in the sector.

    Likewise, a change in farming will (unfortunately) need to be driven by fear of repercussions.

    Carry out unannounced DAFM/HSA spot-inspections, provide a reasonable timeframe for correction, enlist the assistance of Teagasc/Ag. advisors if necessary. Enforce penalties for non-compliance.

    A cynical approach - but something needs to be done


  • #53
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,468 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    lakill Farm wrote: »
    I think a lot of farmers now think you cant take a p1ss outside without needing a course and special pass.

    as some other poster said about the safety grants that were introduced a few years ago. You could get a grant on a weighbridge but not on a PTO shaft or chainsaw PPE . explain that to me?

    also the likes of VAT58 should be allowed on rewiring sheds with modern wiring. And replacing dangerous roofs and gutters. at least 1 or 2 farmers die yearly falling off/through a roof.

    instead of giving 40/60% grants on slurry tankers with dribble bars etc why didn't they do a similar safety grant on lazy arm fillers. save loads of backs and injuries around PTO shafts.


    Well said...
    the system shouldnt jup to a beating stick without first trying the carrot approach first..


  • #54
    quietsailor
    Registered Users Posts: 1,428 ✭✭✭quietsailor


    ganmo wrote: »
    On iphones ya can access ice numbers from the unlock screen once they've been set using the health app

    Just came across this thread and wanted to add;

    I've recently set this up on an Android phone - even if the phone is locked and the screen has turned off once you activate the screen a list of my ICE numbers starts scrolling across the screen.

    The best way to set this up is to run a google search of --"Your phone name how to set up ICE contacts" - for me it was "Sony Xperia Z1 how to set up ICE contacts"

    It might never be needed but it is a nice safety item to have and costs nothing

    Edit - just googled this myself and it turns out you can on some phones set it so the emergency servces can directly dial your ICE contacts off your phone to make contact with them,
    You can also set it up so that any crucial health info si displayed eg, name of your doctor, allergies etc


  • #55
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,615 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    Water John wrote: »
    The problem with older people often, is that waht they have always got away with, they can't any longer as they are slowing down in reaction time. Esp with stock.
    See the BIL with the bull. You could caution, all you like, just end up closing your eyes and hoping.

    Some also don't see the diff between bravery/cowardice and stupidity.

    Have to agree. I took 3 bulls to the factory earlier this week. There was an old lad 75-80 in the que behind me. I think he was in a hurry, so he was directing me as I reversed to the lairage. Then he was at the far side of the trailer as I was letting them off.

    2 bulls hopped out of the trailer, I turned around to poke the 3rd bull out of the trailer, yer man was in the passage following the first 2 bulls. I let a shout at him as the 3rd bull ran past him from behind. So easily could have been flattened. Lucky escape, he might not be so lucky next time.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #56
    Muckit
    Registered Users Posts: 11,174 ✭✭✭✭Muckit


    And you know if anything had happened the story would go that you were to blame!! :D

    Lads that age are a death trap around stock. Like a drunk driver they still think they've their full faculties.


  • #57
    freedominacup
    Registered Users Posts: 7,920 ✭✭✭freedominacup


    Muckit wrote: »
    And you know if anything had happened the story would go that you were to blame!! :D

    Lads that age are a death trap around stock. Like a drunk driver they still think they've their full faculties.

    It's also a survivability thing. Older bodies can't cope with trauma as well as younger ones. This according to hsa inspector who inspected here a few years ago.


  • #58
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,615 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    Mod note; Ok the month is up, I'm going to unstick this and move it into the safety and off season part of the forum when it disappears off the front page.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1642

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #59
    rangler1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,497 ✭✭✭rangler1


    freedominacup wrote: »
    It's also a survivability thing. Older bodies can't cope with trauma as well as younger ones. This according to hsa inspector who inspected here a few years ago.

    Young or old there's no one around to tell the farmer what to do so he chances it, the reason there's more old people killed is because there's more old farmers so statistically more older ones will be killed.
    The old guy that died on the quad a month ago did just that......died on the quad, and then hit the fence, is that a farm accident or do we keep pensioners inside.
    Nothing is going to change, you're out there on your own thinking of what you're going to be doing later so accidents will happen, you're boss and labourer in the one person


  • #60
    Attie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 495 ✭✭Attie


    ICE phone numbers
    Useful phone numbers when in trouble.


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